On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 13:31:58 -0700, Rod Speed wrote
(in article <5edbe0F36tc63U1@mid.individual.net>):

> George Graves <gmgraves2@comcast.net> wrote
>> Rod Speed wrote
>>> George Graves <gmgraves2@comcast.net> wrote
>>>> Michelle Steiner wrote
>>>>> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
>
>>>>>>>>> OK, exactly what are iTunes' failings?
>
>>>>>>>> Its not very intuitive when loading the ipod with mp3
>>>>>>>> you already have on the computer for example.
>
>>>>>>> Explain, please.
>
>>>>>> I already did. Its much more intuitive for the ipod to appear
>>>>>> as a drive and to use the normal file manager interface you
>>>>>> are already used to than a special purpose app.
>
>>>>> No it isn't.
>
>>>>>>>> And what applications do those things better?
>
>>>>>>>> Its rather more intuitive to just drag and drop those mp3s
>>>>>>>> etc you already have to a drive which is the media player.
>
>>>>>>> That's one option you have with iTunes.
>
>>>>>> Not with the file manager you use for everything else.
>
>>>>> And that file manager can't play music. Let's see, with your
>>>>> preferred method, you use one application to download music,
>>>>> another to play it, another to copy it to the iPod, and another
>>>>> to burn it to CDs. I, on the other hand, use iTunes for all of
>>>>> those functions in one easy to use, intuitive, integrated application.
>
>>>> I think we've found ourselves another cross-posting Apple hater Michelle.
>
>>> Not a shred of evidence that you are actually capable of thought.
>
>> Ah, so now we degenerate into name calling.
>
> Nope, you did. No name calling there, except by you.

Where did I call you a name? I said that you seemed to be an Apple hater
(from your posts) but that's hardly personal rancor.

>>> So stupid it cant even work out that I didnt crosspost, I
>>> just left the original crossposting in place, just like you did.
>
>> I didn't look, sorry about that, but why the personal rancor?
>
> Might just have been triggered by your juvenile name calling.

Again, what name calling? I have called you by no name.

>>>> Apple's way is no good because it's ...well....Apples way.
>
>>> Wrong again. Its just much more intuitive for a device to
>>> showup as just another drive, and be able to use the device
>>> just like any other device when loading and unloading it.
>
>> That's a matter of opinion, don't you think?
>
> Nope. Matter of fact that allowing BOTH types of access is by definition
> more intuitive than a single special purpose app for access to the device.
>
>> Anyway, its not mine.
>
> Your problem.

Not a problem, just a different opinion.

>
>> There are things that I would change in iTunes, sure, but overall,
>> its the best integrated app of its kind that I've seen so far.
>
> You need to get out more.
>
> And treating the device as a drive is much more intuitive than any app can
be.

I disagree
>
>>> Sure, include a dedicated app for the stupids who dont even
>>> know what a drive is, but let those who do know what a drive
>>> is deal with the device just like any other drive if they want to.
>
>> You can do that with an iPod is you wish.
>
> Not easily by just plugging the iPod in and using it as a drive you cant.
>
>> See Apple gives you the choice. But believe me,
>> its a lot harder without iTunes than it is with it.
>
> No it isnt when its properly implemented as a drive.

I'm sorry, all things considered, I simply don't see it.
>
>>>> Any other way is better because it's ... well, ... not Apple's way.
>
>>> Just another mindless Apple bigot.
>
>> Seems to be the attitude that you are projecting in this thread.
>
> Then you need to get your seems machinery seen to.
>
>>> Even someone as stupid as you
>
>> Again, why the personal rancor?
>
> Again, might just have been triggered by your juvenile name calling.

I called you no name.
>
>> I've not called you any names have I?
>
> Corse you did, you called me 'another cross-posting Apple hater'

I "CHARACTERIZED" you as 'another cross posting Apple hater', I didn't call
you one. Even so, responding by calling me stupid, bigoted, incapable of
thought is hardly the same as characterizing someone as having a certain
opinion (Apple hater) based upon their own words.

>>> should be able to have a look at my posting history and see that
>>> I hardly ever make any comment about Apple, and that when I
>>> do, I have said that the ipod particularly is a very decent product,
>>> albeit with some real downsides with iTunes particularly.
>
>> Frankly, up until a few days ago, I don't remember seeing your name at all.
>
> Irrelevant to my history in groups you dont read.

