How I would like to change the cell phone industry [was Re: AM electromagnetic waves: 20 KHz modulation frequency on an astronomically-low carrier frequency]

Roy Lewallen <w7el@eznec.com> hath wroth:

>Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>> . . .
>> Maybe that's why I like reading Mr. Radium's muddled tech rants. It's
>> the closest approximation to science fiction I can easily find.
> > . . .

>Try U.S. patents. The prose style is deadly, but the descriptions of
>operation are very often entertainingly fictional. For a warm-up, I
>recommend "Hyper-Light-Speed Antenna" by David L. Strom, #6,025,810.

<http://www.google.com/patents?id=csYDAAAAEBAJ&dq=6,025,810>
Cute. Apply DC and heat, and it goes faster than light.

Here's my candidate for the RF hype award:
"Magnetic field based power transmission line communication method and
system"
<http://www.google.com/patents?id=N_sEAAAAEBAJ&dq=5982276>
Uses a MASER with no visible means of coupling it to the power line to
move 2GBits/sec. Of course, it eventually went to litigation:
<http://dallas.bizjournals.com/dallas/stories/2004/03/22/story5.html>
6 Pages from Wired Magazine:
<http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/9.11/media.html>
The list of suckers, er.... investors, it truely impressive.

I'll pretend not to mention commercial antennas that are sold without
any useful specifications, patterns, or simulations. That's one
reason I've often considered going into the antenna business. The
more they resemble a gold plated metallic scrap heap, the better they
sell. Few customers can see how they operate. Product comparisons
are difficult or impossible. Magic is everywhere. Yeah, the antenna
biz looks good.

>There are many more creative ones and ones based on better
>pseudo-science, but that one is surely worth a read.
>Roy Lewallen, W7EL

Yes, but patents aren't made to be read by humans. They're made to be
read and fought over by attorneys.

I've also derived some entertainment from patents. For a while, I was
collecting what I considered to be patented impossibilities from
companies that exist mostly as a stock scam. However, I got into
legal hot water when I started to publicly suggest that their patented
technology was closer to science fiction than science. To avoid
litigation, I've had to keep my big mouth shut. I've run into some
real howlers that I would just love to offer as entertainment, but
don't need or want to risk an infestation of attorneys.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thank you Jim. You did good, it will come around full circle, allways does!

Butch KF5DE
<jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com> wrote in message
news:vhdqm4-am8.ln1@mail.specsol.com...
> In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Radium <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 1, 7:24 am, shawn.cormi...@gmail.com wrote in
>> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.e...0c8ed13?hl=en&
>> :
>
>> > how would u like to change the cell phone industry?
>
>> Analog cells phones should stop using FM and should start using AM
>> with SHF frequencies - at least 3 GHz and at most 30 GHz.
>
> Analog cell phones are going away.
>
> Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.
>
> You are an idiot.
>
> <snip crap>
>
> --
> Jim Pennino
>
> Remove .spam.sux to reply.

On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:45:02 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
<vhdqm4-am8.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

>In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Radium <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 1, 7:24 am, shawn.cormi...@gmail.com wrote in
>> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.e...0c8ed13?hl=en&
>> :
>
>> > how would u like to change the cell phone industry?
>
>> Analog cells phones should stop using FM and should start using AM
>> with SHF frequencies - at least 3 GHz and at most 30 GHz.
>
>Analog cell phones are going away.

True.

>Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.

False.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:45:02 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
> <vhdqm4-am8.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

> >In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Radium <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Jul 1, 7:24 am, shawn.cormi...@gmail.com wrote in
> >> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.e...0c8ed13?hl=en&
> >> :
> >
> >> > how would u like to change the cell phone industry?
> >
> >> Analog cells phones should stop using FM and should start using AM
> >> with SHF frequencies - at least 3 GHz and at most 30 GHz.
> >
> >Analog cell phones are going away.

> True.

> >Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.

> False.

1.9 GHz is in the ->region>- of 3 GHz.

..8 GHz is not in the ->region<- of 3 GHz.

