Re: Wow Apple and Google Force Verzion to Change Network Policy

4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:73a926cd-89da-4045-
aef9-d7960a2827e5@e4g2000hsg.googlegroups.com:

> LOL the iPhone got Verizon's attention as users continue to
defect to
> AT&T.
>
>

Every iPhoney costs ATT $831!

Read this:
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/1...he-831-iphone/

Guess who pays Apple $831 for his iPhoney....we'll wait.

Larry
--
Isn't it ironic that the same ISPs that are telling you
you're downloads threaten their networks......
.....are testing 100Gbps TV to sell on the SAME systems?
http://tinyurl.com/27qx3v

"vic.healey" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:33fb5bf6-1045-
448a-a6f0-621a041bbb92@e4g2000hsg.googlegroups.com:

> Just about everyone I know wants an iPhone which is sort of an
> indicator that the above may play out as indicated by analyst
Munster.
>
>

And just about every iPhone owner I show my Nokia N800 internet
tablet to wants rid of his ATT ball and chain to dump it for
mine.

Today, Amazon.com announced the NUMBER ONE selling "notebook" at
Amazon was not a notebook at all, but the very Nokia N800
internet tablet I really enjoy. The new N810 with the slideout
keyboard was NUMBER 3!....not shabby sales at all for a Linux
box!

Heading out this morning, I was talking on Skype over Alltel EVDO
to an Air Force friend in Iraq about his Orb TV link I setup from
his home, here, to the tent in Iraq using Orb (corp.orb.com).
Being on Skype-to-Skype from the tablet on EVDO to him on a
military laptop with broadband on the base, cost us nothing and
with good privacy of Skype's 256-bit encryption.

I think N800 sales are tied to the recent addition of Skype VoIP
to the tablet's inventory of software available. It's why I
bought it in the first place, before I knew about Maemo Mapper.

Larry
--
Isn't it ironic that the same ISPs that are telling you
you're downloads threaten their networks......
.....are testing 100Gbps TV to sell on the SAME systems?
http://tinyurl.com/27qx3v

"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in news:elmop-
9E88E7.09162428112007@nntp1.usenetserver.com:

> In article <Xns99F5EB86AD7FCnoonehomecom@208.49.80.253>,
> Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
>
>> And just about every iPhone owner I show my Nokia N800
internet
>> tablet to wants rid of his ATT ball and chain to dump it for
>> mine.
>
> They don't want a cell phone?
>
>

They already have a SELLphone....the one they had when they got
suckered into that locked up piece of shit iPhoney


Larry
--
Isn't it ironic that the same ISPs that are telling you
you're downloads threaten their networks......
.....are testing 100Gbps TV to sell on the SAME systems?
http://tinyurl.com/27qx3v

Never have seen a N800 in action, but the reviews are very positive.
However, it's huge! Put it in a small package (the iPhone or the Voyager
are about...what...half the size) and it will be a winner. To think that
the iPhone, as well as the rumored "gPhone" and others, including the N800,
didn't influence Verizon's decision is hard to believe. Due to their
generally superior network, they were able to hold out as long as possible
with a second rate UI and phones with controlled/limited/crippled features.
Thankfully, it looks like those days are nearly over. Does Amazon even sell
the iPhone? So who can say what MIGHT be the #1 seller. So long as there
are enough competing manufacturers and carriers this is only good news for
consumers who want a truly multi-functional device.

At 28 Nov 2007 03:20:28 +0000 Larry wrote:

> Every iPhoney costs ATT $831!
>
> Read this:
> http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/1...he-831-iphone/
>
> Guess who pays Apple $831 for his iPhoney....we'll wait.


That's really no different than any other cellphone sold- AT&T generally
pays their dealers an ongoing monthy residual of up to 15%. In this case,
there's no dealer (iPhones come from Apple or AT&T corporate stores only-
the dealer network doesn't have access.) So now, 15% of your monthy fee
goes to Apple instead of a mall kiosk. The difference to the customer is
essentially zero, except to the fanboys that'll feel warm and fuzzy knowing
a portion of their cellular fees go to the Apple mothership instead of some
local business person.

