Verizon Fiber Optics

Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
Texas area?
Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
has VERIZON in its name.
TIA
jeff

On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:

>Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>Texas area?
>Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>has VERIZON in its name.
>TIA
>jeff
There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.

I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month

"Teddeli" <spam@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:7hmrh2pn9m08hvda59v2v1ug40ggke0k23@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>
>>Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>Texas area?
>>Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>has VERIZON in its name.
>>TIA
>>jeff
> There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
> through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>
> I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
> phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
> fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month

I'm in Carrollton, TX and I have FIOS Internet and TV.

I don't think I've had any downtime since FIOS was installed approx. 18
months ago.

TV picture is great. No complaints from me.

DM

Teddeli wrote:
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>
>> Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>> Texas area?
>> Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>> has VERIZON in its name.
>> TIA
>> jeff
> There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
> through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>
> I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
> phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
> fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month

What town in what state?

Lou

"Teddeli" <spam@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:7hmrh2pn9m08hvda59v2v1ug40ggke0k23@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>
>>Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>Texas area?
>>Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>has VERIZON in its name.
>>TIA
>>jeff
> There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
> through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>
> I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
> phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
> fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month

The Verizon FIOS newsgroup you speak of 'may' only be available to FIOS
subscribers. it doesn't appear in my list of newsgroups from Giganews.

PepperoniPizza wrote:
> "Teddeli" <spam@nospam.net> wrote in message
> news:7hmrh2pn9m08hvda59v2v1ug40ggke0k23@4ax.com...
>
>>On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>>Texas area?
>>>Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>>has VERIZON in its name.
>>>TIA
>>>jeff
>>
>>There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
>>through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>>
>>I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
>>phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
>>fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month
>
>
> The Verizon FIOS newsgroup you speak of 'may' only be available to FIOS
> subscribers. it doesn't appear in my list of newsgroups from Giganews.
>
>
>
There is a newsgroup that I believe I saw mentioned as only being
available on the verizon.net ISP news servers, 0.verizon.fios.

You can get a lot of info on Verizon FIOS on dslreports.com, and some of
it is a bit less than flattering - seems the same sort of FUD and
Verizon agent incompetence and ignorance is as rampant there as is
highlighted on this group frequently - something about that Verizon
"corporate culture" I guess.

ROC

On Sun, 01 Oct 2006 03:05:28 GMT, rocxspam <rocxspam@xspamx.no> wrote:

>PepperoniPizza wrote:
>> "Teddeli" <spam@nospam.net> wrote in message
>> news:7hmrh2pn9m08hvda59v2v1ug40ggke0k23@4ax.com...
>>
>>>On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>>>Texas area?
>>>>Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>>>has VERIZON in its name.
>>>>TIA
>>>>jeff
>>>
>>>There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
>>>through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>>>
>>>I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
>>>phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
>>>fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month
>>
>>
>> The Verizon FIOS newsgroup you speak of 'may' only be available to FIOS
>> subscribers. it doesn't appear in my list of newsgroups from Giganews.
>>
>>
>>
>There is a newsgroup that I believe I saw mentioned as only being
>available on the verizon.net ISP news servers, 0.verizon.fios.
>
>You can get a lot of info on Verizon FIOS on dslreports.com, and some of
>it is a bit less than flattering - seems the same sort of FUD and
>Verizon agent incompetence and ignorance is as rampant there as is
>highlighted on this group frequently - something about that Verizon
>"corporate culture" I guess.
>
>ROC
I just looked at the user reviews on the DSL reports page. Reports
I've read there and other forums compliment the installers. They seem
to be mostly positive. My experience has been excellent. What about
yours?

On Sun, 01 Oct 2006 21:36:27 GMT, Teddeli <spam@nospam.net> graced
this newsgroup with:


>>ROC
>I just looked at the user reviews on the DSL reports page. Reports
>I've read there and other forums compliment the installers. They seem
>to be mostly positive. My experience has been excellent. What about
>yours?