But relevant enough when you call me stupid because I haven't checked your
posting history.

>>> Its not a particularly intuitive app, even if you ignore the
>>> fact that you cant treat the ipod as just another drive.
>
> Try getting something out of an ipod and
> putting it in another media player for starters.

I can do it for stuff that I've ripped from my own CD collection, not from
stuff bought from Apple's Music Store.


>
>>>>>>>>>>> But the iPod has the best UI of any portable
>>>>>>>>>>> media player extant--until Friday, that is.
>
>>>>> Right here, we're talking about the iPod
>
>>>>>>>>>> Nope, plenty of cellphones leave it for dead, essentially
>>>>>>>>>> because they integrate the media player with other capability.
>
>>>>> Gee, right here, you're changing it to cell phones.
>
>>>>>>>>> The iPod isn't a cell phone; how can you compare the two?
>
>>>>>>>> Those others combined those functions long before the iphone
>>>>>>>> ever showed up.
>
>>>>> And here you're talking about cell phones
>>>>> again, still in response to the iPod interface.
>
>>>>>>> Huh? We were talking about the iPod.
>
>>>>>> Nope, we're talking about media players.
>
>>>>> And now, you're talking about media players.
>
>>>>>> Nope, we're talking about media players.
>
>>>>>>> But even though they did those functions before the iPhone ever
>>>>>>> showed up doesn't mean that they do it better than the iPhone.
>
>>>>>> They do anyway when the device is just another drive visible on the
>>>>>> computer.
>
>>>>>>> Heck, Verizon's phones don't do it at all--you can't download
>>>>>>> music from the computer to the phone, period.
>
>>>>>> Irrelevant to what hordes of phones can do in that regard.
>
>>>>> But we were talking about one of the reasons I'm planning to switch from
>>>>> Verizon.
>
>>>>>>> Apple did it with their very first phone; you can't get any faster
>>>>>>> than that.
>
>>>>>> Corse you can, you dont have to lag the rest of the market so dismally.
>
>>>>> Oh, so you're saying that Apple should have produced a cell phone years
>>>>> ago?
>
>>>>>>> I see; all those other MP3 players that were on the market before
>>>>>>> the iPod made no impression on them?
>
>>>>>> Those that were suckers for the ipod, no they didnt.
>
>>>>> 70% of those who have bought MP3 players are suckers?
>
>>>>>>> And then when the iPod came out, they started screaming at Apple
>>>>>>> to make it work with Windows (which the iPod originally didn't
>>>>>>> do) because it was, by God, an *Apple*, whose computers they
>>>>>>> refused to buy.
>
>>>>>> Nope, they ignored them until they could be used with what they had.
>
>>>>> If they hadn't shown an interest in wanting an iPod, Apple wouldn't
>>>>> have made the iPod compatible with Windows in the first place. But
>>>>> even if you're right, that means that people who had avoided both
>>>>> Apple and MP3 players in droves suddenly swarmed to get iPods
>>>>> because Apple made the iPod available for Windows? Do you realize
>>>>> how senseless your thesis is?
>
>>>>> I'll tell you one thing, though; if the iPhone won't do voice
>>>>> dialing and if it won't upload its address book to my car (which
>>>>> has Bluetooth capability for cell phones), I won't buy one. If it
>>>>> does one, but not the other, I'll have to decide.
>
>>>> It won't surprise me if it doesn't do one or the other.
>
>>> Me neither, and when so many of its competitive products do
>>> both, AND allow the device to be used just like any other drive...
>
>>>> Rarely do I buy a technology product (or even a computer application)
>>>> that will
>>>> do everything I would put in it had I designed it. I suspect we're all
>>>> that way
>
>>> Pity that the functionality she wants is there in the competitive
>>> products. With a real keyboard too, which is much better for email.
>
>>> AND the competitive products allow you to add 3rd party
>>> apps to do what the product itself doesnt come with too.
>
>>> Yes, many of the stupids dont enhance their device with 3rd party
>>> apps, but anyone with a clue does when some functionality is missing.
>
>> Name calling again.
>
> Corse you never ever do anything like that yourself, eh ?

Not to anybody who tries to carry on an intelligent debate, and I haven't
called you any names.

>> I don't get it.
>
> Your problem.

Its yours too IF you wish to go on debating with me. Of course if you don't
care, there's always the kill-file.