--
Jim Pennino

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On Jul 16, 7:36 pm, "Brenda Ann" <bren...@shinbiro.com> wrote:

> Analog satellite still uses FM, but there is very little of that left. 30MHz
> wide channels. Think there used to be one version of SECAM (in France, IIRC)
> that used FM video. That's gone now, too.

Actually SECAM also uses AM for the luminance signal. However, it uses
FM for the color [chroma] signal.

On Jul 16, 6:07 pm, "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:

> The only FM on standard TV is the audio. Video is vestigial sideband AM.

I want it to be the opposite.

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> I still own a service monitor and still turn it on
> waiting for the display to mark the arrival of the alien visitors.

No doubt waiting for the Navasites from the Shirley Maclean alternative
universe...with their Extended GSM communicators.

On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 19:13:33 -0500, DTC <no_spam@move_along_folks.foob>
wrote in <wYcni.11207$rL1.7107@newssvr19.news.prodigy.net >:

>Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>> I still own a service monitor and still turn it on
>> waiting for the display to mark the arrival of the alien visitors.
>
>No doubt waiting for the Navasites from the Shirley Maclean alternative
>universe...with their Extended GSM communicators.

Hint: Extended GSM is a tower feature, not a handset feature.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:05:01 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
<nn10n4-h67.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

>In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>> On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:45:02 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
>> >Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.
>
>> False.
>
>1.9 GHz is in the ->region>- of 3 GHz.

False.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Radium <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jul 16, 6:07 pm, "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:

> > The only FM on standard TV is the audio. Video is vestigial sideband AM.

> I want it to be the opposite.

I want you to go away until you at least have a high school education
in science and techology and learn how to use Google.

I don't think either is going to happen.

--
Jim Pennino

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In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:05:01 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
> <nn10n4-h67.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

> >In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> >> On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:45:02 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
> >> >Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.
> >
> >> False.
> >
> >1.9 GHz is in the ->region>- of 3 GHz.

> False.

It certainly is within about 20%.


--
Jim Pennino

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On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:55:01 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
<hv40n4-p4g.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

>In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:05:01 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
>> <nn10n4-h67.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:
>
>> >In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>> >> On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:45:02 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
>> >> >Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.
>> >
>> >> False.
>> >
>> >1.9 GHz is in the ->region>- of 3 GHz.
>
>> False.
>
>It certainly is within about 20%.

No radio engineer would agree.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:45:00 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
<b040n4-vid.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

>In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Radium <glucegen1@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jul 16, 6:07 pm, "NotMe" <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>> > The only FM on standard TV is the audio. Video is vestigial sideband AM.
>
>> I want it to be the opposite.
>
>I want you to go away until you at least have a high school education
>in science and techology and learn how to use Google.
>
>I don't think either is going to happen.

Probably not, but that's Usenet.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:55:01 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
> <hv40n4-p4g.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:

> >In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> >> On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:05:01 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
> >> <nn10n4-h67.ln1@mail.specsol.com>:
> >
> >> >In rec.radio.amateur.antenna John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> >> >> On Sun, 15 Jul 2007 20:45:02 GMT, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote in
> >> >> >Cell phones already use frequencies in the 3 GHz region.
> >> >
> >> >> False.
> >> >
> >> >1.9 GHz is in the ->region>- of 3 GHz.
> >
> >> False.
> >
> >It certainly is within about 20%.

> No radio engineer would agree.

That should have been about 30%, but in any case, I am an engineer
and there isn't a whole hell of a lot of anything different between
1.9 GHz and 3 GHz.

What? Some trivial differences in path losses? Antennas a bit different
in size by what, 4 mm unless I slipped a decimal point in my head?


--
Jim Pennino

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jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com hath wroth:

>John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>> No radio engineer would agree.

I are an radio/RF/wireless/communications/whatever engineer and I
agree with John Navas that cellular is nowhere near 3GHz.

>That should have been about 30%, but in any case, I am an engineer
>and there isn't a whole hell of a lot of anything different between
>1.9 GHz and 3 GHz.

Baloney. See:
<http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/allochrt.pdf>
<http://www.fcc.gov/oet/spectrum/table/fcctable.pdf>
Zoom in to the area between 1.9GHz and 3.0GHz. There's a huge amount
of point to point, wi-fi, WiMax, satellite, XM/Serius, radar,
military, etc, stuff in that area. That's also where Sprint and
others have recently purchased bandwidth for advanced data services.

>What? Some trivial differences in path losses? Antennas a bit different
>in size by what, 4 mm unless I slipped a decimal point in my head?

There's no disgrace in admiting that you've made a misake. There's
plenty in trying to bluster your way out of admitting it followed by
trying to trivialize your mistake.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:
> jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com hath wroth:

> >John Navas <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
> >> No radio engineer would agree.

> I are an radio/RF/wireless/communications/whatever engineer and I
> agree with John Navas that cellular is nowhere near 3GHz.

> >That should have been about 30%, but in any case, I am an engineer
> >and there isn't a whole hell of a lot of anything different between
> >1.9 GHz and 3 GHz.

> Baloney. See:
> <http://www.ntia.doc.gov/osmhome/allochrt.pdf>
> <http://www.fcc.gov/oet/spectrum/table/fcctable.pdf>
> Zoom in to the area between 1.9GHz and 3.0GHz. There's a huge amount
> of point to point, wi-fi, WiMax, satellite, XM/Serius, radar,
> military, etc, stuff in that area. That's also where Sprint and
> others have recently purchased bandwidth for advanced data services.

> >What? Some trivial differences in path losses? Antennas a bit different
> >in size by what, 4 mm unless I slipped a decimal point in my head?

> There's no disgrace in admiting that you've made a misake. There's
> plenty in trying to bluster your way out of admitting it followed by
> trying to trivialize your mistake.

I agree there is a lot of stuff allocated between 1.9 GHz and 3 GHz,
but FCC regulations wasn't the point.

Lemme try again.

Put up two transmitters with everything identical in terms of lambda,
one on 1.9 GHz, one on 3 GHz.

Run around all you want with a field strength meter.

There isn't going to be spit worth of difference.

Antenna sizes? A matter of millimeters.

Equipment construction techniques, part availability, etc? Negligable
differences.

There isn't much difference between 2 GHz radio and 3 GHz radio.

Do the above with 800 MHz and 3 GHz. Now you start seeing some
differences.


--
Jim Pennino

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- S N I P -

RADIUM,

The please keep 'your' OT crap! OFF of Rec.Radio.Shortwave
* The Theard Goes Where The Thread Goes
* That Is The Nature Of NewsGroups

- I had to start a new thread because some
- jerks decided to post irrelevant nonsense.

Relevance in in the Mind of the Poster.

Right now since the 'topic' is CellPhones - I makes me wonder
what kind of Cellphone and Service Provider others here may
have . . .

OK starting with me :
I have a Motorla RAZR V3 via AT&T {Cingular} Wireless
and I do not want any changes to the Cellphone
Broadcasting System [.]

Keep Posting Your Scientific and Cellphone BS to
Rec.Radio.Shortwave and you will see replying to
it with what ever comes into my mind and inviting
others hear to do the same.

However, leave Rec.Radio.Shortwave "Off" your
Cross-Posting List and you won't have to deal
with me. Now woldn't that be nice.

Say Cuhulin do you have a CellPhone ?

David I know you must have a Cellphone.

Bet-Ya Telamon has a Cellphone.

Wondering -if- DX Ace has a Cellphone ?

Burr way over in the PI - you got a Cellphone over there ?

Hey Back At You "Radium" Wondering . . .
You Gotta Cellphone and who is your Service Provider ?

IF YOU GOT A CELLPHONE LET RADIUM HEAR ABOUT IT !

I B 'rhf' Listening to my Shortwave Radio
with my Cellphone near-by bye bye ~ RHF