I have had all three FIOS services for about a year now
(TV/broadband/phone). I can't imagine ever going back to cable.

Where else will I get E3 speed (30/5) for $49 a month?

And FIOS TV is excellent. Much better than cable. Every channel is
clear and crisp and nearly HD quality (not to mention the HD
channels).

The DVR which you can only rent from Verizon (non-Verizon DVR's don't
work on FIOS), is mediocre as far as DVR's go but, hey, it's an HD DVR
that I rent for $12 a month. It'd take me over 6 years to break even
if I bought a high end HD DVR and I couldn't just swap it out if it
broke or malfunctioned like I can the rental.

Teddeli wrote:
> On Sun, 01 Oct 2006 03:05:28 GMT, rocxspam <rocxspam@xspamx.no> wrote:
>
>> PepperoniPizza wrote:
>>> "Teddeli" <spam@nospam.net> wrote in message
>>> news:7hmrh2pn9m08hvda59v2v1ug40ggke0k23@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>>>> Texas area?
>>>>> Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>>>> has VERIZON in its name.
>>>>> TIA
>>>>> jeff
>>>> There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
>>>> through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>>>>
>>>> I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
>>>> phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
>>>> fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month
>>>
>>> The Verizon FIOS newsgroup you speak of 'may' only be available to FIOS
>>> subscribers. it doesn't appear in my list of newsgroups from Giganews.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> There is a newsgroup that I believe I saw mentioned as only being
>> available on the verizon.net ISP news servers, 0.verizon.fios.
>>
>> You can get a lot of info on Verizon FIOS on dslreports.com, and some of
>> it is a bit less than flattering - seems the same sort of FUD and
>> Verizon agent incompetence and ignorance is as rampant there as is
>> highlighted on this group frequently - something about that Verizon
>> "corporate culture" I guess.
>>
>> ROC
> I just looked at the user reviews on the DSL reports page. Reports
> I've read there and other forums compliment the installers. They seem
> to be mostly positive. My experience has been excellent. What about
> yours?

No experience directly(no FIOS available in Durham, NC as yet). I was
referring to what I read in one of the FIOS threads on dslreports. It
seems a number of posters complained about the loss of copper landline
reliability during power outages - the FIOS service is dependent on
external power, and the UPS provided by Verizon (not in all cases it
seems, depending on the local policy?) only maintains continuous power
for about 4 hours. I have gone several days without power (ice storm,
hurricane Fran in '96), but the landline kept working most of that time
- very reassuring.

Several posters on that thread stated they were told the copper lines
HAD to be removed to get the FIOS, others said no such thing in their
case - seemed to be a matter of the knowledge level of particular
Verizon personnel. One striking case, as I recall, was a woman with
some kind of medical condtion that made reliable phone access a real
life or death proposition, and was mislead or lied to about the standby
reliablity of FIOS-based communications in that regard.

Makes me leery if FIOS ever becomes available here - I value reliability
over speed since I work from home fulltime via the internet (maintain
cable for primary access, and low-end 768/128 DSL for backup - have used
it a number of times lately, and hardly noticed the speed drop - long as
it's faster than dialup, but I have worked over that, too, when I did
not have the DSL installed ;-).

Sort of like old British sports cars and motorcycles: marvelous ... when
they were in running condition, but that was frequently not the case.

ROC

On Sun, 01 Oct 2006 22:50:49 GMT, rocxspam <nospam@xspamx.no> wrote:

