Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
it killed the deal.
1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds. When
connect time is subtracted this means that I get an average of 2.5
rings before the caller is forwarded to T-Mobile's voicemail network.
Problem is I can't always answer the phone in that time.
I tried having them disable voicemail but then the phone failed-over after
15 seconds. Compounding this hassle, callers always got a T-Mobile
network message. Spent 2 painful hours on the phone with support
(3 calls, 5 transfers, 45m on hold) and I finally reached a tech with
"7 years" experience who said they cannot ring my phone more than 30
seconds and will always fail over to a T-Mobile announcement regardless
of any settings.
You have to wonder what the logic to this is. Verizon rings for 60 seconds
before going to busy (or voicemail, if enabled). Why would T-Mobile piss
away perfectly good new customers for something like this?
2) The G1 will not play mp3s over bluetooth, not even in mono.
Surely HTC/Google doesn't think my train mates appreciate having to
listen to someone else's mp3s over tinny handheld speakers, unable to
do something as simple as connect to a Jabra headphone... (at least it
works for calls).
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
At 14 Nov 2008 16:53:28 +0000 Opra wrote:
> I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
> it killed the deal.
>
> 1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds. When
> connect time is subtracted this means that I get an average of 2.5
> rings before the caller is forwarded to T-Mobile's voicemail network.
> Problem is I can't always answer the phone in that time.
>
> I tried having them disable voicemail but then the phone failed-over after
> 15 seconds. Compounding this hassle, callers always got a T-Mobile
> network message. Spent 2 painful hours on the phone with support
> (3 calls, 5 transfers, 45m on hold) and I finally reached a tech with
> "7 years" experience who said they cannot ring my phone more than 30
> seconds and will always fail over to a T-Mobile announcement regardless
> of any settings.
>
> You have to wonder what the logic to this is. Verizon rings for 60
seconds
> before going to busy (or voicemail, if enabled). Why would T-Mobile piss
> away perfectly good new customers for something like this?
Apparently they don't piss off that many, since we don't see many
complaints about it here. Does anyone actually wait 60 seconds to leave
you a voicemail? If I was on the line that long, I'd assume you didn't
have voicemail or an answering machine and hang up!
The problem with cellphones in general is the system is slow sending ring
notifications to cellphones, at least as compared to landlines. While YOU
may only have "2.5 rings" to answer, you caller has heard 4 (the standard
maximum number before most landline answerers pick up) or more.
I'm not defending T-Mo's inflexibility- customers should certainly have the
option for more rings if they choose- but I'm suggesting it isn't a problem
for most people.
> 2) The G1 will not play mp3s over bluetooth, not even in mono.
>
> Surely HTC/Google doesn't think my train mates appreciate having to
> listen to someone else's mp3s over tinny handheld speakers, unable to
> do something as simple as connect to a Jabra headphone... (at least it
> works for calls).
The joys of beta testing a supposedly finished product! As the story
according to Google goes, they fell behind schedule with the Android OS,
and full Bluetooth implementation wasn't going to be ready, so they put a
bluetooth earpiece profile (for calls only) in, but left the rest (stereo
A2DP music playback, file transfer, dial-up networking, etc.) for a future
release.
If that was your only beef you could certainly use wired headphones for
listening to MP3s in the meantime until they "finish" the Android software,
but it sounds like #1 is the primary deal-breaker.
Sorry it didn't work out for you, but that's why one carrier/phone isn't
right for everyone! ;-)
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Opra wrote:
> I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
> it killed the deal.
>
> 1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds. When
> connect time is subtracted this means that I get an average of 2.5
> rings before the caller is forwarded to T-Mobile's voicemail network.
> Problem is I can't always answer the phone in that time.
I don't know if this works with T-Mobile US, but when you call ##002#
all diverts could be erased. That has nothing to do with the handset.
> You have to wonder what the logic to this is. Verizon rings for 60 seconds
> before going to busy (or voicemail, if enabled). Why would T-Mobile piss
> away perfectly good new customers for something like this?
The GSM standard only allows diverts in five second increments, maximum
is 30 seconds.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-15, Dirk Bieber <dirk.bieber@batrabbit.eu> wrote:
> Opra wrote:
>> I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
>> it killed the deal.
>>
>> 1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds. When
>> connect time is subtracted this means that I get an average of 2.5
>> rings before the caller is forwarded to T-Mobile's voicemail network.
>> Problem is I can't always answer the phone in that time.
>
> I don't know if this works with T-Mobile US, but when you call ##002#
> all diverts could be erased. That has nothing to do with the handset.
The default setting for US networks is that "cancel all diverts" doesn't
cancel all diverts but rather restores the default divert to voice mail.
To get "cancel all diverts" to actually do what it says you need to call
customer service to change it (I've done this with AT&T).
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-14, Opra <opracan@sonic.net> wrote:
> I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
> it killed the deal.
>
> 1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds.
There are carriers that will?
> I tried having them disable voicemail but then the phone failed-over after
> 15 seconds. Compounding this hassle, callers always got a T-Mobile
> network message.
Well, yes, that's what happens when you turn off voicemail, and again, that's
not an issue specific to T-Mobile.
> You have to wonder what the logic to this is. Verizon rings for 60 seconds
> before going to busy (or voicemail, if enabled).
OK, #1: if you turn off voicemail and don't answer your phone, the
caller will get a message from the carrier that you're not available...
unless they just recently changed... and during the four years I was with
Verizon, the phone never rang more than 60 seconds.
> Why would T-Mobile piss
> away perfectly good new customers for something like this?
They wouldn't. Why would you want to force people to listen to ringing
for 60 seconds? Would anyone even sit on the phone that long and not
hang up after five our six rings?
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Steve Sobol <sjsobol@justthe.net> wrote:
>On 2008-11-14, Opra <opracan@sonic.net> wrote:
>> I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
>> it killed the deal.
>> 1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds.
>
>There are carriers that will?
You must not have read the original post.
>Well, yes, that's what happens when you turn off voicemail, and again, that's
>not an issue specific to T-Mobile.
Well yes it is because I'm still with Verizon, who did disable voicemail
the first time I requested it, still rings for 60 seconds, and doesn't
announce "You've reached the Verizon network" under any circumstances.
I have no particular fondness for Verizon. They've done nothing but lower
service quality (1G) and raise rates for the past several years. I'd dump
them in a minute for these 2 reasons alone, especially as T-Mobile's
data plan is reasonably priced. But if I can't answer calls, as occurred
over the week I tried to use T-Mobile's network, it'd be a net loss.
>OK, #1: if you turn off voicemail and don't answer your phone, the
>caller will get a message from the carrier that you're not available...
>unless they just recently changed... and during the four years I was with
>Verizon, the phone never rang more than 60 seconds.
One reason is that I don't want telco announcements/advertising on my
business line.
Another is that I already have voicemail (an Asterisk PBX). Sure it's
easy configure Asterisk to only ring the T-Mobile number for only 29
seconds, but then I'd still be stuck having to answer the phone in less
than 2.4 rings in areas with good coverage and 1.8 rings on average.
In accounting this is known as penny-wise and pound foolish. I suppose
they make it up, as do other telcos, by lobbying congress and the FCC
for protection from the competition.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-15, Opra <opracan@sonic.net> wrote:
>>OK, #1: if you turn off voicemail and don't answer your phone, the
>>caller will get a message from the carrier that you're not available...
>>unless they just recently changed... and during the four years I was with
>>Verizon, the phone never rang more than 60 seconds.
>
> One reason is that I don't want telco announcements/advertising on my
> business line.
I'm amazed that you'd rather have a busy signal. If I called someone I did
business with and got more than a couple busies, I'd stop calling them and
go find someone else. But... your choice.
> Another is that I already have voicemail (an Asterisk PBX). Sure it's
> easy configure Asterisk to only ring the T-Mobile number for only 29
> seconds, but then I'd still be stuck having to answer the phone in less
> than 2.4 rings in areas with good coverage and 1.8 rings on average.
I see. So you want all calls to go to your Asterisk voicemail; makes sense
to me, only one box to check.
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
At 15 Nov 2008 21:00:39 +0000 Opra wrote:
> Another is that I already have voicemail (an Asterisk PBX). Sure it's
> easy configure Asterisk to only ring the T-Mobile number for only 29
> seconds, but then I'd still be stuck having to answer the phone in less
> than 2.4 rings in areas with good coverage and 1.8 rings on average.
>
> In accounting this is known as penny-wise and pound foolish. I suppose
> they make it up, as do other telcos, by lobbying congress and the FCC
> for protection from the competition.
As has been mentioned, it's a limitation of the GSM standard. Perhaps T-Mo
feels adherence to a standard is more important than keeping your business.
I don't see how this limitation is evidence of "protection" by lobbying.
Do you propose that raising the forwarding limit to 60 seconds should be
legislated and forced on cellcos to make your life more convenient?
Obviously if T-Mobile felt competitive pressure to break the standard and
raise the time period they could. As this complaint seems rather rare, it
hardly seems cost effective to change their system to make the
comparitively small number of folks affected by it happy. Pennywise and
pound foolish would certainly describe making a wide scale system change to
fix a "problem" the overwhelming majority of customers don't seem to have
or care about, as well as create potential problems when roaming (i.e. how
would roamer networks handle an out-of-standard value for forwarding if
they themselves adhere to the 5-30 second standard?)
It seems to me that this is just another difference between carriers, like
pricing or coverage, that influences consumer choice, not "evidence" of
anti-competitiveness allowed by lobbying/bribing Congress or the FCC.
Hell hath no fury, apparently, like an American consumer scorned...
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in
news:slrnghuas2.64o.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.net:
> They wouldn't. Why would you want to force people to listen to ringing
> for 60 seconds?
I might be on the crapper. It takes me longer than 60 seconds to do a good
"wipe" before I can run out to find the phone on the charger and get it
open to answer it.
(That's just one of many reasons I can think of......but a good one.)
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On Nov 14, 8:53 am, Opra <opra...@sonic.net> wrote:
> I just returned my G1. Nice phone for the most part, but two things about
> it killed the deal.
>
> 1) T-Mobile will not ring my phone for more than 30 seconds. When
> connect time is subtracted this means that I get an average of 2.5
> rings before the caller is forwarded to T-Mobile's voicemail network.
> Problem is I can't always answer the phone in that time.
>
> I tried having them disable voicemail but then the phone failed-over after
> 15 seconds. Compounding this hassle, callers always got a T-Mobile
> network message. Spent 2 painful hours on the phone with support
> (3 calls, 5 transfers, 45m on hold) and I finally reached a tech with
> "7 years" experience who said they cannot ring my phone more than 30
> seconds and will always fail over to a T-Mobile announcement regardless
> of any settings.
>
> You have to wonder what the logic to this is. Verizon rings for 60 seconds
> before going to busy (or voicemail, if enabled). Why would T-Mobile piss
> away perfectly good new customers for something like this?
>
> 2) The G1 will not play mp3s over bluetooth, not even in mono.
>
> Surely HTC/Google doesn't think my train mates appreciate having to
> listen to someone else's mp3s over tinny handheld speakers, unable to
> do something as simple as connect to a Jabra headphone... (at least it
> works for calls).
>
> Opra
GSM specifications say that the time that you can control for delay on
forward is either 5, 10, 15, 20, 25 or 30 seconds. Since T-Mobile is
a GSM operator that's what your choice is. 30 seconds is
approximately six rings. Most people if they don't get an answer
within 30 seconds will hang up. Some carriers such as AT&T will
charge you even if there's no answer if you let a call ring more than
30 seconds.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-15, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
> Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in
> news:slrnghuas2.64o.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.net:
>
>> They wouldn't. Why would you want to force people to listen to ringing
>> for 60 seconds?
>
> I might be on the crapper. It takes me longer than 60 seconds to do a good
> "wipe" before I can run out to find the phone on the charger and get it
> open to answer it.
