Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
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Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
HSBC could order 200,000 iPhones | Tech News on ZDNet
Aug 13, 2008 ... Global banking giant HSBC is considering ditching the
BlackBerry and adopting Apple's iPhone as its standard staff mobile
device.
Aug 13, 2008 ... "We are actually reviewing iPhones from a HSBC Group
perspective ... and when I say that, I mean globally," HSBC's
Australia and New Zealand ...
Aug 13, 2008 ... The fact that a company like HSBC is even considering
the iPhone is testament to robust new Enterprise features in the new
2.0 firmware. ...
Aug 13, 2008 ... Worldwide bank HSBC's employees have long used
BlackBerries as the handset of choice, but rumor has it that they are
considering replacing ...
Analyst: iPhones flying off shelves at 95 per store per day
Aug 13, 2008 ... An HSBC regional CIO says the company is evaluating
the iPhone 3G for deployment to its global staff. This could
potentially be the largest ...
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
4phun wrote:
> HSBC could order 200,000 iPhones | Tech News on ZDNet
> Aug 13, 2008 ... Global banking giant HSBC is considering ditching the
> BlackBerry and adopting Apple's iPhone as its standard staff mobile
> device.
>
> Aug 13, 2008 ... "We are actually reviewing iPhones from a HSBC Group
> perspective ... and when I say that, I mean globally," HSBC's
> Australia and New Zealand ...
>
> Aug 13, 2008 ... The fact that a company like HSBC is even considering
> the iPhone is testament to robust new Enterprise features in the new
> 2.0 firmware. ...
>
>
> Aug 13, 2008 ... Worldwide bank HSBC's employees have long used
> BlackBerries as the handset of choice, but rumor has it that they are
> considering replacing ...
>
> Analyst: iPhones flying off shelves at 95 per store per day
> Aug 13, 2008 ... An HSBC regional CIO says the company is evaluating
> the iPhone 3G for deployment to its global staff. This could
> potentially be the largest ...
>
> http://www.arstechnica.com/journals/...-store-per-day
>
>
>
> http://www.macrumors.com/2008/08/13/...les-estimates/
>
> http://news.zdnet.com/2424-9595_22-216006.html
>
> http://news.google.com/news?num=100&...num=1&ct=title
>
Why are you telling us this? Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
Richard B. Gilbert wrote:
> 4phun wrote:
>> HSBC could order 200,000 iPhones | Tech News on ZDNet
>> Aug 13, 2008 ... Global banking giant HSBC is considering ditching the
>> BlackBerry and adopting Apple's iPhone as its standard staff mobile
>> device.
>>
>> Aug 13, 2008 ... "We are actually reviewing iPhones from a HSBC Group
>> perspective ... and when I say that, I mean globally," HSBC's
>> Australia and New Zealand ...
>>
>> Aug 13, 2008 ... The fact that a company like HSBC is even considering
>> the iPhone is testament to robust new Enterprise features in the new
>> 2.0 firmware. ...
>>
>>
>> Aug 13, 2008 ... Worldwide bank HSBC's employees have long used
>> BlackBerries as the handset of choice, but rumor has it that they are
>> considering replacing ...
>>
>> Analyst: iPhones flying off shelves at 95 per store per day
>> Aug 13, 2008 ... An HSBC regional CIO says the company is evaluating
>> the iPhone 3G for deployment to its global staff. This could
>> potentially be the largest ...
>>
>> http://www.arstechnica.com/journals/...-store-per-day
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.macrumors.com/2008/08/13/...les-estimates/
>>
>>
>> http://news.zdnet.com/2424-9595_22-216006.html
>>
>> http://news.google.com/news?num=100&...num=1&ct=title
>>
>>
>
> Why are you telling us this? Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
> have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
Paranoid?!!!
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
On Aug 13, 10:31*pm, 4phun <vic.hea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> HSBC could order 200,000 iPhones | Tech News on ZDNet
> Aug 13, 2008 ... Global banking giant HSBC is considering ditching the
> BlackBerry and adopting Apple's iPhone as its standard staff mobile
> device.
>
> Aug 13, 2008 ... "We are actually reviewing iPhones from a HSBC Group
> perspective ... and when I say that, I mean globally," HSBC's
> Australia and New Zealand ...
>
> Aug 13, 2008 ... The fact that a company like HSBC is even considering
> the iPhone is testament to robust new Enterprise features in the new
> 2.0 firmware. ...
>
> Aug 13, 2008 ... Worldwide bank HSBC's employees have long used
> BlackBerries as the handset of choice, but rumor has it that they are
> considering replacing ...
>
> Analyst: iPhones flying off shelves at 95 per store per day
> Aug 13, 2008 ... An HSBC regional CIO says the company is evaluating
> the iPhone 3G for deployment to its global staff. This could
> potentially be the largest ...
>
> http://www.arstechnica.com/journals/...3/analyst-ipho...
>
> http://www.macrumors.com/2008/08/13/...onsidering-iph...