>Teddeli wrote:
>> On Sun, 01 Oct 2006 03:05:28 GMT, rocxspam <rocxspam@xspamx.no> wrote:
>>
>>> PepperoniPizza wrote:
>>>> "Teddeli" <spam@nospam.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:7hmrh2pn9m08hvda59v2v1ug40ggke0k23@4ax.com...
>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 02:03:43 GMT, jeff <jeff@klippes.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>>>>> Texas area?
>>>>>> Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>>>>> has VERIZON in its name.
>>>>>> TIA
>>>>>> jeff
>>>>> There is a Verizon FIOS newsgroup. Oddly enough I can't access it
>>>>> through Agent but can access it through Outlook express.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am in the NY area and have switched to Verizon FIOS TV Internet and
>>>>> phone. Picture is much clearer than cable, internet is at a steady
>>>>> fast speed. Between the three I am saving $50/month
>>>>
>>>> The Verizon FIOS newsgroup you speak of 'may' only be available to FIOS
>>>> subscribers. it doesn't appear in my list of newsgroups from Giganews.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> There is a newsgroup that I believe I saw mentioned as only being
>>> available on the verizon.net ISP news servers, 0.verizon.fios.
>>>
>>> You can get a lot of info on Verizon FIOS on dslreports.com, and some of
>>> it is a bit less than flattering - seems the same sort of FUD and
>>> Verizon agent incompetence and ignorance is as rampant there as is
>>> highlighted on this group frequently - something about that Verizon
>>> "corporate culture" I guess.
>>>
>>> ROC
>> I just looked at the user reviews on the DSL reports page. Reports
>> I've read there and other forums compliment the installers. They seem
>> to be mostly positive. My experience has been excellent. What about
>> yours?
>
>No experience directly(no FIOS available in Durham, NC as yet). I was
>referring to what I read in one of the FIOS threads on dslreports. It
>seems a number of posters complained about the loss of copper landline
>reliability during power outages - the FIOS service is dependent on
>external power, and the UPS provided by Verizon (not in all cases it
>seems, depending on the local policy?) only maintains continuous power
>for about 4 hours. I have gone several days without power (ice storm,
>hurricane Fran in '96), but the landline kept working most of that time
>- very reassuring.

In a power outage your TV and internet are going to go out whether you
have FIOS or cable. It is true the fiber optic phone will only work
with the FIOS battery backoup. They claim 4 hrs of talk time but I'll
believe that when I see it. You can take the internet and TV package
and keep the copper phone line but you do not get the discounts unless
you take all three.
>
>Several posters on that thread stated they were told the copper lines
>HAD to be removed to get the FIOS, others said no such thing in their
>case - seemed to be a matter of the knowledge level of particular
>Verizon personnel. One striking case, as I recall, was a woman with
>some kind of medical condtion that made reliable phone access a real
>life or death proposition, and was mislead or lied to about the standby
>reliablity of FIOS-based communications in that regard.

I had existing copper cable wires in my house. The fiber optic signal
goes as far as the installed box on my house.The rest of the signal is
transmitted through the existing copper. They replaced the splitters
with better ones This is not the case with ATT's fiber otpic
service.It goes to the edge of the neighborhood and the rest of the
way on copper.


>Makes me leery if FIOS ever becomes available here - I value reliability
>over speed since I work from home fulltime via the internet (maintain
>cable for primary access, and low-end 768/128 DSL for backup - have used
>it a number of times lately, and hardly noticed the speed drop - long as
>it's faster than dialup, but I have worked over that, too, when I did
>not have the DSL installed ;-).

I was one of the first internet customers of the hated Cablevision.
They had a lot of growing pains in the beginning as I am sure FIOS
will. Cablevision's reliability became very good. TV and internet on
FIOS are far better than my previous cable connection not to mention
the $50/month I'm saving

As we are not heavy phone users the battery backup cabability is not
an issue.. I think you should at least look into it if and when it
becomes available in your area.
>
>Sort of like old British sports cars and motorcycles: marvelous ... when
>they were in running condition, but that was frequently not the case.
>
>ROC

"jeff" <jeff@klippes.com> wrote in message
news:3gkTg.6002$TV3.5755@newssvr21.news.prodigy.co m...
> Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
> Texas area?
> Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
> has VERIZON in its name.
> TIA
> jeff
>

I don't live in Texas, however where I live in Maryland has access to the
whole package. A few of my coworkers have the FIOS internet and have raved
about it. The one complaint one of my friends has is that she can't pry her
husband off to get on herself.