>
> (That's just one of many reasons I can think of......but a good one.)
I understand that, but I sure as hell am not going to wait for 60 seconds
and I know plenty of other people who will give you maybe five or six rings
and then hang up.
It's not about convenience for you, it's about not irritating your callers.
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-16, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
> Todd Allcock <elecconnec@AnoOspamL.com> wrote in news:gfniv7$1v8$1
> @aioe.org:
>
>> As has been mentioned, it's a limitation of the GSM standard.
>
> AW hogwash. It reduces unpaid airtime tying up a channel if you don't
> answer it....
Ah, so you're an expert on GSM, are you? Have you ever used a GSM phone?
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On Nov 15, 4:47 pm, Steve Sobol <sjso...@JustThe.net> wrote:
> On 2008-11-15, Larry <no...@home.com> wrote:
>
> > Steve Sobol <sjso...@JustThe.net> wrote in
> >news:slrnghuas2.64o.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.ne t:
>
> >> They wouldn't. Why would you want to force people to listen to ringing
> >> for 60 seconds?
>
> > I might be on the crapper. It takes me longer than 60 seconds to do a good
> > "wipe" before I can run out to find the phone on the charger and get it
> > open to answer it.
>
> > (That's just one of many reasons I can think of......but a good one.)
>
> I understand that, but I sure as hell am not going to wait for 60 seconds
> and I know plenty of other people who will give you maybe five or six rings
> and then hang up.
>
> It's not about convenience for you, it's about not irritating your callers.
>
> --
> Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
> It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Oh, Steve but that's what it is! How else can you explain the "Caller
Tunes" service which aims to annoy people who don't have the same
taste as you do to be vexed anytime they call you.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-16, Joe Seattle <joeofseattle@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I understand that, but I sure as hell am not going to wait for 60 seconds
>> and I know plenty of other people who will give you maybe five or six rings
>> and then hang up.
>>
>> It's not about convenience for you, it's about not irritating your callers.
> Oh, Steve but that's what it is! How else can you explain the "Caller
> Tunes" service which aims to annoy people who don't have the same
> taste as you do to be vexed anytime they call you.
Good point
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in
news:slrngi0nmh.33i.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.net:
>> AW hogwash. It reduces unpaid airtime tying up a channel if you don't
>> answer it....
>
> Ah, so you're an expert on GSM, are you? Have you ever used a GSM phone?
>
>
> --
> Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
> It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
>
>
>
Every second on every channel ANY sellphone isn't being billed for airtime
or money is tracked and recorded and bureaucrats at the companies are
worrying over "REVENUE COLLECTIONS" for every microsecond.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Larry wrote:
> > As has been mentioned, it's a limitation of the GSM standard.
>
> AW hogwash. It reduces unpaid airtime tying up a channel if you don't
> answer it....
Only capacity on the signalling channel is used, no airtime. That is
the same channel which is used for SMS, where you have to pay (in Ger-
many) normally 0,19 EUR for 160 byte, that is a price per MB of
1570 USD. Okay, maybe "they" want to hold this channel free because of
that, but when GSM standard was formed nobody thought SMS was a product
you could earn money with. My thoughts go in this direction: who would
let it ring longer than 30 seconds? I wouldn't.
I can handle diverts by myself, but I have chosen to divert to voice-
mail after 30 seconds, because
- I don't want to talk with the caller (at this moment)
or
- it's not a good moment to answer the call
If it's worth it I'll call back. The same when it was a known number
without voice message. In general I don't answer calls with restricted
numbers because in most cases they want to sell me something.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Joe Seattle schrieb:
> Oh, Steve but that's what it is! How else can you explain the "Caller
> Tunes" service which aims to annoy people who don't have the same
> taste as you do to be vexed anytime they call you.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
"Larry" <noone@home.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9B58DFBF021E5noonehomecom@74.209.131.13...
> Every second on every channel ANY sellphone isn't being billed for airtime
> or money is tracked and recorded and bureaucrats at the companies are
> worrying over "REVENUE COLLECTIONS" for every microsecond.