>
> http://news.zdnet.com/2424-9595_22-216006.html
>
> http://news.google.com/news?num=100&...lient=firefox-...
Very interesting.
I suspected this may happen sooner or later, the iPhone is a very
powerful device when you add your own custom software.
> the iPhone is a very
> powerful device when you add your own custom software.
>
>
How so? It has a very low resolution touchscreen with no stylus for
accuracy and fine input. It has no character recognition that I know
of. It has a poor finger keyboard for text input. It has no Bluetooth
HID profile so one can add an external useful keyboard. It has no port
to plug devices into and its Bluetooth prevents any use except headsets.
It has no cut and paste, a basic feature on any computing device.
Hence, there is only one way to get: http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?ovi=1&mqma
p.x=300&mqmap.y=75&mapdata=%252bKZmeiIh6N%252bI
gpXRP3bylMaN0O4z8OOUkZWYe7NRH6ldDN96YFTIUmSH3Q6
OzE5XVqcuc5zb%252fY5wy1MZwTnT2pu%252bNMjOjsHjvN
lygTRMzqazPStrN%252f1YzA0oWEWLwkHdhVHeG9sG6cMrf
XNJKHY6fML4o6Nb0SeQm75ET9jAjKelrmqBCNta%252bsKC
9n8jslz%252fo188N4g3BvAJYuzx8J8r%252f1fPFWkPYg%
252bT9Su5KoQ9YpNSj%252bmo0h0aEK%252bofj3f6vCP
from some app to Safari to bring up the map.
Because it only supports ONE app at a time, you cannot run the app this
URL came from and click and drag it into Safari to see the map, either.
One of the most important common computer features is simply omitted for
some stupid reason.
It has no word processing capability as it has no usable keyboard for
word processing.
It has no spreadsheet capability so cannot be used as a number cruncher
other than the simplest of basic hand calculator calculations any $3
calculator from Dollar General does better with its real keyboard.
It cannot do complex calculations as it has no scientific calculator,
with or without a programming function. It's not a science device with
no complex calculations.
It cannot display common video/audio formats used widely in business
such as Flash or most non-Apple video/audio formats. It can't play the
Realvideo board meeting on a train because it has no Realplayer, plugin
or stand alone player. It's media player is hobbled to sell iTunes
crap, hardly Business friendly.
It has no useful external memory, whatsoever. You cannot load your
office files onto a memory card, USB plug, portable media or portable
hard drive so you are forced to expose the company to internet access
many business users simply cannot permit. Webpage access to sensitive
company files, passwords and all, is just STUPID.
You cannot run specialized software written by your company IT
professionals on it because you are not allowed to install any useful
programs on it without exposing the company to some kind of security
breach at Apple Computers. Even if you could get "permission" to
install the software, the software would be exposed to hacking in iTunes
or some kind of hidden app store Apple would have to setup for your
corporation. Why take the risk? It's insane just to have a girl
magnet. Businessmen don't need a girl magnet. They have money!
The Cisco users do report the VPN support seems to work and is easy to
configure, but what will you do with that unsupported file format once
you download it to the iPhone? The document was created in Word,
contains 3 Excel spreadsheets full of numbers and the presentation that
goes with it is a Powerpoint presentation. So, once you get it to the
iPhone, what can you do with it? You can't review it, edit it, even
display it! Worthless?
Check off the file formats BUSINESS, not Electronic Arts, uses every day
that the iPhone supports: http://www.ace.net.nz/tech/TechFileFormat.html
Which App Store apps will read/edit/store your changes so you can VPN
them back to the system?
The XYZ Corp uses a lot of video presentations to go with its
Powerpoints. I'd almost guarantee NONE of them are in H.264 or MP4
format, the only two formats iPhone plays. What do you expect XYZ to
do, convert the whole 96TB library of videos JUST so the grunts in the
field can show them on an iPhone? BUSINESS isn't going to BEND to the
iPhone. BUSINESS buys hardware and software that plays what that
business uses on all other formats. They have no time for "conversion".
Of course, with no removable media to store the video on in the first
place from the company PC on your desktop, all this is moot. Try
sending a 3GB video file over iTunes. What a joke! Business has no
time for this crap.
It has no capability for any kind of video output that can be connected
to a large TV or monitor display so we can't use it at the meeting with
the clients, anyways. If we're going to haul the big laptop, why do we
need an iPhone?
Iphones play:
The Apple iPhone supports the following audio formats:
AAC (16 to 320 Kbps)
AIFF
AAC Protected (MP4 from iTunes Store)
MP3 (16 to 320 Kbps)
MP3 VBR
Audible (formats 2-4)
Apple Lossless
WAV
Which format did the CEO's little sales booster meeting get sent to you
in? It will play basic MP3 files. That might work if the company
doesn't use Realvideo/audio, as many of them do. Noone gives a shit if
it plays WAV, Audible 2 or 4, AIFF or Apple Lossless.