Theoretically I would know more tomorrow, I am scheduled to have FIOS
installed. Whether they will make the target date, I don't know, they
haven't run the fiber from the junction box three doors down, to our house.
It has to be done underground as utilities are buried here.

At the present, we are electing to just get the internet. Presently, we
have DirecTV with two DirecTivos. To match the service with the two DVRs
would be more expensive with Verizon and I don't want to mess with something
that is working.

Thanks to all who responded, service is being installed on 18 October.
I will post when it is completed to let all know what I think.
jeff


Carl Keehn wrote:
> "jeff" <jeff@klippes.com> wrote in message
> news:3gkTg.6002$TV3.5755@newssvr21.news.prodigy.co m...
>
>>Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
>>Texas area?
>>Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
>>has VERIZON in its name.
>>TIA
>>jeff
>>
>
>
> I don't live in Texas, however where I live in Maryland has access to the
> whole package. A few of my coworkers have the FIOS internet and have raved
> about it. The one complaint one of my friends has is that she can't pry her
> husband off to get on herself.
>
> Theoretically I would know more tomorrow, I am scheduled to have FIOS
> installed. Whether they will make the target date, I don't know, they
> haven't run the fiber from the junction box three doors down, to our house.
> It has to be done underground as utilities are buried here.
>
> At the present, we are electing to just get the internet. Presently, we
> have DirecTV with two DirecTivos. To match the service with the two DVRs
> would be more expensive with Verizon and I don't want to mess with something
> that is working.
>
>

In article <dDXTg.77184$lk6.32678@tornado.southeast.rr.com> , rocxspam wrote:

> No experience directly(no FIOS available in Durham, NC as yet). I was
> referring to what I read in one of the FIOS threads on dslreports. It
> seems a number of posters complained about the loss of copper landline
> reliability during power outages - the FIOS service is dependent on
> external power, and the UPS provided by Verizon (not in all cases it
> seems, depending on the local policy?) only maintains continuous power
> for about 4 hours. I have gone several days without power (ice storm,
> hurricane Fran in '96), but the landline kept working most of that time
> - very reassuring.

Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
decades... and also is a FiOS customer.

He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.

Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
regulated and the fiber isn't.



--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek ** Java/VB/VC/PHP/Perl ** Linux/*BSD/Windows
Apple Valley, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED

It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.

"Steven J. Sobol" <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in message
news:slrnei29sj.q1j.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.net.. .
> In article <dDXTg.77184$lk6.32678@tornado.southeast.rr.com> , rocxspam
> wrote:
>
>> No experience directly(no FIOS available in Durham, NC as yet). I was
>> referring to what I read in one of the FIOS threads on dslreports. It
>> seems a number of posters complained about the loss of copper landline
>> reliability during power outages - the FIOS service is dependent on
>> external power, and the UPS provided by Verizon (not in all cases it
>> seems, depending on the local policy?) only maintains continuous power
>> for about 4 hours. I have gone several days without power (ice storm,
>> hurricane Fran in '96), but the landline kept working most of that time
>> - very reassuring.
>
> Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
> do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
> decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>
> He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>
> Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
> regulated and the fiber isn't.
>

Actually, a big reason for them to ditch copper is that fiber is a lot
more reliable and requires less upkeep (i.e. expensive staff) than copper.
We heard in the Tampa market that when fiber reaches a certain penetration
level, they plan to ditch copper altogether. I've also seen some new homes
that appear not to have any copper. In short, at some point, we are likely
to eventually lose the power outage reliability of good on POT. I might
suggest addinng a bigger UPS to the FIOS box or a generator.