At 28 Nov 2007 10:20:10 -0500 Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:


> Wait a minute--what am I missing here?
>
> The N800 doesn't make phone calls over the cellular network, correct?
> It's not a cell phone.
>
> So, the people you're showing it to don't want to make phone calls over
> the cell phone network?

I think Larry is (ineloquently) making a case against the "convergence
device."

Building iPods, browsers, e-mail, etc., into cellphones has made them
larger and often less-suited to making phone calls.

For years I've carried a separate WinCE-based PDA and a cellphone, but
bought a Combo two years ago. While I'm generally happier with it, the
seperate devices were better in many ways, but overall having less to
schlep was the better choice for me.

Larry's simply making the argument that separates give you the benefits of
a better browser, larger screen, webcams, more storage, etc. when you need
it, and the ease and simplicity of a better PHONE when you don't.

Both scenarios have their advantages, and both points are valid. I find it
ironic that despite the march of technology, the smallest, thinnest phone
I've ever owned, my Nokia 8290, was purchased in 2001! It's still a
relatively small phone (but completely featureless!) by today's standards.

At 28 Nov 2007 17:52:11 +0000 stevev wrote:
> Never have seen a N800 in action, but the reviews are very positive.
> However, it's huge! Put it in a small package (the iPhone or the Voyager
> are about...what...half the size) and it will be a winner.

I think you're missing it's point. The device is supposded to be "huge" by
iPhone/Voyager standards. It's a web-tablet, not a phone, and it is
supposed to be a sort of middleground (in usability) between smartphones
and laptops.

On Wed, 28 Nov 2007, stevev posted:
> Never have seen a N800 in action, but the reviews are very positive.
> However, it's huge! Put it in a small package (the iPhone or the Voyager
> are about...what...half the size) and it will be a winner.

The difference is much less than that; about 1 inch less in width and
about 1/2 inch less in height. Thickness is comparable.

More specifically:
. iPhone's dimensions are 115x61x11.6mm with a 320x480 screen.
. N800's dimensions are 144x75x13mm with a 800x480 screen.

N800 is not a mobile phone, although it can do VOIP over Wi-Fi using Skype
or Google Talk. N800 is an Internet access device, and is designed to
render full sized web pages with readable text (which iPhone can not do).

> To think that
> the iPhone, as well as the rumored "gPhone" and others, including the N800,
> didn't influence Verizon's decision is hard to believe.

I doubt very much that Verizon cares at all about the N800. Verizon's
market is not in devices such as the N800.

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.

"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in news:elmop-
B2E890.10201028112007@nntp1.usenetserver.com:

> The N800 doesn't make phone calls over the cellular network,
correct?
> It's not a cell phone.
>
> So, the people you're showing it to don't want to make phone
calls over
> the cell phone network?
>

Well, yes and no. The N800 makes Skype calls over the Sellphone
via BT dun...or Google Talk or other VoIP telephone calls. N800
has its own telephone numbers. Mine has two, one in Charleston,
SC and one in London, UK for my English friends to call. It's a
full Skype phone, but, so far, doesn't support video from its
webcam. There's a driver missing I hope they'll fix.

Making calls on the N800 at noon on Tuesday to a landline in
Hawaii costs me $30/YEAR....on the SAME account all my other
Skype devices use. They even all ring at once, like we wish our
SELLphones would....from the same number, which they lie and tell
you can't be done. I pay Alltel $25/month for about 800Kbps
internet...including Skype's ports for encrypted data.

