Just posted - The very first reviews of the new iPhone, great reading....
1) David Pogue -
One year and 11 days ago, our nation was swept by iPhone Mania. TV news
coverage was relentless. Hard-core fans camped out to be the first in
line. Bloggers referred to Apple¹s new product as the ³Jesus phone.²
It was a stunning black slab of glass: a cellphone, a brilliant music
and video player and the best pocket Internet terminal the world had
ever seen. The huge, bright, touch-sensitive screen made it addictive
fun to rotate, page through or magnify your photos, videos and Web pages.
Today, the iPhone is in the hands of six million people. Clumsy
touch-screen lookalikes from rival phone makers line the shelves.
Apple Inc.¹s iPhone has been the world¹s most influential smart phone
since its debut a year ago, widely hailed for its beauty and
functionality. It was a true hand-held computer that raised the bar for
all its competitors. But that first iPhone had two big drawbacks: It was
expensive, and it couldn¹t access the fastest cellular-phone networks.
On Friday, Apple is launching a second-generation iPhone, called the
iPhone 3G, which addresses both of those problems, while retaining the
look and feel of the first model¹s hardware and software.
David Pogue / NYTimes
- Sound is much improved. "In fact, few cellphones sound this good."
- Feels better in your hand due to the curved back
- "According to Apple, the iPhone¹s G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
example."
- No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
- "the really big deal is the iPhone 2.0 software and the App Store
Walt Mossberg
- "it mostly keeps its promises."
- "more capable version of an already excellent device"
- Battery drained much more quickly using 3G, as expected
- Greatly improved audio, much louder speaker
- Data speeds 3-5x faster than original iPhone
- Better voice coverage with 3G. "At my neighborhood shopping center,
where the first iPhone got little or no AT&T service, the iPhone 3G
registered strong coverage."
Edward Baig / USA Today
- "iPhone 3G: The Sequel, is worth the wait."
- Still no recording video, no stereo bluetooth or voice dialing
- Supports PowerPoint attachments; mass move or delete multiple e-mail
messages
- 10-30 seconds to load popular websites on 3G.
- GPS was very accurate
- Speaker sounded better for both speakerphone and music.
- "started receiving low battery warnings toward the end of a busy work
day; I found myself charging the device overnight, the same as with the
older iPhone."
> > > Just posted - The very first reviews of the new iPhon
> >
> > Why do you think this is relevant to alt.cellular.nokia?
>
> proly cuz lots of nokia users are interested in the iphone, that's why.
If so, then they can read the groups relevant to the iPhone, rather than
have to deal with your pathetic, irrelevant, fanboi crossposting.
And "proly cuz"? Really? Your ridiculous posts betray your lack of
experience, but do you have to type like a 13 year-old IM-ing his
classmates?
At 09 Jul 2008 01:11:10 -0600 David Moyer wrote:
> Quick synopsis of the first 3 reviews:
>
> David Pogue / NYTimes
> - Sound is much improved. "In fact, few cellphones sound this good."
> - Feels better in your hand due to the curved back
> - "According to Apple, the iPhone¹s G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
> emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
> example."
Huh? There are lipstick-sized bluetooth GPS modules on keychains. The
"antenna isn't too small," the software just isn't there.
> - No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
In article <g51pfo$k02$1@aioe.org>, Todd Allcock
<elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> > - "According to Apple, the iPhone¹s G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
> > emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
> > example."
>
> Huh? There are lipstick-sized bluetooth GPS modules on keychains. The
> "antenna isn't too small," the software just isn't there.
yea, that one makes no sense.
> > - No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
>
> Oh well, there's always iPhone 3.0, right?
third parties have already demoed voice dialing, video recording and
mms. perhaps bluetooth stereo could be added in firmware, although i
do not think it's at the top of the list.
In article <g51pfo$k02$1@aioe.org>,
Todd Allcock <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> > - "According to Apple, the iPhone¹s G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
> > emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
> > example."
>
> Huh? There are lipstick-sized bluetooth GPS modules on keychains. The
> "antenna isn't too small," the software just isn't there.