Cut and paste this URL into your Safari: http://www.google.com/products/catal...UTF-8&oe=utf-8
&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a&um=1&cid=
862264849236915779&oi=product_catalog_result&resnu m=1
&ct=result&scoring=p
Motorola S9 is the finest headset I ever owned. It's certainly the best
sellphone headset, too. Why can't this Superplayer play audio through
the standard A2DP Bluetooth Stereo headphones? Business will want
STEREO headphones so they can LISTEN to presentations DOWNLOADED from
parters as well as COMPETITORS. Iphone won't download them and does a
piss poor job of playing them without A2DP support. It IS fortunate you
don't need some proprietary Apple "adapter" so you can plug in a simple
stereo headphone.
These are valid points for business use. N800 isn't a business machine,
either, but is much closer with its many ported Linux apps like Abiword,
Open Office, Gnumeric Spreasheet, Xournal for annotating PDF files,
plays any format business uses, including Realvideo and Realaudio files
and streaming. N800 has no JAVA support....but the new Firefox 3 on it
will....(c;
Arrogance is fine with teenagers....but never with businessmen.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
M-M wrote:
> In article <u-2dnVxTJu21Pz7VnZ2dnUVZ_hudnZ2d@comcast.com>,
> "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
>> have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
>
>
> Well, I was just given an iPod Touch (free with Mac computer purchase
> with educational discount) and I must say it is quite cool. Being a
> Verizon customer, I cannot use an iPhone but I wish I could.
>
I bought a touch for that very reason. Now that I've owned it for 3 weeks,
some of the glamour is beginning to wear off. My desire for an iPhone has
waned. It is a cool device though, but there are some things my BB does more
effectively and reliably. Be patient. Wait for the BB Thunder due in the
Fall. You might be pleasantly pleased that you waited. No personal offense
meant to iPhone people. It's a great and innovative device.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
In article <Xns9AFADB2759D7Cnoonehomecom@208.49.80.253>, Larry
<noone@home.com> wrote:
> techwiz <McPherson.truck.2349@gmail.com> wrote in news:f63e231f-53a4-
> 41fe-84d5-f5730cb00e18@m44g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:
>
> > the iPhone is a very
> > powerful device when you add your own custom software.
>
> How so? It has a very low resolution touchscreen
actually it's one of the highest, at 163 pixels per inch, roughly
*double* that of many computer displays.
> with no stylus for
> accuracy and fine input.
and nothing to lose.
> It has no character recognition that I know
> of.
it can recognize chinese, but so what if it doesn't do recognition?
> It has a poor finger keyboard for text input.
actually it's fairly good.
> It has no Bluetooth
> HID profile so one can add an external useful keyboard.
currently, that's true.
> It has no port
> to plug devices into
there's a dock connector on the bottom.
> and its Bluetooth prevents any use except headsets.
currently, that's true.
> It has no cut and paste, a basic feature on any computing device.
apple said they'd be adding it, but other features had a higher
priority. there's also some indication that it may be in the next
firmware release.
> It has no word processing capability as it has no usable keyboard for
> word processing.
it wasn't intended to do that, but i did see an app that did text
editing in the store.
> It has no spreadsheet capability so cannot be used as a number cruncher
> other than the simplest of basic hand calculator calculations any $3
> calculator from Dollar General does better with its real keyboard.
there's at least one spreadsheet app available in the store.
> It cannot do complex calculations as it has no scientific calculator,
it *ships* with a scientific calculator. if you are going to criticize
it, at least pick things that are actually valid.
> with or without a programming function. It's not a science device with
> no complex calculations.
there are a number of calculators available, both rpn and aos, along
with hp clones.
> It cannot display common video/audio formats used widely in business
> such as Flash or most non-Apple video/audio formats.
adobe has stated that they're comitted to getting flash on it.
> It can't play the
> Realvideo board meeting on a train because it has no Realplayer, plugin
> or stand alone player.
it's up to real to create a player for their proprietary format.
> It's media player is hobbled to sell iTunes
> crap, hardly Business friendly.
nonsense.
> It has no useful external memory, whatsoever. You cannot load your
> office files onto a memory card, USB plug, portable media or portable
> hard drive so you are forced to expose the company to internet access
> many business users simply cannot permit. Webpage access to sensitive
> company files, passwords and all, is just STUPID.
nonsense. it has plenty of internal memory, more than most people
actually use. it can hold whatever office files one wants to bring and
there's no need to expose sensitive files.
> You cannot run specialized software written by your company IT
> professionals on it because you are not allowed to install any useful
> programs on it without exposing the company to some kind of security
> breach at Apple Computers.
what ever gave you that idea? all it takes is to sign up as an iphone
developer and there's no need to go thru apple to distribute it within
the company.
> Even if you could get "permission" to
> install the software,
no permission is required.
> the software would be exposed to hacking in iTunes
> or some kind of hidden app store Apple would have to setup for your
> corporation.
wrong again.
> Why take the risk? It's insane just to have a girl
> magnet. Businessmen don't need a girl magnet. They have money!
some of them even have brains.