On Mon, 2 Oct 2006 14:52:03 +0000 (UTC), "Steven J. Sobol"
<sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote:

>In article <dDXTg.77184$lk6.32678@tornado.southeast.rr.com> , rocxspam wrote:
>
>> No experience directly(no FIOS available in Durham, NC as yet). I was
>> referring to what I read in one of the FIOS threads on dslreports. It
>> seems a number of posters complained about the loss of copper landline
>> reliability during power outages - the FIOS service is dependent on
>> external power, and the UPS provided by Verizon (not in all cases it
>> seems, depending on the local policy?) only maintains continuous power
>> for about 4 hours. I have gone several days without power (ice storm,
>> hurricane Fran in '96), but the landline kept working most of that time
>> - very reassuring.
>
>Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
>do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>
>He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>
>Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>regulated and the fiber isn't.

The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
including my cable wires.

Aside from the fact that a power outage may affect my landline service
with fiber optic I don't see the real disadvantage to it. In my case I
am getting better service for less money.

"jeff" <jeff@klippes.com> wrote

> Thanks to all who responded, service is being installed on 18 October.
> I will post when it is completed to let all know what I think.
> jeff

I'm sure it will be a great service. I probably won't get it until I'm in a
wheelchair though, 'cause I live in the sticks.

> Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
> Texas area?
> Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
> has VERIZON in its name.
> TIA
> jeff

There is a thread dedicated to Verizon FIOS users at www.avsforum.com
Highly recommended.

-- Paul

In article <e6o2i2ljco7kuc672kp3sssdfi6i777v3o@4ax.com>, Teddeli wrote:

>>Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
>>do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>>decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>>
>>He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>>
>>Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>>regulated and the fiber isn't.
>
> The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
> the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
> the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
> with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
> including my cable wires.

Are you sure about that?

> Aside from the fact that a power outage may affect my landline service
> with fiber optic I don't see the real disadvantage to it. In my case I
> am getting better service for less money.

I don't like the fact that it's not regulated. Phone companies can and will
screw you whenever they can. Verizon, granted, seems to be much better than
SBC, but they're all anticompetitive, anti-consumer beasts.


--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek ** Java/VB/VC/PHP/Perl ** Linux/*BSD/Windows
Apple Valley, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED

It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.

Steven J. Sobol wrote:
> In article <e6o2i2ljco7kuc672kp3sssdfi6i777v3o@4ax.com>, Teddeli wrote:
>
>>> Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
>>> do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>>> decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>>>
>>> He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>>>
>>> Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>>> regulated and the fiber isn't.
>> The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
>> the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
>> the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
>> with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
>> including my cable wires.
>
> Are you sure about that?
>
>> Aside from the fact that a power outage may affect my landline service
>> with fiber optic I don't see the real disadvantage to it. In my case I
>> am getting better service for less money.
>
> I don't like the fact that it's not regulated. Phone companies can and will
> screw you whenever they can. Verizon, granted, seems to be much better than
> SBC, but they're all anticompetitive, anti-consumer beasts.
>
>

Yabut they are now in direct competition with the cable outfits.

That is good for consumers.

Lou

On Tue, 3 Oct 2006 18:42:10 +0000 (UTC), "Steven J. Sobol"
<sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote:

>In article <e6o2i2ljco7kuc672kp3sssdfi6i777v3o@4ax.com>, Teddeli wrote:
>
>>>Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
>>>do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>>>decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>>>
>>>He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>>>
>>>Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>>>regulated and the fiber isn't.
>>
>> The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
>> the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
>> the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
>> with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
>> including my cable wires.
>
>Are you sure about that?
>
>> Aside from the fact that a power outage may affect my landline service
>> with fiber optic I don't see the real disadvantage to it. In my case I
>> am getting better service for less money.
>
>I don't like the fact that it's not regulated. Phone companies can and will
>screw you whenever they can. Verizon, granted, seems to be much better than
>SBC, but they're all anticompetitive, anti-consumer beasts.

I am absolutely sure. I watched the installation from beginning to
end. The fiber optic from the telephone line is connected to the new
box on the outside of my house. From there they installed a new fiber
line to the free router provided by Verizon. My old copper cable
connection is connected to the router as well. All the TV's run on
cable wire. The tech actually rearranged some of the copper telephone
wires that were causing a hum in my old system so that it would not
affect the new installation. No copper or old telephone wire was
removed other than the line from the outside line to my house.