> > - No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
>
> Oh well, there's always iPhone 3.0, right?
or, more likely, a simple update when the app is done. kinda like the
did with the itunes store. i guess google earth is coming too, that'll
be interesting with a multi-touch screen.
also quite decent - a sneak peek into the 2.0 software:
I can't tell you how we got ahold of a first-generation iPhone loaded
with version 2.0 of the iPhone operating system. What I can tell you is
that if I do reveal this information, homicidal ninjas will come to my
house and kill my family. Nevertheless, we do have one -- and we were
able to take a look inside and find a few minute yet interesting
changes. Here's a preview of some of the ways in which iPhone 2.0
differs from iPhone 1.0.
iPhone 2.0, of course, is the operating system that will come
preinstalled on iPhone 3G models when those start shipping on Friday,
July 11. iPhone 2.0 will also be available as a free software upgrade to
people who have first-generation iPhones.
In the photo of the iPhone home screen, above, you'll notice at least
two differences from the first-generation OS: there's a new Contacts
application (on the old phone, contacts were accessible only via the
"Phone" icon), and the long-awaited App Store is there (that's where
you'll buy new iPhone-native software and games).
In article <davmoy-9D587D.00023309072008@news.qwest.net>, davmoy@world.com
says...
> In article <MPG.22de5c42e44d68b989841@news.individual.net>,
> Jim Mason <jim.mason@removethisukonline.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > > Just posted - The very first reviews of the new iPhon
> >
> > Why do you think this is relevant to alt.cellular.nokia?
>
> proly cuz lots of nokia users are interested in the iphone, that's why.
Then I am sure they would subscribe to the relevant group then?
David Moyer wrote:
> In article <MPG.22de5c42e44d68b989841@news.individual.net>,
> Jim Mason <jim.mason@removethisukonline.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>> Just posted - The very first reviews of the new iPhon
>> Why do you think this is relevant to alt.cellular.nokia?
>
> proly cuz lots of nokia users are interested in the iphone, that's why.
You just don't understand. The fanbois whose entire existence is defined
by an electronic device think it is so important (in their minds) that
they need to "convert" everyone else even if they could care less.
"nospam" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:090720080057320236%nospam@nospam.invalid...
> In article <g51pfo$k02$1@aioe.org>, Todd Allcock
> <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
>
>> > - "According to Apple, the iPhone¹s G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
>> > emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
>> > example."
>>
>> Huh? There are lipstick-sized bluetooth GPS modules on keychains. The
>> "antenna isn't too small," the software just isn't there.
>
> yea, that one makes no sense.
Agreed. The sad part is when a technology JOURNALIST like Pogue lets crap
like that slide, and accepts it at face value. I'm not necessarily picking
on Apple here, either. I have a hard time believing Apple said anything of
the sort- I suspect Pogue misunderstood/miswrote whatever he was trying to
convey.
>> > - No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
>>
>> Oh well, there's always iPhone 3.0, right?
>
> third parties have already demoed voice dialing, video recording and
> mms. perhaps bluetooth stereo could be added in firmware, although i
> do not think it's at the top of the list.
I wouldn't be surprised if third parties address the stereo AD2P situation
as well- many Windows Mobile-based devices received their first AD2P
profiles via third-party hacks.
While I rarely agree with Oxford about anything, he's correct that the most
important single advancement to the iPhone this coming Friday will not be
GPS, 3G or the new iPhone hardware itself, but the app store and it's
ability to deliver third party apps to all iPhones without Jailbreaking or
hacking. Friday the iPhone actually becomes what both the fanbois and
journalists have claimed it to be all along, but which it fell far short of
in reality- a mobile computing platform.
No company's "vision," not even Apple's, can anticipate all uses actual
USERS will have for a device, and as Windows Mobile, Palm, Symbian and RIM
developers have shown us, smartphones can be used for a myriad of things
their inventors NEVER anticipated!