Noone I've met who has had the pleasure of holding the iPhone
tablet to their ear to make a cellphone call objects to going
back to a tiny BT sellphone they can hold in two fingers that has
real buttons on it. Not one. If I had to hold the N800 to my
ear to receive calls, I'd junk it! Sellphone calls are made and
received on the MotoROKR Z6M sellphone, here. MUCH more
convenient.

I don't HAVE to carry my tablet around to use the Sellphone,
which would be awful a lot of the time.

Larry
--
Isn't it ironic that the same ISPs that are telling you
you're downloads threaten their networks......
.....are testing 100Gbps TV to sell on the SAME systems?
http://tinyurl.com/27qx3v

Todd Allcock <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in
news:HHj3j.1$e%6.0@fe117.usenetserver.com:

> Larry's simply making the argument that separates give you the
> benefits of a better browser, larger screen, webcams, more
storage,
> etc. when you need it, and the ease and simplicity of a better
PHONE
> when you don't.
>
>

Thank you. I'd like to add that I control what the tablet does
or does not do, not some Sellphone company bureaucrats hell bent
on stopping it using bandwidth. Iphone and Voyager and Sellphone
PDAs are controlled by "them" and their tampering.

In my system, the tampering is limited to the phone, which I only
use as a modem and phone and could care less about its Brew
nonsense. It's just much better to operate in control of your
equipment as much as possible.

Larry
--
Isn't it ironic that the same ISPs that are telling you
you're downloads threaten their networks......
.....are testing 100Gbps TV to sell on the SAME systems?
http://tinyurl.com/27qx3v

["Followup-To:" header set to alt.cellular.verizon.]
On 2007-11-29, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:

> Well, yes and no. The N800 makes Skype calls over the Sellphone
> via BT dun...or Google Talk or other VoIP telephone calls.

So it's a voice call, but as far as the cellular carrier is concerned, it's
a data call. Right? (want to make sure I understand)

N800
> has its own telephone numbers. Mine has two, one in Charleston,
> SC and one in London, UK for my English friends to call. It's a
> full Skype phone, but, so far, doesn't support video from its
> webcam. There's a driver missing I hope they'll fix.
>
> Making calls on the N800 at noon on Tuesday to a landline in
> Hawaii costs me $30/YEAR....on the SAME account all my other
> Skype devices use. They even all ring at once, like we wish our
> SELLphones would....from the same number, which they lie and tell
> you can't be done. I pay Alltel $25/month for about 800Kbps
> internet...including Skype's ports for encrypted data.
>
> Noone I've met who has had the pleasure of holding the iPhone
> tablet to their ear to make a cellphone call objects to going
> back to a tiny BT sellphone they can hold in two fingers that has
> real buttons on it. Not one. If I had to hold the N800 to my
> ear to receive calls, I'd junk it! Sellphone calls are made and
> received on the MotoROKR Z6M sellphone, here. MUCH more
> convenient.
>
> I don't HAVE to carry my tablet around to use the Sellphone,
> which would be awful a lot of the time.
>
> Larry


--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com
Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol

"stevev" <stevev@addlebrain.com> wrote in
news:fVh3j.71656$YL5.49623@newssvr29.news.prodigy. net:

> However, it's huge! Put it in a small package (the iPhone or
the
> Voyager are about...what...half the size) and it will be a
winner.

That's simply not true. The N800 is the same size, with the same
sized screen as a Sony PSP video game. I'm using a PSP $10
carrying case for BOTH the N800 and the Nokia SU-8W folding
Bluetooth keyboard...all in one neat case with something I don't
have to fight to type on. Sending emails after I got the
keyboard is a pleasure in comparison to stylus or fingerprints
all over the touchscreen. BOTH devices fit in a slightly
modified (remove the internal game storage leaves) Game Stop
travel case.

Simply its 800 pixel wide 4.5" display is worth the tiny size
difference. You're not going to be carrying the iPhone in your
shirt pocket with your glasses and pen, either. It's not THAT
small. You can carry a Voyager, but its screens are not much
bigger than a Sellphone, rendering it useless. You have to SEE
what your looking at! Voyager is too small to be an internet
device for the same reason a Sellphone is. You can't read it.

