Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer. Discuss Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer, on Wireless Forums.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Thu, 17 May 2012 12:06:08 -0400, ?@gmail.not wrote:
>On Wed, 16 May 2012 18:06:14 -0700, Jeff Grossman
><jeff.nospam@stikman.com> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 16 May 2012 17:12:41 -0500, tycho wrote:
>>
>>>See several sites reporting same:
>>>
>>>http://www.mobileburn.com/19608/news...ted-data-plans
>>>
>>>http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/16/v...lshare_twitter
>>>
>>>http://androidcommunity.com/verizon-...mmer-20120516/
>>>
>>What a bummer. I was probably going to get rid of the unlimited plan
>>anyway and move to the family share data plans when they become
>>available. I don't really use that much data for myself anyway, so
>>the unlimited was kind of a waste. The data share plans will be a
>>better option for me when they become available.
>>
>>Jeff
>>
>Try a one-stop choice: www.consumercellular.com NO CONTRACT!
If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
their cell network?
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
"AJL" <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com> wrote in message
news:g0tar79j3mvs7tlienen5sro54fsfisntv@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 17 May 2012 14:35:12 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
>
>>Or pagepluscellular.com for much less than that.
>
> If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
> Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
> their cell network?
I suspect that decision has already been made, but not implemented. Also
read somewhere that the demise of unlimited data is for 4G LTE phones only
at this point in time. 3G will continue unlimited.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Thu, 17 May 2012 16:36:44 -0700, "stevev" <pox19875@gmail.com>
wrote:
>"AJL" <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com> wrote in message
>> If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>> Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>> their cell network?
>
>I suspect that decision has already been made, but not implemented.
After the recent discussion here I was rethinking my position (no
jokes please) and looked at the Pageplus site. But with my luck as
soon as I signed up, they would leave the Verizon network and that's
really the only one that seems to have good coverage in my area.
> Also
>read somewhere that the demise of unlimited data is for 4G LTE phones only
>at this point in time. 3G will continue unlimited.
Well the OP's three links seem to say that. But that apparently means
I will have to keep my somewhat long in the tooth 3G HTC Incredible. I
do have the Unlimited on it but I think the most I've ever used is
just over 1G and usually I'm under 200M so for me when the downgrade
does finally happen it will be mostly psychological. That is I feel
like I'm getting screwed but probably am not...
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Thu, 17 May 2012 15:03:02 -0700, AJL <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com>
wrote:
>On Thu, 17 May 2012 14:35:12 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
>
>>Or pagepluscellular.com for much less than that.
>
>If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>their cell network?
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Thu, 17 May 2012 18:27:02 -0700, AJL <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com>
wrote:
>On Thu, 17 May 2012 16:36:44 -0700, "stevev" <pox19875@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>"AJL" <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com> wrote in message
>
>>> If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>>> Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>>> their cell network?
>>
>>I suspect that decision has already been made, but not implemented.
>
>After the recent discussion here I was rethinking my position (no
>jokes please) and looked at the Pageplus site. But with my luck as
>soon as I signed up, they would leave the Verizon network and that's
>really the only one that seems to have good coverage in my area.
And so you'll pay a lot more to another carrier that might do the same
thing?
>
>> Also
>>read somewhere that the demise of unlimited data is for 4G LTE phones only
>>at this point in time. 3G will continue unlimited.
>
>Well the OP's three links seem to say that. But that apparently means
>I will have to keep my somewhat long in the tooth 3G HTC Incredible. I
>do have the Unlimited on it but I think the most I've ever used is
>just over 1G and usually I'm under 200M so for me when the downgrade
>does finally happen it will be mostly psychological. That is I feel
>like I'm getting screwed but probably am not...
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Thu, 17 May 2012 18:27:02 -0700, AJL <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com>
wrote:
>On Thu, 17 May 2012 16:36:44 -0700, "stevev" <pox19875@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>"AJL" <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com> wrote in message
>
>>> If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>>> Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>>> their cell network?
>>
>>I suspect that decision has already been made, but not implemented.
>
>After the recent discussion here I was rethinking my position (no
>jokes please) and looked at the Pageplus site. But with my luck as
>soon as I signed up, they would leave the Verizon network and that's
>really the only one that seems to have good coverage in my area.