Mobile operators in emerging nations (what we used to refer to as "the third
world" in less politically correct times) do worry about such things since
their customer base tries to work around them. In low-income areas like
Africa with "caller pays" systems, people using prepaid "flash" each other-
call and hang up immediately to avoid being charged for calls, and hope to
get the other person to call them back (on their dime) when they see the
missed call in their phone's log.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
Todd Allcock <elecconnec@anoospaml.com> wrote:
>
> "Larry" <noone@home.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns9B58DFBF021E5noonehomecom@74.209.131.13...
>
>> Every second on every channel ANY sellphone isn't being billed for airtime
>> or money is tracked and recorded and bureaucrats at the companies are
>> worrying over "REVENUE COLLECTIONS" for every microsecond.
>
> Mobile operators in emerging nations (what we used to refer to as "the third
> world" in less politically correct times) do worry about such things since
> their customer base tries to work around them. In low-income areas like
> Africa with "caller pays" systems, people using prepaid "flash" each other-
> call and hang up immediately to avoid being charged for calls, and hope to
> get the other person to call them back (on their dime) when they see the
> missed call in their phone's log.
>
> http://www.vodafone.com/flash/receiv...xcenter02.html
>
When I lived in Brazil this was about the most f*cking annoying
thing ever. They don't collect for approxmiately the first 3-5 seconds
of the call and if you disconnect before then it's not charged. This is
nice in that it eliminates the bullshit charge for hearing the first 1-2
seconds of voicemail when you weren't interested in leaving a message.
It's bad because you got the jackasses that kept calling repeatedly
in rapid succession trying to hold a conversation in 2 second blips. In
that situation I would have preferred to just pay to call them back on
my dime most of the time, but they typically were speed dialing so
quickly you couldn't manage to get a call in edgewise of they're think
you were playing the same game and hang right up after 2-3 seconds.
Also, this was the only place I had actually been were collect
calling from mobile to mobile was enabled by default, or even possible.
Basically what happens is they call, play some kooky musical tones, and
if you don't hang up in time they connect you and the call is charged to
you! First time it happened I didn't realize it until later, after
that, I had them disable this "feature" on my phone (which, they charged
me to disable!). You got some real jerks that ALWAYS tried to call
collect. To me, that's like a big disrespectful f*ck you, I want to
talk to you, but you should pay for the call. I wouldn't have minded
either if it was someone I knew well, was expecting their call, and had
let them know it was ok to do that in an emergency, but it happened all
the time.
Re: the charges for hearing a split second of voicemail
introduction then hanging up. For the most part, voicemail is a big
money grub from the carriers. I think many people would prefer to send
a text message if they can't reach the person at that moment. With
voicemail, the person calling is charged for the time, then they collect
money from the receiver when they have to retrieve it later as well.
The first 1-5 seconds of a call diverted to voicemail should not be
chargeable at all IMHO, nor should the time spent listening to annyoing
shit like that "on hold music while we try to connect you", that's just
another money grub from the carriers, charging the subscriber to enable
a service which in turn makes people pay for bogus airtime without
actually connecting the call to the intended party. This "music on
hold" crap should not signal the call as "connected" but rather as "in
progress" still, just as you aren't charged to listen to call intercept
messages on a disconnected number.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-17, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
> Every second on every channel ANY sellphone isn't being billed for airtime
> or money is tracked and recorded and bureaucrats at the companies are
> worrying over "REVENUE COLLECTIONS" for every microsecond.
Answer the question. Since you're insisting you're right about GSM, explain
to us some of the things you know about the GSM protocol.
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Re: Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone?
On 2008-11-19, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote:
> On 2008-11-17, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
>
>> Every second on every channel ANY sellphone isn't being billed for airtime
>> or money is tracked and recorded and bureaucrats at the companies are
>> worrying over "REVENUE COLLECTIONS" for every microsecond.
>
> Answer the question. Since you're insisting you're right about GSM, explain
> to us some of the things you know about the GSM protocol.
.... and two days later, he still hasn't replied.
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California, USA
It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.
Any way to get 60 seconds of ringing on a T-Mo phone? 
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