Apple, with the iPhone's original release, made the same mistake Windows
Mobile and Palm did originally- envision these devices as peripherals
dependent on a desktop computer "mothership" as the source of all apps, PIM
data, files, etc. The original concept were that these devices were
portable "file viewers" that you used to take your PCs files with you in a
smaller package. When third-party developers pushed the limits of what
these devices could do, even the manufacturers woke up and realized that
they could also be used as mobile computers independent of an umbilical cord
tying them to a desktop PC.
To Apple's credit, it only took them one year to figure this out, rather
than the six or seven it took Microsoft to realize it! ;-) It'll be
interesting to see what developers can wring out of the iPhone's impressive
hardware, other than the plethora of recipe filing, biorhythm calculating,
calorie counting, etc. programs that amateur mobile developers seem to think
the world always needs one more of! ;-) Hopefully Dataviz (who made some
noise on their blog a few months ago about the fesability of developing for
Apple) will port their excellent Palm Docs-to-Go mobile office suite to the
iPhone and allow viewing/editing of Office documents on the phone itself, if
only so my buddy doesn't have to e-mail himself a pile of Word docs each
time he leaves for Europe!
Hello Oxford, I see that you are using a new pen name.
On Wed, 9 Jul 2008, David Moyer posted:
> - Sound is much improved. "In fact, few cellphones sound this good."
Golly gee, this is from the same Oxford who insisted that 3G was useless
and that Steve Jobs destroyed its future. Of course, those of us who have
used 3G for many years knew quite well that 3G had better sound quality.
> - "According to Apple, the iPhone's G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
> emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
> example."
Golly gee, I have that function on my GPS-enabled cell phone, as does just
about every user of a cell phone in Japan.
> - No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
Golly gee, I have those functions on my cell phones.
> - "the really big deal is the iPhone 2.0 software and the App Store
Golly gee, just like what people on all other phones have had for many
years. Too bad it is crippled like Verizon's GetItNow, instead of being
open the way it is on Windows Mobile and any Java phone.
> - "it mostly keeps its promises."
Golly gee, "mostly"? Talk about damning with faint praise.
> - Battery drained much more quickly using 3G, as expected
Golly gee, my Japanese 3G phone doesn't drain "much more quickly" using
3G. 3G is only about a 25% hit over GSM for talk time. In standby, it
lasts longer in 3G.
> - Data speeds 3-5x faster than original iPhone
Golly gee, this is from the same Oxford who insisted that 3G was useless
and that Steve Jobs destroyed its future. Of course, those of us who have
used 3G for many years knew quite well that 3G had faster data speeds.
> - Still no recording video, no stereo bluetooth or voice dialing
Golly gee, I have those functions on my cell phones.
> - "started receiving low battery warnings toward the end of a busy work
> day; I found myself charging the device overnight, the same as with the
> older iPhone."
Golly gee, it's too bad that you can't buy a spare or extended battery on
iPhone the way that you can on real cell phones.
-- Mark --
http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.
David Moyer wrote:
> also quite decent - a sneak peek into the 2.0 software:
>
> I can't tell you how we got ahold of a first-generation iPhone loaded
> with version 2.0 of the iPhone operating system. What I can tell you
> is that if I do reveal this information, homicidal ninjas will come
> to my house and kill my family. Nevertheless, we do have one -- and
> we were able to take a look inside and find a few minute yet
> interesting changes. Here's a preview of some of the ways in which
> iPhone 2.0 differs from iPhone 1.0.
>
> iPhone 2.0, of course, is the operating system that will come
> preinstalled on iPhone 3G models when those start shipping on Friday,
> July 11. iPhone 2.0 will also be available as a free software upgrade
> to people who have first-generation iPhones.
>
> In the photo of the iPhone home screen, above, you'll notice at least
> two differences from the first-generation OS: there's a new Contacts
> application (on the old phone, contacts were accessible only via the
> "Phone" icon), and the long-awaited App Store is there (that's where
> you'll buy new iPhone-native software and games).
>
> And now, to the details...
>
> http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2008/0...ive-sneak.html
It will be interesting to see if the draw/demand is there, like with the
first one.
My interest was in the Exchange active sync email (push) support,
but I think I read that it does not work when the link is "https"... which
is the normal setup.