Larry
--
The N800 proved too small to type on with your fingers, here....

At 29 Nov 2007 06:25:20 +0000 Larry wrote:

> Thank you. I'd like to add that I control what the tablet does
> or does not do, not some Sellphone company bureaucrats hell bent
> on stopping it using bandwidth. Iphone and Voyager and Sellphone
> PDAs are controlled by "them" and their tampering.
>

Not necessarily- my WinMo T-Mo MDA (HTC Wizard) wasn't crippled in any way,
and runs any WinCE native app (including Skype Mobile.)


> In my system, the tampering is limited to the phone, which I only
> use as a modem and phone and could care less about its Brew
> nonsense. It's just much better to operate in control of your
> equipment as much as possible.


Agreed. I tend to stick to uncrippled phones.

Mark Crispin <MRC@CAC.Washington.EDU> wrote in
news:alpine.WNT.0.99999.0711281635151.4736@Tomobik i-
Cho.CAC.Washignton.ED
U:

> N800 is an Internet access device, and is designed to
> render full sized web pages with readable text (which iPhone
can not
> do).

The only thing on webpages N800 doesn't do is JAVA, itself,
because Sun hasn't written a JAVA for it. It comes with Opera 8,
upgrading to Mozilla/Firefox with OS2008, or you can install the
Mozilla engine with Opera and run either, which is nice. It
comes with Flash 9, so youtube runs natively, not converted. Its
Media player also plays Real media files and streams externally,
which is better that in webpages on anything this small.

UKTube is a freeware Youtube player some hacker wrote because he
didn't like watching such small video clips. You simply copy
from the youtube webpage and paste the URL into UKTube and it
runs the youtube video in full screen so it looks much better.

N800 renders MOST Divx Movies off usenet if you use Mplayer,
another hacker video player for its engine. This extra player
also makes the audio much louder so you can disturb the other
restaurant patrons during the car chase or when the spaceship is
firing on the victims...(c;


> I doubt very much that Verizon cares at all about the N800.
Verizon's
> market is not in devices such as the N800.

That might have been true before Black Friday. Amazon sales of
N800 internet tablets was NUMBER ONE in "notebook sales" that
day. There seem to be plenty of discounted (under $200) N800s
available, but Buy.com ran out of Nokia SU-8W Bluetooth keyboards
just after shipping mine! The keyboard works with any HID BT
device, not just the N800, of course. It has special Sellphone
keys the N800 doesn't respond to to navigate the phones odd
menus.

Nokia's new N810 internet tablet was #3 on the list under a real
notebook. They seem to be much hotter sellers here, very
recently. You don't have to know anything about Linux to use
N800 with its "end user targeted" software from maemo.org. Hell,
software is much easier to install and run than WinXP, WM or
Palm.

I must admit I did steal iPhone's web-based-application idea a
little. Instead of "syncing" a palm pilot like I did for years,
I've created some private webpages for my web-based, multi-system
PDA functions. I put my calendar, todo list, mileage logs, etc.,
on the web server which is keeping all those records to be used
by any of my devices, now....not duplicating databases on
desktops, my laptop and PDA like before. No syncing is
necessary. Having EVDO everywhere, I don't need to store the
database on the pocket computer at all.

Larry
--
Isn't it ironic that the same ISPs that are telling you
you're downloads threaten their networks......
.....are testing 100Gbps TV to sell on the SAME systems?
http://tinyurl.com/27qx3v

["Followup-To:" header set to alt.cellular.verizon.]
On 2007-11-29, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:

> The only thing on webpages N800 doesn't do is JAVA, itself,
> because Sun hasn't written a JAVA for it.

What does it run? Didn't you say it ran Linux? Java is available for
Linux.



--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com
Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol