Nokia on long comeback trail after smartphone misses

(Good Gear Guide) - Nokia still sells more phones than Samsung, LG
and Research in Motion (RIM) put together, but its inability to
produce high-margin, high-end smartphones that can compete head-to-
head with Apple's iPhone and Android-based smartphones is causing
it major problems.

Since April 22, when Nokia announced its first quarter results and
the delayed launch of its first competitive smartphone in over
three years -- following that up in June with a lowered outlook for
the second quarter -- the company's share price has almost been cut
in half on the New York Stock Exchange.

The company's status stands in stark contrast to the end of 2006,
when Nokia dominated the market...

Continued: http://sn.im/NokiaMisses

Next time have a look on their web site before you start typing!

Nokia N8 due out 24/8/10.

Miles better than iPhone, which if you have been keeping up with the news
does not seem to work when you hold it in your hand - oops!

"Dave U. Random" <anonymous@anonymitaet-im-inter.net> wrote in message
news:fb07bb4da3e6b5c0a730f761462c2954@anonymitaet-im-inter.net...
> (Good Gear Guide) - Nokia still sells more phones than Samsung, LG
> and Research in Motion (RIM) put together, but its inability to
> produce high-margin, high-end smartphones that can compete head-to-
> head with Apple's iPhone and Android-based smartphones is causing
> it major problems.
>
> Since April 22, when Nokia announced its first quarter results and
> the delayed launch of its first competitive smartphone in over
> three years -- following that up in June with a lowered outlook for
> the second quarter -- the company's share price has almost been cut
> in half on the New York Stock Exchange.
>
> The company's status stands in stark contrast to the end of 2006,
> when Nokia dominated the market...
>
> Continued: http://sn.im/NokiaMisses
>

R. Mark Clayton wrote:
> Next time have a look on their web site before you start typing!
>
> Nokia N8 due out 24/8/10.
>
> Miles better than iPhone, which if you have been keeping up with the news
> does not seem to work when you hold it in your hand - oops!

May I ask, how do you know it is better when is isn`t even out yet?
How do you know it hasn`t quirks too?+

"Bellende Belhamel" <bellendebelh@m.el> wrote in message
news:4c32e7ff$0$22933$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>> Next time have a look on their web site before you start typing!
>>
>> Nokia N8 due out 24/8/10.
>>
>> Miles better than iPhone, which if you have been keeping up with the news
>> does not seem to work when you hold it in your hand - oops!
>
> May I ask, how do you know it is better when is isn`t even out yet?

Let me see - oh yes I can read a specification and that it will be about
half the price.

> How do you know it hasn`t quirks too?+

I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the battery!

>
>

R. Mark Clayton wrote:

>
> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the battery!

You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
removable battery.

-------------------------------------
Actually, Posix requires that leap seconds be ignored; see IEEE Std
1003.1b-1993 section 2.2.2.106 (page 22 lines 448-458). There is some
excellent doublespeak attempting to justify this in the annexes; my
favorite is "it is inappropriate to require that a time represented as
seconds since the Epoch precisely represent the number of seconds between
the referenced time and the Epoch" (section B.2.2.2 page 306 lines
620-622).
-- Paul Eggert
-------------------------------------

"Rex" <rexdudeREMOVEANDREVERSEDOMAIN@liam.ur> wrote in message
news:i165mh$k68$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>
>>
>> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the battery!
>
> You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
> removable battery.
>
No I am not it takes the existing Nokia Battery BL-4D (same as the N97
Mini) - do read the spec's old boy...

On Fri, 9 Jul 2010 21:37:34 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
<nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote:

>
>"Rex" <rexdudeREMOVEANDREVERSEDOMAIN@liam.ur> wrote in message
>news:i165mh$k68$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the battery!
>>
>> You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
>> removable battery.
>>
>No I am not it takes the existing Nokia Battery BL-4D (same as the N97
>Mini) - do read the spec's old boy...

I guess you're both right to a certain extent. The N8 doesn't have a
removable battery cover like normal Nokia phones. You can still
replace the battery, but it involves removing a few screws and
dismantling the case.

I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.

Chris

R. Mark Clayton wrote:
> "Bellende Belhamel" <bellendebelh@m.el> wrote in message
> news:4c32e7ff$0$22933$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
>> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>> Next time have a look on their web site before you start typing!
>>>
>>> Nokia N8 due out 24/8/10.
>>>
>>> Miles better than iPhone, which if you have been keeping up with the
>>> news
>>> does not seem to work when you hold it in your hand - oops!
>>
>> May I ask, how do you know it is better when is isn`t even out yet?
>
> Let me see - oh yes I can read a specification and that it will be about
> half the price.

I fyou don`t know if it has quirks, you don`t know do you.


>> How do you know it hasn`t quirks too?+
>
> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the battery!

Chris Blunt wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Jul 2010 21:37:34 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
> <nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> "Rex" <rexdudeREMOVEANDREVERSEDOMAIN@liam.ur> wrote in message
>> news:i165mh$k68$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the
>>>> battery!
>>>
>>> You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
>>> removable battery.
>>>
>> No I am not it takes the existing Nokia Battery BL-4D (same as the N97
>> Mini) - do read the spec's old boy...
>
> I guess you're both right to a certain extent. The N8 doesn't have a
> removable battery cover like normal Nokia phones. You can still
> replace the battery, but it involves removing a few screws and
> dismantling the case.
>
> I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
> worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
> the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.

Unless your phone gets stuck, which my N95 sometimes did.
The only remedie was, removing the battery.

Bellende Belhamel wrote:
> Chris Blunt wrote:
>> On Fri, 9 Jul 2010 21:37:34 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
>> <nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Rex" <rexdudeREMOVEANDREVERSEDOMAIN@liam.ur> wrote in message
>>> news:i165mh$k68$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the
>>>>> battery!
>>>>
>>>> You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
>>>> removable battery.
>>>>
>>> No I am not it takes the existing Nokia Battery BL-4D (same as the N97
>>> Mini) - do read the spec's old boy...
>>
>> I guess you're both right to a certain extent. The N8 doesn't have a
>> removable battery cover like normal Nokia phones. You can still
>> replace the battery, but it involves removing a few screws and
>> dismantling the case.
>>
>> I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
>> worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
>> the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.
>
> Unless your phone gets stuck, which my N95 sometimes did.
> The only remedie was, removing the battery.

or you must wait until your battery was drained ofcourse.

On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 13:36:00 +0200, "Bellende Belhamel"
<bellendebelh@m.el> wrote:

>Chris Blunt wrote:
>> On Fri, 9 Jul 2010 21:37:34 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
>> <nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Rex" <rexdudeREMOVEANDREVERSEDOMAIN@liam.ur> wrote in message
>>> news:i165mh$k68$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>>> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the
>>>>> battery!
>>>>
>>>> You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
>>>> removable battery.
>>>>
>>> No I am not it takes the existing Nokia Battery BL-4D (same as the N97
>>> Mini) - do read the spec's old boy...
>>
>> I guess you're both right to a certain extent. The N8 doesn't have a
>> removable battery cover like normal Nokia phones. You can still
>> replace the battery, but it involves removing a few screws and
>> dismantling the case.
>>
>> I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
>> worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
>> the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.
>
>Unless your phone gets stuck, which my N95 sometimes did.
>The only remedie was, removing the battery.

Looking at pictures of the N8, it looks like there's a small pinhole
on the side of the phone. I wonder if that's some kind of reset
button?

Chris

"Chris Blunt" <mail@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:2nci369bjjhlh9da999uj49tampcda9jov@4ax.com...
SNIP
>>>
>>> I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
>>> worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
>>> the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.
>>
>>Unless your phone gets stuck, which my N95 sometimes did.
>>The only remedie was, removing the battery.

Ditto my N79

>
> Looking at pictures of the N8, it looks like there's a small pinhole
> on the side of the phone. I wonder if that's some kind of reset
> button?

Possible - anyone got a link to the user guide - something I always read
BEFORE a high tech' purchase.

>
> Chris

"Bellende Belhamel" <bellendebelh@m.el> wrote in message
news:4c385b23$0$22938$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
> Chris Blunt wrote:
>
>> I guess you're both right to a certain extent. The N8 doesn't have a
>> removable battery cover like normal Nokia phones. You can still
>> replace the battery, but it involves removing a few screws and
>> dismantling the case.
>>
>> I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
>> worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
>> the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.
>
> Unless your phone gets stuck, which my N95 sometimes did.
> The only remedie was, removing the battery.
>

Indeed it looks like a standard battery, but not user access (but unlikely
to be that difficult to open - this is Nokia NOT Apple).

Does not look like there is a reset "hole" OTOH having found the manual
https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/oet/f...ive_or_pdf=pdf
it appears that the on / off switch exerts a hard reset after 8 seconds.

On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 11:56:32 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
<nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote:

>
>"Bellende Belhamel" <bellendebelh@m.el> wrote in message
>news:4c385b23$0$22938$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl.. .
>> Chris Blunt wrote:
>>
>>> I guess you're both right to a certain extent. The N8 doesn't have a
>>> removable battery cover like normal Nokia phones. You can still
>>> replace the battery, but it involves removing a few screws and
>>> dismantling the case.
>>>
>>> I'm sure many people will dislike that, but I don't think it will
>>> worry me. I can't remember ever replacing a battery more than once in
>>> the entire lifetime of any phones I've owned.
>>
>> Unless your phone gets stuck, which my N95 sometimes did.
>> The only remedie was, removing the battery.
>>
>
>Indeed it looks like a standard battery, but not user access (but unlikely
>to be that difficult to open - this is Nokia NOT Apple).
>
>Does not look like there is a reset "hole" OTOH having found the manual
>https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/prod/oet/f...ive_or_pdf=pdf
>it appears that the on / off switch exerts a hard reset after 8 seconds.

Those resets that tell you to hold down a button for a certain period
of time are not really true hardware resets because they require some
processing power to work. If the phone has well and truly locked up
then they won't work if the firmware in the phone has completely
stopped running.

Chris

Dave U. Random <anonymous@anonymitaet-im-inter.net> wrote:

> (Good Gear Guide) - Nokia still sells more phones than Samsung, LG
> and Research in Motion (RIM) put together, but its inability to
> produce high-margin, high-end smartphones that can compete head-to-
> head with Apple's iPhone and Android-based smartphones is causing
> it major problems.

Just wait until Apple starts selling a small version of their iPhone,
then it's over for Nokia.

Apple certainly is working in that direction...

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/07...apple_display/

R. Mark Clayton wrote:
> "Rex"<rexdudeREMOVEANDREVERSEDOMAIN@liam.ur> wrote in message
> news:i165mh$k68$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the battery!
>>
>> You're wrong there. The N8 is the first Nokia with an iPhone style non
>> removable battery.
>>
> No I am not it takes the existing Nokia Battery BL-4D (same as the N97
> Mini) - do read the spec's old boy...
>
>
It does use the BL 4D, but there`s no standard way to remove it as was
the case with other nokias. the back cover is sealed.


-------------------------------------
"The hardest thing in the world to understand is the income tax."
-- Albert Einstein
-------------------------------------

"Chris Blunt" <mail@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:qmoj3650a25jjjdad8phrbelo3j7gvn2hp@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Jul 2010 11:56:32 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
> <nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote:
>


>>it appears that the on / off switch exerts a hard reset after 8 seconds.
>
> Those resets that tell you to hold down a button for a certain period
> of time are not really true hardware resets because they require some
> processing power to work. If the phone has well and truly locked up
> then they won't work if the firmware in the phone has completely
> stopped running.
>
> Chris

A short period no, but if the switch is also connected to a watchdog chip
then it will. 8s is a lot longer than usual for this sort of thing.

Chris Blunt wrote:

> You can still replace the battery, but it involves
> removing a few screws and dismantling the case.
>
> I'm sure many people will dislike that...

Absolutely. It's an absolute no-go for me.

Hasn't anybody seen those dirt cheap chargers for nokia batteries?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Battery-Charger-...3?cmd=ViewItem

Ever since I've got one of those I always carry a fully charged spare
battery with me. Whenever my phone runs dry on the road I pop in the
spare battery. When required, I charge the spare in the offline charger
over night. My phone never needs to be connected to the charger any more.

Phone power management has become a non-issue for me.

And now Nokia thinks a difficult to swap battery is smart idea. Sheesh.

--
Gregor mit dem Motorrad auf Reisen
http://hothaus.de/greg-tour/

noise seems to convey great ideas of power to the ignorant
- James Watt

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:07:18 +0200, "Greg N." <yodel_dodel@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>Chris Blunt wrote:
>
>> You can still replace the battery, but it involves
>> removing a few screws and dismantling the case.
>>
>> I'm sure many people will dislike that...
>
>Absolutely. It's an absolute no-go for me.
>
>Hasn't anybody seen those dirt cheap chargers for nokia batteries?
>http://cgi.ebay.com/Battery-Charger-...3?cmd=ViewItem
>
>Ever since I've got one of those I always carry a fully charged spare
>battery with me. Whenever my phone runs dry on the road I pop in the
>spare battery. When required, I charge the spare in the offline charger
>over night. My phone never needs to be connected to the charger any more.
>
>Phone power management has become a non-issue for me.
>
>And now Nokia thinks a difficult to swap battery is smart idea. Sheesh.

I can see this will be a problem for people who make heavy use of
their phones, especially those like you who are out and about a lot.

Where I live, most people use their phones for text messaging rather
than calling. I normally keep my phone connected to the computer for
most of the day to send and received texts using Nokia Communication
Manager. One side-benefit of having it connected to the computer is
that it's continually charging through the USB port, so I seldom need
to use a charger.

Phone power management has become a non-issue for me too, but in my
case I never need to change the battery.

Chris

"Chris Blunt" <mail@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:2vss46589dh0cs67m5q7h58ebbma9fu8hu@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:07:18 +0200, "Greg N." <yodel_dodel@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>>Chris Blunt wrote:
>>
SNIP
>>
>>Phone power management has become a non-issue for me.
>>
>>And now Nokia thinks a difficult to swap battery is smart idea. Sheesh.
>
> I can see this will be a problem for people who make heavy use of
> their phones, especially those like you who are out and about a lot.
>
> Where I live, most people use their phones for text messaging rather
> than calling. I normally keep my phone connected to the computer for
> most of the day to send and received texts using Nokia Communication
> Manager. One side-benefit of having it connected to the computer is
> that it's continually charging through the USB port, so I seldom need
> to use a charger.
>
> Phone power management has become a non-issue for me too, but in my
> case I never need to change the battery.
>
> Chris

I currently have an N79. This normally does OK, but do a reasonable amount
of GPS, wi-fi, surfing and talking (especially in areas of poor coverage)
and it can run down in around 18 hours and be grumbling about "battery low"
by bed time.

This appears comparable to the N97.

OTOH I expect the N8 to be comparable to the N97 Mini, which manages much
longer (despite what the Spec' says).

How do you know it hasn`t quirks too?+

I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the
battery!




--
LeeRain

"LeeRain" <LeeRain.6b08a4c@cellbanter.com> wrote in message
news:LeeRain.6b08a4c@cellbanter.com...
>
> How do you know it hasn`t quirks too?+
>
> I don't - but I do know that the user will be able to change the
> battery!
>
>
>
>
> --
> LeeRain

No you don't know - I already lost this argument.

OTOH it is a standard Nokia battery (BL-4D) and opening the case should not
be that difficult or expensive (£25 official; £5 after-market).