Also - with respect to GSM vs CDMA -
It looks like Verizon might be heading away from CDMA EVDO data
and towards the GSM data world of LTE.
> It will be interesting to see if the draw/demand is there, like with the
> first one.
The new lower pricing will assure that.
> My interest was in the Exchange active sync email (push) support,
> but I think I read that it does not work when the link is "https"...
which
> is the normal setup.
I find it hard to believe it won't handle secure Exchange servers, but
we'll see, I guess...
> Also - with respect to GSM vs CDMA -
> It looks like Verizon might be heading away from CDMA EVDO data
> and towards the GSM data world of LTE.
That will allow (future) interoperability with the networks of Verizon's
foreign masters at Vodaphone. It makes perfect sense that carriers would
migrate to a uniform voice/data standard eventually, via system upades,
without having to tear down and replace existing infrastructure.
As to the "CDMA vs. GSM" thing, Verizon won't be "switching" from CDMA to
GSM- LTE will be a 4G data overlay on their current CDMA network, much like
WCDMA (UMTS, GSM's 3G system) was an overlay on the 2G GSM system.
Verizon's LTE will let future 4G international phone owners with the
correct frequency bands roam in the US on Verizon's otherwise incompatible
network the same way some GSM 3G phones with the right bands can roam on
the 3G overlay of Japan's otherwise incompatible CDMA networks.
In article <alpine.OSX.1.10.0807091112520.1537@pangtzu.panda. com>, Mark
Crispin <mrc@Panda.COM> wrote:
> > - "According to Apple, the iPhone's G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
> > emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
> > example."
>
> Golly gee, I have that function on my GPS-enabled cell phone, as does just
> about every user of a cell phone in Japan.
tomtom announced their software, and it would be surprising if it
didn't do turn by turn.
> > - No voice dialing, video recording, Bluetooth stereo, MMS
>
> Golly gee, I have those functions on my cell phones.
three of those have been announced already.
> > - Still no recording video, no stereo bluetooth or voice dialing
>
> Golly gee, I have those functions on my cell phones.
you already pointed those out, and other than the stereo bluetooth,
they exist or will exist.
> > - "started receiving low battery warnings toward the end of a busy work
> > day; I found myself charging the device overnight, the same as with the
> > older iPhone."
>
> Golly gee, it's too bad that you can't buy a spare or extended battery on
> iPhone the way that you can on real cell phones.
there are extended batteries available. most people only have one
battery with their cellphones, so in the grand scheme of things, it's
not a big deal that the battery can't be swapped on the fly. of
course, for someone who needs extended periods of battery use, then the
iphone might not be the best choice.
In article <g52s92$hkl$1@aioe.org>, Todd Allcock
<elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> I wouldn't be surprised if third parties address the stereo AD2P situation
> as well- many Windows Mobile-based devices received their first AD2P
> profiles via third-party hacks.
i'm not sure third parties can add bluetooth profiles, but if they can,
all the better.
> No company's "vision," not even Apple's, can anticipate all uses actual
> USERS will have for a device, and as Windows Mobile, Palm, Symbian and RIM
> developers have shown us, smartphones can be used for a myriad of things
> their inventors NEVER anticipated!
very true. some of the stuff that's been announced and/or demoed looks
quite interesting.
> To Apple's credit, it only took them one year to figure this out, rather
> than the six or seven it took Microsoft to realize it! ;-)
i think apple figured it out long before that (like when they announced
web apps and people laughed). it takes time to put together an sdk,
the documentation, the apps store and the infrastructure to support it
all.
> It'll be
> interesting to see what developers can wring out of the iPhone's impressive
> hardware, other than the plethora of recipe filing, biorhythm calculating,
> calorie counting, etc. programs that amateur mobile developers seem to think
> the world always needs one more of! ;-)
one good thing about the way the apps store works is that there will be
a lot less crap. however, i'm not so sure the central distribution
method can scale as the device gains popularity.
David Moyer <davmoy@world.com> wrote in news:davmoy-03A09D.01111009072008
@news.qwest.net:
> - "According to Apple, the iPhoneûs G.P.S. antenna is much too small to
> emulate the turn-by-turn navigation of a G.P.S. unit for a vehicle, for
> example."