> The Cisco users do report the VPN support seems to work and is easy to
> configure, but what will you do with that unsupported file format once
> you download it to the iPhone?
what unsupported file format is that?
> The document was created in Word,
> contains 3 Excel spreadsheets full of numbers and the presentation that
> goes with it is a Powerpoint presentation. So, once you get it to the
> iPhone, what can you do with it? You can't review it, edit it, even
> display it! Worthless?
iphone can display all of those.
> Check off the file formats BUSINESS, not Electronic Arts, uses every day
> that the iPhone supports:
> http://www.ace.net.nz/tech/TechFileFormat.html
> Which App Store apps will read/edit/store your changes so you can VPN
> them back to the system?
go look. there are nearly 2000 apps available.
> The XYZ Corp uses a lot of video presentations to go with its
> Powerpoints. I'd almost guarantee NONE of them are in H.264 or MP4
> format, the only two formats iPhone plays. What do you expect XYZ to
> do, convert the whole 96TB library of videos JUST so the grunts in the
> field can show them on an iPhone?
youtube converted to h.264.
> BUSINESS isn't going to BEND to the
> iPhone. BUSINESS buys hardware and software that plays what that
> business uses on all other formats. They have no time for "conversion".
> Of course, with no removable media to store the video on in the first
> place from the company PC on your desktop, all this is moot. Try
> sending a 3GB video file over iTunes. What a joke! Business has no
> time for this crap.
itunes has absolutely nothing to do with it.
> It has no capability for any kind of video output that can be connected
> to a large TV or monitor display so we can't use it at the meeting with
> the clients, anyways.
nonsense. of course it can output to a tv. where do you come up with
stuff?
> If we're going to haul the big laptop, why do we
> need an iPhone?
different devices, for different purposes.
> Which format did the CEO's little sales booster meeting get sent to you
> in? It will play basic MP3 files. That might work if the company
> doesn't use Realvideo/audio, as many of them do.
not that many, actually. real is proprietary.
> Motorola S9 is the finest headset I ever owned. It's certainly the best
> sellphone headset, too. Why can't this Superplayer play audio through
> the standard A2DP Bluetooth Stereo headphones? Business will want
> STEREO headphones so they can LISTEN to presentations DOWNLOADED from
> parters as well as COMPETITORS. Iphone won't download them and does a
> piss poor job of playing them without A2DP support. It IS fortunate you
> don't need some proprietary Apple "adapter" so you can plug in a simple
> stereo headphone.
so it currently doesn't do a2dp. big deal.
> These are valid points for business use.
not really.
> Arrogance is fine with teenagers....but never with businessmen.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
On Aug 14, 11:28*pm, nospam <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> In article <Xns9AFADB2759D7Cnoonehome...@208.49.80.253>, Larry
> > BUSINESS isn't going to BEND to the
> > iPhone. *BUSINESS buys hardware and software that plays what that
> > business uses on all other formats. *They have no time for "conversion".
>
> except that some businesses are. *hsbc is considering switching from
> blackberry to iphone:
A hidden business benefit some are missing is the economics of scale.
As Apple takes a sophisticated piece of hardware and software and
produces millions of copies the price can drop to where the cost is
insignificant compared to the benefits business gets by adapting to an
easy to find tool. Right now there opportunities for new and under
employed programmers to identify and develop apps for a vertical
market that incorporates the iPhone. They can become wealthy in a
short period of time if they make the right choices and if they can
produce what is desired by businesses before anyone else grabs the
market. Look at the software already there just for the medical field.
Apple benefits if more businesses choose their hardware to replace
aging Windows XP boxes. Right now Apple is on track to past IBM in
total capitalization sometime early next year. Apple just blew past
Google and is still growing. The only way to kill Apple would be to
kill Jobs and hope they can not find a similar replacement with his
vision and management style. I suspect Job's death will be the end of
Apple and it will unwind after he dies.
The CEO of Verizon seems to hope that happens sooner rather than later
now that Verizon has to compete against the iPhone.
All he has to do is tell Verizon customers it is ok to buy an iPhone
for surfing the Internet, listening to Podcasts, reading push email,
and carrying all your office or college texts around, just carry your
friendly Verizon phone as a backup if needed.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
At 15 Aug 2008 06:07:18 -0700 4phun wrote:
> > except that some businesses are. *hsbc is considering switching from
> > blackberry to iphone:
>
> A hidden business benefit some are missing is the economics of scale..
> As Apple takes a sophisticated piece of hardware and software and
> produces millions of copies the price can drop to where the cost is
> insignificant compared to the benefits business gets by adapting to an
> easy to find tool.
While true, it's device/platform agnostic. All device pricing benefits
from economies of scale- RIM, for example, pumps out more units than any
smartphone manufacturer, so arguably they can leverage that better than
anyone.