I'm actually paying less for landline service including all calls to
US and territories than I was paying for regional calling on copper.

BTW, any word on deployment in New Jersey, as in northwestern NJ? We were
the last people on earth to get internet service. It would be a gas if we
were among the first to receive fiber to the home.

adp

"jeff" <jeff@klippes.com> wrote in message
news:3gkTg.6002$TV3.5755@newssvr21.news.prodigy.co m...
> Does anyone have any experience with Verizon Fiber Optics in the Dallas,
> Texas area?
> Sorry, if posted incorrectly, this is the ONLY group I can locate that
> has VERIZON in its name.
> TIA
> jeff
>

On Tue, 3 Oct 2006 18:42:10 +0000 (UTC), "Steven J. Sobol"
<sjsobol@JustThe.net> graced this newsgroup with:

>In article <e6o2i2ljco7kuc672kp3sssdfi6i777v3o@4ax.com>, Teddeli wrote:
>
>>>Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
>>>do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>>>decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>>>
>>>He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>>>
>>>Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>>>regulated and the fiber isn't.
>>
>> The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
>> the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
>> the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
>> with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
>> including my cable wires.
>
>Are you sure about that?
>


with me, they just snipped the copper coming into the house and then
connected the fiber to the phone system. If I ever wanted to switch
back, I'd just have to have the copper reconnected. Not biggie.

In article <4522CB9F.6060603@optonline.net>, Lou wrote:

> Yabut they are now in direct competition with the cable outfits.
>
> That is good for consumers.

Only if you think cable carriers are also greedy, anti-competitive beasts.
Which to some extent, they are.


--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek ** Java/VB/VC/PHP/Perl ** Linux/*BSD/Windows
Apple Valley, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED

It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.

Steven J. Sobol wrote:
> In article <e6o2i2ljco7kuc672kp3sssdfi6i777v3o@4ax.com>, Teddeli wrote:
>
>>> Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them not to
>>> do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>>> decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>>>
>>> He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>>>
>>> Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>>> regulated and the fiber isn't.
>> The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
>> the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
>> the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
>> with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
>> including my cable wires.
>
> Are you sure about that?


That sounds like every FiOS install I have seen. The media converter
(can't remember the term they use) has connections for POTS, Ethernet
and coaxial cable for the TVs. They remove the copper service drop and
connect the existing copper premise lines to that unit.



>
>> Aside from the fact that a power outage may affect my landline service
>> with fiber optic I don't see the real disadvantage to it. In my case I
>> am getting better service for less money.
>
> I don't like the fact that it's not regulated. Phone companies can and will
> screw you whenever they can. Verizon, granted, seems to be much better than
> SBC, but they're all anticompetitive, anti-consumer beasts.
>
>

Ange1o DePa1ma wrote:
> BTW, any word on deployment in New Jersey, as in northwestern NJ? We were
> the last people on earth to get internet service. It would be a gas if we
> were among the first to receive fiber to the home.
>

I suspect a lot of areas (including mine) may never see it. Verizon is
taking a lot of flak about the money they are spending to deploy FiOS. I
read that their minimum cost/subscriber such as in an optimum area (all
overhead, close spacing of homes etc) is $2,000. The question is whether
that is a good investment.

I would have thought the number would be higher than that!

If all they can sell high speed internet service it would probably be break
even (assuming $40/month/customer = 50-month payback). But the great thing
about fiber is the breathtaking bandwidth. Video on demand and VOIP services
added to Internet access should make it quite profitable. I would sign up in
an instant.