>
Biggest crock of horseshit I've seen yet over this PoS.....(c;
"Todd Allcock" <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in
news:g52s92$hkl$1@aioe.org:
> I wouldn't be surprised if third parties address the stereo AD2P
> situation as well- many Windows Mobile-based devices received their
> first AD2P profiles via third-party hacks.
>
While I'm reading this, I'm listening to 60's Carolina Beach Music on my
Motorola S9 playing MP3s on the microSD card in my MotoROKR Z6m.
I used the super sophisticated Windows Explorer custom software from
Windoze XP in click and drag mode to copy them from the G:\MP3\Beach Music
directory to the \Beach directory on the tiny microSD card pluged into an
SD adapter. 183 files copied to the card with no further intervention.
I then, quite unceremoniously, pulled the card out of the adapter and
plugged it into the top of the tiny phone.
Completely unknown to Motorola, who could really give a shit, these MP3
files play quite loudly with fantastic base in the rubber headphones,
drowning out the screams from my large parrots trying to get my attention
so I'll go give them a monkey biscuit treat they like in the late
afternoon.
No 3rd party software installed or crashed or crashed the pitiful operating
system in the ROKR playing these files or the Jimmy Buffett songs the ROKR
found in other directories.
Why can't a $600 FruitFone play beach music in these headphones this loud?
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in news:090720081433537611% nospam@nospam.invalid:
> i'm not sure third parties can add bluetooth profiles, but if they can,
> all the better.
>
>
Next thing you know, you FruitFoners will want someone to install Bluetooth
Private Area Networking so you can steal music and movies off the 32GB SDHC
cards in my N800 over BT PAN or OBEX or FTP.
How awful....
You should be ashamed going behind Steve's back like that after all he
hasn't done for you!
David Moyer <davmoy@world.com> wrote in news:davmoy-926A85.02152109072008
@news.qwest.net:
> or, more likely, a simple update when the app is done. kinda like the
> did with the itunes store. i guess google earth is coming too, that'll
> be interesting with a multi-touch screen.
>
>
Man it's SO cool, especially in 3D! Come see for yourself!
In article <Xns9AD6BC284C2B7noonehomecom@208.49.80.253>, Larry
<noone@home.com> wrote:
> nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in news:090720081433517514%
> nospam@nospam.invalid:
>
> > iphone might not be the best choice.
>
> You got that right, Bo!
way to go taking it out of context.
for some people it's not the best choice. for others it is.
> > I wouldn't be surprised if third parties address the stereo AD2P
> > situation
> > as well- many Windows Mobile-based devices received their first AD2P
> > profiles via third-party hacks.
>
> i'm not sure third parties can add bluetooth profiles, but if they can,
> all the better.
You're probably right- it might not work via the official SDK/app store
model- that might be something best left to the "Jailbreakers." ;-)
> > To Apple's credit, it only took them one year to figure this out,
> > rather than the six or seven it took Microsoft to realize it! ;-)
>
> i think apple figured it out long before that (like when they announced
> web apps and people laughed). it takes time to put together an sdk,
> the documentation, the apps store and the infrastructure to support it
> all.
Yeah, I was being tongue-in-cheek, or at least cheeky, anyway...
> > It'll be
> > interesting to see what developers can wring out of the iPhone's
> > impressive hardware, other than the plethora of recipe filing,
> > biorhythm calculating, calorie counting, etc. programs that
> > amateur mobile developers seem to think the world always needs
> > one more of! ;-)
>
> one good thing about the way the apps store works is that there will be
> a lot less crap. however, i'm not so sure the central distribution
> method can scale as the device gains popularity.
It manages to deliver an impressive number of songs- I'm sure it can handle
a few thousand apps! I suspect the app store will be a work in progress,
perhaps giving "premium" shelf space to known developers or popular
downloads, much like eBay offers "featured listings" for an additional
cost. I wouldn't expect some unknown author's "Hello World" app to get the
same consideration as Tom Tom's GPS software, for example, which would be a
good thing- many mobile software distributors, like Handango, are difficult
to navigate unless you know your desired app by name or developer, due to
the hundreds of cheesy "me too" apps cluttering up every software category.