> Right now there opportunities for new and under
> employed programmers to identify and develop apps for a vertical
> market that incorporates the iPhone. They can become wealthy in a
> short period of time if they make the right choices and if they can
> produce what is desired by businesses before anyone else grabs the
> market. Look at the software already there just for the medical field.
True, but again, that's hardly new or unique. Developers have built
custom/vertical apps for smartphones for years., and in-house developers
have long built organization-specific apps.
> Apple benefits if more businesses choose their hardware to replace
> aging Windows XP boxes.
Yet that's not likely to be a big result of iPhone enterprise deployment,
since Outlook/Exchange is an important part of Apple's first steps into
this market. I doubt HSBC is considering "MobileMe" as their corporate e-
mail backbone! ;-)
> The only way to kill Apple would be to
> kill Jobs and hope they can not find a similar replacement with his
> vision and management style. I suspect Job's death will be the end of
> Apple and it will unwind after he dies.
Sadly, I agree, but in some ways that'd be a fitting end for a companythat
has benefitted so much from one man's guidance. On the other hand,
Christianity gained more from Jesus' death than his life... ;-)
> Verizon seems to hope that happens sooner rather than later
> now that Verizon has to compete against the iPhone.
That story is nearly as apocryphal as the Al Gore "invented the internet"
quote. Verizon's chief was essentially expressing the same theory we are-
Apple's success may only last as long as Jobs' major organs do.
> All he has to do is tell Verizon customers it is ok to buy an iPhone
> for surfing the Internet, listening to Podcasts, reading push email,
> and carrying all your office or college texts around, just carry your
> friendly Verizon phone as a backup if needed.
Alternately, all Apple has to do is add bluetooth DUN to the iPod Touch so
it allows an iPhone-like experience "Larry-style"- tethered to a BT
dumbphone in the user's back pocket.
You seem to forget that a great many customers, (though certainly not all,)
choose carrier first, and device second. I know people who'd stick with
Verizon even if they only offered rotary-dial cellphones with no features,
rather than switch to a smaller-footprint carrier with snazzy phones.
Other users simply hate touchscreen input of any kind, and want to dial and
text with physical buttons- they won't buy an iPhone until a hard-keyboard
model emerges.
Different strokes, as they say... Verizon has rode out many periods of not
having the "hot phone" of the moment in the past (IIRC, Cingular had the
RAZR as a 6 or 9 month exclusive) and does what any successful companydoes-
play to it's strengths. In Verizon's case, thats' "the network." I've
never heard of anyone flocking to Verizon primarily for the great handset
selection! ;-)
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
On Aug 15, 1:29*pm, Todd Allcock <eleccon...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> At 15 Aug 2008 06:07:18 -0700 4phun wrote:
>
> > > except that some businesses are. *hsbc is considering switching from
> > > blackberry to iphone:
> Alternately, all Apple has to do is add bluetooth DUN to the iPod Touch so
> it allows an iPhone-like experience "Larry-style"- tethered to a BT
> dumbphone in the user's back pocket.
>
Todd, isn't the whole point of tethering that you have a relatively
crappy phone that can connect to the INTERNET but you really want the
real Internet on your laptop or tablet?
The iPhone for millions is proving to be a viable alternative to
booting up a laptop for many common tasks they want to quickly perform
at odd moments.
That is what is making it such a killer product. It isn't the phone
part, it is the shirt pocket friendly easy to use real Internet
connection people want with the iPhone. That is without having to
tether or even carry around a relatively heavy laptop. Or even to
carry a small, but bulky by comparison Nokia N800 table which also
must be tethered to someone's phone.
IMHO There is a lot of old school thinking that can not see the forest
but for all the trees in the way.
Spotty iPhone connectivity results from a hardware problem
Oops!! Maybe not...
Spotty wireless broadband connectivity for some of Apple's
new iPhones most likely results from a hardware problem
introduced during mass production
tests conducted by unnamed experts that showed some handsets'
sensitivity to 3G network signals is well below the level specified in
the 3G standard.
Since the launch of the next-generation iPhone, Apple's message
boards have been flooded with complaints of dropped calls and poor
3G connectivity indicated by few or no "bars" on the phone's display
Some users said they performed side-by-side tests and found that the
iPhone had connectivity problems in locations where 3G phones from
other manufacturers did not.
That is going to be fixed in September by Apple with a firmware update
according to a news release yesterday.
For now just turn off 3G when you don't need the high speed AT&T 3G
data function and the iPhone will permanently switch to AT&T's other
network for more reliable voice calls.
> Oops!! Maybe not...
>
> Spotty wireless broadband connectivity for some of Apple's
> new iPhones most likely results from a hardware problem
> introduced during mass production
>
> tests conducted by unnamed experts that showed some handsets'
> sensitivity to 3G network signals is well below the level specified in
> the 3G standard.
>
> Since the launch of the next-generation iPhone, Apple's message
> boards have been flooded with complaints of dropped calls and poor
> 3G connectivity indicated by few or no "bars" on the phone's display
>
> Some users said they performed side-by-side tests and found that the
> iPhone had connectivity problems in locations where 3G phones from
> other manufacturers did not.
>
>
It would also be prudent to look at where the ANTENNAS are placed in
this box. The antenna connectors suggest the antennas are in the
plastic back, which would have the phone radiating in a very directive
way through your RF-absorbing hand. Many phones suffer from this pretty
girly nonsense, rather than have a proper antenna that gets the RF away
from the resistive human sucking up the signals...both ways.
You guys with iPhones in areas with less than full scale signal try
something for us......
place the iphone on a desk in an upright position keeping your hands
away from the back. Hold it by the edges. Note the signal strength on
the bar meter.
Ok, now, WITHOUT MOVING THE PHONE AT ALL, wrap your hand around the back
of it in the normal holding position you'd use to make a call. Watch
the signal bars. Try different positions of your hand while holding the
phone steady on the desk without turning or moving it and see if you can
find a position where the signal is minimal, as low as it will go.
Your hand is at the antenna, absorbing the signal.
When you get in a position where the phone starts to balk talking with
someone, take your hand away from this antenna location and hold the
phone in your fingertips by only its edges, leaving the back panel
plastic unobstructed. TURN yourself, and the phone, on your vertical
axis because I cannot imagine the antennas in this phone not being very
directional. Out the back of the phone, the antennas must be pointed
that way. Through the PC board, battery, display electronics and front
radiation will be poor to nearly non-existant.
iPhone looks to have a virtual panel antenna, which is very directional
off the surface of the panel. http://www.criterioncellular.com/ant...lantennas.html
Here's a panel antenna by Andrew, one of the best antenna companies on
the planet. Look at the specs of its vertical and horizontal beamwidth.
That's where it's 7db gain comes from....a reflective surface behind the
piece of PC board the antennas are etched upon. Your iPhone doesn't
have this directional phased array over a planar surface, just one
element. The radiation towards your ear, as you use the phone, is
absorbed by all the electronics on the PC board, not reflected back out
to make a directional array as this.
Here's the radiation patterns of a proper panel antenna array of many
phased dipoles: http://www.pow.za.net/panel.html
Notice the deep nulls where no signal goes off in that direction. This
antenna is on the 2400 Mhz wifi band.
Dipole antennas working against a metal groundplane make good
directional antennas. Here's a homebrew wifi antenna in a dish: http://www.saunalahti.fi/~elepal/antenna1.html
Now, compare that antenna with the dipole antenna buried in the plastic
back of the iPhone. In this type of antenna, L/4, the quarter
wavelength distance from the element to the reflector disk is very
critical at making a good pattern. As you move the plane in towards the
element, the single lobe of the antenna splits into 2, 4, 8, 16 smaller
lobes, which is, probably, more reality in the very thin iPhone's
reflective PC board/battery nearly pressed against the dipole element
inside the plastic back.
In any event, pretty isn't functional for good RF radiation between you
and the cell. Sellphone companies, a couple of phone generations ago,
got rid of the usable external antenna connectors attempting to make the
phones have less and less effective radiated power to jam the dense
cells in the cities, at the expense of RANGE when the cells are far
apart. Call dropping is normal with such phones, including iPhone.
I've seen no specification as to iPhones maximum RF power output. The
new generation seems hell bent on limiting power to 120-150 milliwatt,
almost no power output at all. At these power levels, none of them has
any decent range as there's almost no power to begin with.
Good advertising and Steve Jobs are no match for PHYSICS and common
sense.
Along the lines of this antenna problem in iPhone......
If the antenna in iPhone IS, in fact, directional perpendicular to the
plane of the plastic back, take a look at it in this perspective while you
are using it as a handheld computer. Where is the antenna pointing?
If you are holding it so you can see its screen, any RF coming out the back
of the iphone is POINTED AT THE GROUND...not at the towers. If it's laying
on a desk, it's pointed into the stuff in the drawer under the desktop and
at the floor, not at the towers.
Can we see a problem here if the towers aren't 500 yards from the desk?
> For now just turn off 3G when you don't need the high speed AT&T 3G
> data function and the iPhone will permanently switch to AT&T's other
> network for more reliable voice calls.
>
> It is a simple click in settings under Network.
>
>
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
"4phun" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7ec416d5-a959-46bf-9a0e-aa4a8458cf1b@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> > Alternately, all Apple has to do is add bluetooth DUN to the iPod Touch
> > so
> > it allows an iPhone-like experience "Larry-style"- tethered to a BT
> > dumbphone in the user's back pocket.
>
> Todd, isn't the whole point of tethering that you have a relatively
> crappy phone that can connect to the INTERNET but you really want the
> real Internet on your laptop or tablet?
Actually the point of tethering is get internet access on any device that
doesn't have it where you are at the moment, using the phone you're already
paying for.