>
If one company is the only company with good coverage, then there is
no other choice. We travel the highways a lot more than average and
it seems by all I've talked to that it is rare for any company to have
coverage where all others do not. In fact my wife and I have seperate
providers (if one doesn't work, the other one will - hopefully)
On the other hand, (there is generally at least two) my daughter just
went through an issue with Verizon. She and her husband wanted to
upgrade and they were not giving the same considerations for an
existing customer as they were a new customer. She had to go ahead and
let her account cancel out, her husband had to reopen a new one and
then received the better deals. (That's not new either) What came
next is also not new. Their phones worked quite well as long as they
were not at home. Unfortunately they keep and maintain a land line
because neither cell would work at home. The good news: The issue was
resolved but only after sending and resending new simms cards until
they had two that would work. Unfortunately, I went through that with
Verizon at two of my residences. We finally gave up and went to AT&T.
Pricing was about the same but we did get service everywhere even at
home. My wife changed to T-Mobile. No complaints. I had one other
issue with Verizon or was it Q-West? Frankly, I don't know. I do know
that I was unable to get them to bundle my services. Q-West said it
was Verizon's fault and Verizon of course blamed Q'West. Regardless,
over a 4 year period, the two services were never bundled and both
companies were undeniably indifferent over the issue. I was more upset
with Q-West. I was a customer for over 30 years, before Q-West it
was Mountain Bell, before that just AT&T until an idiot democrat made
them split up which ended up costing us and not saving us money. I
was unable to get Q-West to make it right. Now Q-West is a now
Century Link and I do not use them. Great business. Piss off as many
as you can, change the name and start over again. Brilliant.
>> Also
>>read somewhere that the demise of unlimited data is for 4G LTE phones only
>>at this point in time. 3G will continue unlimited.
>
>Well the OP's three links seem to say that. But that apparently means
>I will have to keep my somewhat long in the tooth 3G HTC Incredible. I
>do have the Unlimited on it but I think the most I've ever used is
>just over 1G and usually I'm under 200M so for me when the downgrade
>does finally happen it will be mostly psychological. That is I feel
>like I'm getting screwed but probably am not...
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On 5/17/2012 3:03 PM, AJL wrote:
> On Thu, 17 May 2012 14:35:12 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
>
>> Or pagepluscellular.com for much less than that.
>
> If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
> Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
> their cell network?
I think that the death knell for Pageplus will come when 3G and CDMA are
turned off in favor of LTE, and Verizon chooses to not offer LTE to
MVNOs. But that is probably 7-10 years away.
Pageplus allows Verizon to keep those pesky low ARPU customers out of
their financial results while still selling to them. Businesses are
always looking for ways to sell their products through multiple channels
at different prices.
>On Thu, 17 May 2012 15:03:02 -0700, AJL <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com>
>wrote:
>>If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>>Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>>their cell network?
>
>As can any carrier. What's the point?
Except Verizon. I doubt they would kick themselves off their own
network. You'll have to read back in the thread to understand the
point.
>And so you'll pay a lot more to another carrier that might do the same
>thing?
The difference was pocket change, less than price of one soda a day so
why the hassle? YMMV. But you'll have to read back in the thread to
get the whole picture.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Fri, 18 May 2012 09:02:01 -0400, ?@gmail.not wrote:
>If one company is the only company with good coverage, then there is
>no other choice.
Course that is always changing (at least in my area). I see new cell
towers popping up all the time. My contract's up in 4 months so we'll
see...
>my daughter just went through an issue with Verizon...
>and then received the better deals.
Same with my granddaughter. Verizon had rules that couldn't be broken
but then the rep found a way to break them and all ended happy.
>Unfortunately, I went through that [problem] with
>Verizon at two of my residences.
Yes some are lucky and some not. It took my kid three trips to the
Verizon store to get his new smartphone working right. Me, I've had
one billing problem in 15 years which was resolved quickly in my
favor. Guess I'm one of the lucky ones (knocking on wood)...
>I was a customer for over 30 years, before Q-West it
>was Mountain Bell, before that just AT&T...
>Q-West is a now Century Link and I do not use them.