(This reminds me of a guy who hangs out on the WinMo usenet groups who has
single-handely written over 5,000 free WinMo "apps" over the last several
years- mostly nearly-identical database apps differing only by title and
subject- i.e. a stamp collecting "app", coin collecting "app", VCR tape
database, DVD database, etc. No one has the heart to tell him that one
general purpose database app- or even a spreadsheet- would replace almost
his entire library!) ;-)
In article <g53ffa$b38$1@aioe.org>, Todd Allcock
<elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> > i'm not sure third parties can add bluetooth profiles, but if they can,
> > all the better.
>
> You're probably right- it might not work via the official SDK/app store
> model- that might be something best left to the "Jailbreakers." ;-)
maybe, but that hasn't happened with the current model. it could be
that not too many people are interested, or that it's just not worth
the effort.
> > one good thing about the way the apps store works is that there will be
> > a lot less crap. however, i'm not so sure the central distribution
> > method can scale as the device gains popularity.
>
> It manages to deliver an impressive number of songs- I'm sure it can handle
> a few thousand apps!
except songs don't need to be submitted for evaluation. it's not clear
to me how apple is going to manage a huge onslaught of apps being
submitted.
> I suspect the app store will be a work in progress,
no doubt it will be. the ad-hoc method of distribution will probably
grow into something less centralized and more useful to everyone.
> perhaps giving "premium" shelf space to known developers or popular
> downloads, much like eBay offers "featured listings" for an additional
> cost. I wouldn't expect some unknown author's "Hello World" app to get the
> same consideration as Tom Tom's GPS software, for example, which would be a
> good thing- many mobile software distributors, like Handango, are difficult
> to navigate unless you know your desired app by name or developer, due to
> the hundreds of cheesy "me too" apps cluttering up every software category.
that works both ways. having a level playing field, where anyone can
write the next killer app and not just big companies with money, is
great. if a company can buy their way to the front screen of the apps
store, then it's not so level anymore.
> (This reminds me of a guy who hangs out on the WinMo usenet groups who has
> single-handely written over 5,000 free WinMo "apps" over the last several
> years- mostly nearly-identical database apps differing only by title and
> subject- i.e. a stamp collecting "app", coin collecting "app", VCR tape
> database, DVD database, etc. No one has the heart to tell him that one
> general purpose database app- or even a spreadsheet- would replace almost
> his entire library!) ;-)
On Wed, 9 Jul 2008 11:26:44 -0700, Mark Crispin <mrc@Panda.COM> wrote:
>
>Golly gee, my Japanese 3G phone doesn't drain "much more quickly" using
>3G. 3G is only about a 25% hit over GSM for talk time. In standby, it
>lasts longer in 3G.
I realize that you've got other stuff going on in your post,
but I'd like to ask about your phone.
I ask because I'm taking the iPhone seriously, but I'm not an
Apple fan or anything like that. I'm taking it seriously because it is
the only phone available to me here in NYC, to the best of my
knowledge, that will finally allow me to access and input data in
Japanese.
I've been investigating Palm, Win Mob, RIM devices for ages
now, and it's been totally frustrating.
May I ask both where you're posting from and what
instrument/network you're using?
In article <FcqdnUegE8NdK-nVnZ2dnUVZ_vninZ2d@comcast.com>, george@nospam.invalid says...
> David Moyer wrote:
> > In article <MPG.22de5c42e44d68b989841@news.individual.net>,
> > Jim Mason <jim.mason@removethisukonline.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> >>> Just posted - The very first reviews of the new iPhon
> >> Why do you think this is relevant to alt.cellular.nokia?
> >
> > proly cuz lots of nokia users are interested in the iphone, that's why.
>
> You just don't understand. The fanbois whose entire existence is defined
> by an electronic device think it is so important (in their minds) that
> they need to "convert" everyone else even if they could care less.
First Reviews of the 3G iPhone!! 
jk, LOL!
Linear Mode