Since you said "All [Verizon's CEO] has to do is tell Verizon
customers it is ok to buy an iPhone
for surfing the Internet, listening to Podcasts, reading push email,
and carrying all your office or college texts around, just carry your
friendly Verizon phone as a backup if needed" you're implying Verizon
service works lots of places AT&T (and therefore the iPhone) DOESN'T, I was
suggesting that a Touch tethered to a Verizon phone (if made possible) would
give a better "iPhone" experience than an iPhone, since you'd have more
ubiquitous data connectivity.
> The iPhone for millions is proving to be a viable alternative to
> booting up a laptop for many common tasks they want to quickly perform
> at odd moments.
Perhaps, but the same can be said of dozens of similar products. Besides,
it's not like those "millions" were walking around with laptops to get
directions, browse the web or check e-mail prior to buying an iPhone. They
were using Blackberries or Treos, or not doing those things.
Commercials and brochures aside, there is still no task an iPhone performs
that wasn't possible without one.
> That is what is making it such a killer product. It isn't the phone
> part, it is the shirt pocket friendly easy to use real Internet
> connection people want with the iPhone.
Which bolsters MY argument- since the phone is the least impressive part, a
tetherable iPod Touch would be preferable, since you'd have the iPhone
goodies on the carrier (and data plan) of your choice, instead of being
locked into AT&T and a $30 iPhone dataplan.
> That is without having to
> tether or even carry around a relatively heavy laptop. Or even to
> carry a small, but bulky by comparison Nokia N800 table which also
> must be tethered to someone's phone.
Again, you missed my point- I was talking about tethering an iPod Touch to a
phone that worked "everywhere" as alternative to carrying two phones (and
therefore two monthly service plans.)
> IMHO There is a lot of old school thinking that can not see the forest
> but for all the trees in the way.
I think you're calling the wrong guy "old school." I've been using mobile
devices as laptop replacement ever since I started tethering my Casio E-100
(circa 2000) to an IR equipped Nokia 7160 cellphone, or used a CompactFlash
56k dialup modem. The state of the art (for both mobile devices and
laptops) has come a long way in eight years!
Ironically, we get different messages from our two resident shills- you tell
us the iPhone is a laptop replacement for "common tasks" and Oxford tells us
"just use your MacBook" whenever confronted with a common task the iPhone
can't handle! (And frankly, unless you've jailbroken it, the iPhone wasn't
even a contender as a laptop replacement until DataCase was released a
couple of days ago!)
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
"4phun" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in message news:db4614b1-151f-462b-83ae-0685b5cee3ff@f63g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 16, 1:24 am, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
wrote:
> http://www.americasnetwork.com/ameri.../articleDetail....
That is going to be fixed in September by Apple with a firmware update
according to a news release yesterday.
For now just turn off 3G when you don't need the high speed AT&T 3G
data function and the iPhone will permanently switch to AT&T's other
network for more reliable voice calls.
It is a simple click in settings under Network.
Sorry fanBOY - wrong.....
Let me hold your hand and explain.
"from a hardware problem introduced during mass production"
No hardware issue is going to be fixed by a firmware update.
Firmware is STILL software.
Face it - your beloved iPhone (or the initial run anyway) is defective.
In order to actually fix them, Apple is going to have to eat crow and exchange
them.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
On Aug 16, 3:42*pm, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
wrote:
> "4phun" <vic.hea...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:db4614b1-151f-462b-83ae-0685b5cee3ff@f63g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> On Aug 16, 1:24 am, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
> wrote:
>
> >http://www.americasnetwork.com/ameri.../articleDetail....
>
> That is going to be fixed in September by Apple with a firmware update
> according to a news release yesterday.
>
> For now just turn off 3G when you don't need the high speed AT&T 3G
> data function and the iPhone *will permanently switch to AT&T's other
> network for more reliable voice calls.
>
> It is a simple click in settings under Network.
>
> Sorry fanBOY - wrong.....
>
> Let me hold your hand and explain.
>
> "from a hardware problem introduced during mass production"
>
> No hardware issue is going to be fixed by a firmware update.
> Firmware is STILL software.
>
> Face it - your beloved iPhone (or the initial run anyway) is defective.
> In order to actually fix them, Apple is going to have to eat crow and exchange
> them.
Oh Boy Oh boy I can't wait!
But wait a minute, Samsung uses the same chip and they updated the
chip with new software? Why can't Apple do the same thing? The
Intferon 3G chip is programmable!
The Germans are not that dumb to produce a chip that could not be
field upgradeable, though they did blow the last world war when they
were winning.
BTW why would Russia feel it was ok to use nukes on Poland as
punishment and not in Georgia?
You have to think a bit to come up with the correct answer.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
Which Samsung phone had this problem and solution? I have a blackjack II and
am experiencing random 3G connectivity issues and would benefit from
details.
Mike
"4phun" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:c2fa9659-5021-4865-beb3-15351d30b6fe@v57g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 16, 3:42 pm, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
wrote:
> "4phun" <vic.hea...@gmail.com> wrote in
> messagenews:db4614b1-151f-462b-83ae-0685b5cee3ff@f63g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
>
> On Aug 16, 1:24 am, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
> wrote:
>
> >http://www.americasnetwork.com/ameri.../articleDetail....