"George" <george@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:TeKdnapJ5JX-NL7YnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d@adelphia.com...
> Ange1o DePa1ma wrote:
>> BTW, any word on deployment in New Jersey, as in northwestern NJ? We were
>> the last people on earth to get internet service. It would be a gas if we
>> were among the first to receive fiber to the home.
>>
>
> I suspect a lot of areas (including mine) may never see it. Verizon is
> taking a lot of flak about the money they are spending to deploy FiOS. I
> read that their minimum cost/subscriber such as in an optimum area (all
> overhead, close spacing of homes etc) is $2,000. The question is whether
> that is a good investment.

Steven J. Sobol <sjsobol@justthe.net> wrote:
> In article <4522CB9F.6060603@optonline.net>, Lou wrote:
>
>> Yabut they are now in direct competition with the cable outfits.
>>
>> That is good for consumers.
>
> Only if you think cable carriers are also greedy, anti-competitive beasts.
> Which to some extent, they are.
>

Absolutely they are! The raise their rates faster than all other competitors,
at least, in the Twin Cities area. My Father used to take for granted that he
had cable and DBS was too expensive, he never even looked at it. It took
years of convincing, but finally the DirecTV Tivo did it ;-)

--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1

George wrote:
> Steven J. Sobol wrote:
>
>> In article <e6o2i2ljco7kuc672kp3sssdfi6i777v3o@4ax.com>, Teddeli wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> Verizon WILL remove your copper PERMANENTLY if you don't tell them
>>>> not to
>>>> do so. This comes from a friend of mine who was a telco consultant for
>>>> decades... and also is a FiOS customer.
>>>>
>>>> He told them "don't do it" and they didn't do it.
>>>> Verizon would also very much like to remove the copper because it is
>>>> regulated and the fiber isn't.
>>>
>>> The only thing that was removed from my house was the copper line from
>>> the outside wire to my house and the old phone connection box also on
>>> the outside. Seems easily replacable. The copper wire was replaced
>>> with the fiber optic. All lines inside my house remain copper
>>> including my cable wires.
>>
>>
>> Are you sure about that?
>
>
>
> That sounds like every FiOS install I have seen. The media converter
> (can't remember the term they use) has connections for POTS, Ethernet
> and coaxial cable for the TVs. They remove the copper service drop and
> connect the existing copper premise lines to that unit.
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>> Aside from the fact that a power outage may affect my landline service
>>> with fiber optic I don't see the real disadvantage to it. In my case I
>>> am getting better service for less money.
>>
>>
>> I don't like the fact that it's not regulated. Phone companies can and
>> will
>> screw you whenever they can. Verizon, granted, seems to be much better
>> than
>> SBC, but they're all anticompetitive, anti-consumer beasts.
>>
>>

Ah, but the key "point of no return" is that the EXTERNAL copper is
removed, and WILL NOT be replaced, no matter what - as happened with the
lady requiring reliable communications for a medical condition mentioned
on the dslreports thread I mentioned early in this thread. She was SoL
when she found out she could not make a help call if she had a medical
emergency during a long power outage, and then wanted to undo the FIOS deal.

My sticking point is reliability, not speed, so I would certainly resist
any inducements to give up my landline (IF FIOS ever gets here - hoping
it won't). DSL over copper is a quite adequate backup for my primary
internet connection over cable (fast enough for me), and DOES stay up
through moderate-duration power outages (several days) in which FIOS
would not (from what I understand).

I understand the strategy is to stop maintaining the copper, so
eventually it will degrade to unreliable conditions (corrosion of wiring
connections would seem to be main culprit). The double "bonus" for
Verizon would be eliminating that maintenance cost, and gaining revenue
from all the FIOS installations that would be replacing the copper -
and, I suppose, a 3rd bonus of no regulation ... so far.

I would think any public utility type commission would then have to
consider bringing it under their purview if FIOS becomes the only
"public" telecommunications medium by such default - not that I have any
great faith in a government agency looking out for the individual
consumer, as witness the FCC and the cell phone industry (guess that's
something in this thread finally on-topic for this NG ;-).