Sounds like my history. AT&T>Mountain Bell>Qwest>Century Link. And
think it was more like 40 years for me. But I recently jumped ship for
a Cox bundle (TV-landline-ISP). In my case the bundle was cheaper and
the service better cause Century Link could only provide DSL service.
BTW I see Cox bundling with Verizon back east. Maybe an even better
deal is coming my way...
>Great business. Piss off as many
>as you can, change the name and start over again. Brilliant.
And I lost a bit on the stock too... although I recently got a $40
class action settlement check but heck at least I helped employ a few
lawyers (who got millions)...
Why? Pandora is actually a pretty low-bandwidth service compared to other
streaming services. It uses about 30-50MB of data per hour (on mobiles,
and consequently sound pretty crappy.) Free Pandora users are limited to
40 hours a month anyway, so at best they could only consume about 2GB of
data if they maxed out their usage and never used it at home or on WiFi.
Compare that to Netflix, which can burn 300MB or more/hour.
Wireless is still in a state of flux. They stupidly offered "unlimited
data" in a desperate attempt to increase adoption of their underutilized
infrastructure, back when consumers were afraid of, or confused by, early
tiered data plans. (Remember when cell phone brochures had little charts
telling you how many WAP pages and/or emails would fit in a megabyte?
Now they're back telling us how many web pages, photos, songs, or movies
fit in a GB!)
Unlimited removed the fear of pricey overages, and besides, phones
couldn't actually consume much data, could they? When I first subscribed
to T-Mo data back in 2003 or so, they offered two GPRS data plans: $1.99
for 1MB, and $4.99 for unlimited. (They eventually rose to $2.99 and $5.99.
I'm still on that $6 plan today!) The fact that "unlimited" only cost 2-
3 times what 1MB cost gives us an idea how much data they really thought
"unlimited" actually represented! Even when the first iPhone launched
with a mandatory "unlimited" data plan, the average smartphone used well
under 100MB/month.
After smartphones jumped from the enterprise to the consumer, and became
media devices, they actually started using a lot of data. As networks
became faster, the media experience became better, data usage continued
to increase, and "unlimited" data became untenable for carriers.
What's really needed are realistic tiered charges for data. It's silly
selling consumers only two disparate data buckets like AT&T does; 250MB
or 3GB. One is too small for most users, and one too large., Imagine if
restaurants only sold two sizes of soft drink: 4 ounces and 4 gallons,
then they charged a ridiculous amount for refills. Everyone would buy
the 4 gallon size, consume only 20 ounces, and feel cheated they had to
overbuy to avoid pensive refill charges, and they likely forced down
twice what they really wanted to drink to maximize their forced investment.
That business model would be insane in that setting, but it happens in
cellular every day.
As I've said before, if capacity really was big an issue as the carriers'
whine, they should sell data "by the pound." No plans- everyone pays
$0.01-0.02/MB ($10-20/G Of course they'd never do that- their business
model is predicated on selling that large bucket of data that only 2% of
their customers actually use up, but the other 98% purchase out of fear
of overages. All data a la carte, at a reasonable fee, would encourage
conservation, and end the "spectrum crunch" visually instantly, without
building a single new cell site.
OTOH, maybe the cellular model is brilliant. I can envision a chain of
gas stations offing unlimited* fuel for $1000/month...
(*"Fair usage" limits apply. Unlimited fuel is intended for one driver in
one vehicle only, for personal, non-commercial use in your home network
of filling stations. Roaming fuel may be purchased for $5.99/gallon, and
may not be available in all areas. Unlimited plan for fuel efficient
vehicles only. Users attempting to use unlimited fuel plan on unapproved
vehicles will be automatically re-rated to an appropriate plan for that
vehicle type. Unlimited fuel may not be siphoned off for use in other
vehicles. Vehicles on unlimited fuel plan may not tow other vehicles or
trailers. Other restrictions apply, see store for details...)
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
At 18 May 2012 09:14:45 -0700 SMS wrote:
> On 5/17/2012 3:03 PM, AJL wrote:
> > On Thu, 17 May 2012 14:35:12 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
> >
> >> Or pagepluscellular.com for much less than that.