>
> That is going to be fixed in September by Apple with a firmware update
> according to a news release yesterday.
>
> For now just turn off 3G when you don't need the high speed AT&T 3G
> data function and the iPhone will permanently switch to AT&T's other
> network for more reliable voice calls.
>
> It is a simple click in settings under Network.
>
> Sorry fanBOY - wrong.....
>
> Let me hold your hand and explain.
>
> "from a hardware problem introduced during mass production"
>
> No hardware issue is going to be fixed by a firmware update.
> Firmware is STILL software.
>
> Face it - your beloved iPhone (or the initial run anyway) is defective.
> In order to actually fix them, Apple is going to have to eat crow and
> exchange
> them.
Oh Boy Oh boy I can't wait!
But wait a minute, Samsung uses the same chip and they updated the
chip with new software? Why can't Apple do the same thing? The
Intferon 3G chip is programmable!
The Germans are not that dumb to produce a chip that could not be
field upgradeable, though they did blow the last world war when they
were winning.
BTW why would Russia feel it was ok to use nukes on Poland as
punishment and not in Georgia?
You have to think a bit to come up with the correct answer.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
In alt.cellular.verizon Richard B. Gilbert <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
> Why are you telling us this? Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
> have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
Why wouldn't you have an iPhone?
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russel
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com wrote:
> In alt.cellular.verizon Richard B. Gilbert <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> Why are you telling us this? Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
>> have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
>
> Why wouldn't you have an iPhone?
>
I have a relatively new phone that works and does what I need it to!
I've read the directions and figured out how to use it. I already have
the phone tools installed on my computer. The phone is already loaded
with my contacts. A new phone would be a waste of my time and money.
Clearly, some people see something desirable about the iPhone. I'm not
among them!
In two to five years, I might be interested in a new phone. Whenever
that day arrives, I may look at an iPhone. If, on that day, there is
still an iPhone, it does what I need/want, and it is competitively
priced, I will consider buying one.
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
"4phun" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in message news:c2fa9659-5021-4865-beb3-15351d30b6fe@v57g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
But wait a minute, Samsung uses the same chip and they updated the
chip with new software? Why can't Apple do the same thing? The
Intferon 3G chip is programmable!
"Windsor also said that it's unlikely the problem, if it is chip-based, could
be fixed by a software update from Apple. "
"Is everyone convinced a firmware update to the iPhone will do the trick?
Nope."
"Gold, for example, said he doubts that a firmware fix is the answer. "I'd be
surprised if it is as simple as a firmware upgrade of the chip, so it is more
likely that existing devices will have this defect forever," he wrote in an e-mail
to Computerworld."
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
In alt.cellular.verizon Richard B. Gilbert <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
> EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com wrote:
> > In alt.cellular.verizon Richard B. Gilbert <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Why are you telling us this? Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
> >> have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
> >
> > Why wouldn't you have an iPhone?
> >
> I have a relatively new phone that works and does what I need it to!
> I've read the directions and figured out how to use it. I already have
> the phone tools installed on my computer. The phone is already loaded
> with my contacts. A new phone would be a waste of my time and money.
> Clearly, some people see something desirable about the iPhone. I'm not
> among them!
> In two to five years, I might be interested in a new phone. Whenever
> that day arrives, I may look at an iPhone. If, on that day, there is
> still an iPhone, it does what I need/want, and it is competitively
> priced, I will consider buying one.
You said you wouldn't have one even if it were given to you.
--
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.
-- Bertrand Russel
Re: Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry
EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com wrote:
> In alt.cellular.verizon Richard B. Gilbert <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
>> EskWIRED@spamblock.panix.com wrote:
>>> In alt.cellular.verizon Richard B. Gilbert <rgilbert88@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Why are you telling us this? Who the hell CARES? A lot of us wouldn't
>>>> have an iPhone if you GAVE it to us!
>>> Why wouldn't you have an iPhone?
>>>
>
>> I have a relatively new phone that works and does what I need it to!
>> I've read the directions and figured out how to use it. I already have
>> the phone tools installed on my computer. The phone is already loaded
>> with my contacts. A new phone would be a waste of my time and money.
>
>> Clearly, some people see something desirable about the iPhone. I'm not
>> among them!
>
>> In two to five years, I might be interested in a new phone. Whenever
>> that day arrives, I may look at an iPhone. If, on that day, there is
>> still an iPhone, it does what I need/want, and it is competitively
>> priced, I will consider buying one.
>
> You said you wouldn't have one even if it were given to you.
>
Today? Certainly not. I bought a Motorola RAZR V3m last December.
It's all the phone I need or want at the moment. In the unlikely event
that I find I need more phone than what I have, I'll look at what's
available, pick the one that suits me best, and buy it.
Give me an iPhone today and it will be offered for sale on e-Bay tomorrow!
Good Bye BlackBerrry: HSBC is considering ditching the BlackBerry 
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