With only cable for competition (I've already laughed them off the call
when the sales schmuck suggested I replace my landline with their
digital phone: " and how would I call you for service when cable is
out??? Hahahaha..."), that is an oligopoly, and thus not much
inducement to competition, but more to price-fixing and territory
division, more often in collusion with regulators in the name of
"orderly markets". See this illustrative definition of "Collusive
Oligopoly" (from a South Afican site of all places ;-):
http://www.compcom.co.za/thelaw/thel....asp?level=3#6

Oh well, technology advances will never overcome our permament human
institutional failings, so we have to remain vigilent.

ROC

rocxspam wrote:
>
>
> Ah, but the key "point of no return" is that the EXTERNAL copper is
> removed, and WILL NOT be replaced, no matter what - as happened with the
> lady requiring reliable communications for a medical condition mentioned
> on the dslreports thread I mentioned early in this thread. She was SoL
> when she found out she could not make a help call if she had a medical
> emergency during a long power outage, and then wanted to undo the FIOS
> deal.


There are ways to address that such as adding a UPS in addition to the
battery that is supplied with the FiOS install. An inexpensive UPS would
easily keep the line up for 3 or 4 days. Or to stay on a topic
appropriate to the VZW group get a cellphone that uses a carrier that
has batteries, generators and all sorts of redundant stuff in their
system. The only carrier I know of that does that is VZW.

I have no interest in Verizon but I can certainly understand them
wanting to get rid of the copper.

If someone has a medical problem or other issue where they need a
reliable phone the time to bring that up would be before ordering
whatever the new service might be.



>
> My sticking point is reliability, not speed, so I would certainly resist
> any inducements to give up my landline (IF FIOS ever gets here - hoping
> it won't). DSL over copper is a quite adequate backup for my primary
> internet connection over cable (fast enough for me), and DOES stay up
> through moderate-duration power outages (several days) in which FIOS
> would not (from what I understand).


My understanding of FiOS is that it only requires power on each end. The
CO side has batteries and generators so as long as you can keep your
side up with a UPS or generator it will work.

>
> I understand the strategy is to stop maintaining the copper, so
> eventually it will degrade to unreliable conditions (corrosion of wiring
> connections would seem to be main culprit). The double "bonus" for
> Verizon would be eliminating that maintenance cost, and gaining revenue
> from all the FIOS installations that would be replacing the copper -
> and, I suppose, a 3rd bonus of no regulation ... so far.
>
> I would think any public utility type commission would then have to
> consider bringing it under their purview if FIOS becomes the only
> "public" telecommunications medium by such default - not that I have any
> great faith in a government agency looking out for the individual
> consumer, as witness the FCC and the cell phone industry (guess that's
> something in this thread finally on-topic for this NG ;-).
>
> With only cable for competition (I've already laughed them off the call
> when the sales schmuck suggested I replace my landline with their
> digital phone: " and how would I call you for service when cable is
> out??? Hahahaha..."), that is an oligopoly, and thus not much
> inducement to competition, but more to price-fixing and territory
> division, more often in collusion with regulators in the name of
> "orderly markets". See this illustrative definition of "Collusive
> Oligopoly" (from a South Afican site of all places ;-):
> http://www.compcom.co.za/thelaw/thel....asp?level=3#6
>
> Oh well, technology advances will never overcome our permament human
> institutional failings, so we have to remain vigilent.
>
> ROC

In article <3eSdneSq1vmBd77YnZ2dnUVZ_rudnZ2d@adelphia.com>, George wrote:

> If someone has a medical problem or other issue where they need a
> reliable phone the time to bring that up would be before ordering
> whatever the new service might be.

Wrong - part of the sales script should be "do you have a medical
condition or other situation which may require working phones during
a protracted power outage?"

One day, someone is going to die as a result of FIOS phones not being
available, and Verizon is going to get sued, probably for a large sum
of money. A simple question or two could help them avoid that situation.


--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek ** Java/VB/VC/PHP/Perl ** Linux/*BSD/Windows
Apple Valley, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED

It's all fun and games until someone starts a bonfire in the living room.