> >
> > If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
> > Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
> > their cell network?
>
> I think that the death knell for Pageplus will come when 3G and CDMA
> are turned off in favor of LTE, and Verizon chooses to not offer LTE to
> MVNOs. But that is probably 7-10 years away.
Businesses models change. In 7-10 years LTE will be the ugly stepchild
and PP will sell it while being denied VZW's "6G" phones. (Meanwhile, T-
Mo will be calling their 5G phones "6G"!)
> Pageplus allows Verizon to keep those pesky low ARPU customers out of
> their financial results while still selling to them. Businesses are
> always looking for ways to sell their products through multiple
> channels at different prices.
In 7-10 years every carrier might actually be using the same tech, and
simply be dumb pipes for a new generation of competitive MVNOs. PP, et al,
might seamlessly roam from VZN to AT&T by then, or worse, just resell the
one uber carrier left that was created from some future super merger...
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
At 18 May 2012 10:21:52 -0700 AJL wrote:
> On Fri, 18 May 2012 03:35:30 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
>
> >On Thu, 17 May 2012 15:03:02 -0700, AJL <5537twu78319@nosuchmail.com>
> >wrote:
>
> >>If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
> >>Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
> >>their cell network?
> >
> >As can any carrier. What's the point?
>
> Except Verizon. I doubt they would kick themselves off their own
> network. You'll have to read back in the thread to understand the
> point.
It's not like MVNO's snuck in a backdoor somewhere and squatted on their
chosen network. They are contracted business partners that negotiated the
rates they receive.
MVNO's aren't going anywhere. They provide valuable dollars to carriers
with little effort expended. At worst, MVNOs might raise their rates if
carriers offer them poor wholesale rates at the next contract renewal,
but competition controls that as well. If Verizon raises rates too much,
MVNO's can look to Sprint, AT&T, and T-Mo.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On 5/18/2012 11:44 AM, Todd Allcock wrote:
> At 18 May 2012 09:07:37 -0700 SMS wrote:
>> On 5/16/2012 3:12 PM, tycho wrote:
>>> See several sites reporting same:
>>>
>>> http://www.mobileburn.com/19608/news...tomers-off-of-
> grandfathered-unlimited-data-plans
>>>
>>> http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/16/v...grandfathered-
> unlimited-plans-on-the-way-out/?a_dgi=aolshare_twitter
>>>
>>> http://androidcommunity.com/verizon-...grandfathered-
> unlimited-data-plans-this-summer-20120516/
>>
>> No surprise here. Bad news for companies like Pandora.
>
>
> Why? Pandora is actually a pretty low-bandwidth service compared to other
> streaming services. It uses about 30-50MB of data per hour (on mobiles,
> and consequently sound pretty crappy.) Free Pandora users are limited to
> 40 hours a month anyway, so at best they could only consume about 2GB of
> data if they maxed out their usage and never used it at home or on WiFi.
> Compare that to Netflix, which can burn 300MB or more/hour.
The question is whether users try to minimize their data usage once
unlimited is gone versus not caring much (other than the threat of
throttling).
Netflix would normally not be used on a cell phone though, whereas the
value advantage of Pandora is mainly for mobile users looking for an
alternative to their vehicle's radio.
Satellite radio has taken a big hit because of Pandora, since for many
users Pandora was good enough and didn't cost anything extra with
unlimited data.
The fact that music's audio quality has gotten poorer and most consumers
don't care is good news for companies that sell digital music in all
forms, whether it's individual downloads, streamed via the cellular
network, or broadcast via satellite.
> What's really needed are realistic tiered charges for data. It's silly
> selling consumers only two disparate data buckets like AT&T does; 250MB
> or 3GB. One is too small for most users, and one too large.
Remember Sprint's "Fair and Flexible" voice plan. That was a fair
system. Alas, it probably resulted in a lot of lost revenue because
subscribers no longer chose a higher cost plan with more minutes "just
in case."
> As I've said before, if capacity really was big an issue as the carriers'
> whine, they should sell data "by the pound." No plans- everyone pays
> $0.01-0.02/MB ($10-20/G Of course they'd never do that- their business
> model is predicated on selling that large bucket of data that only 2% of
> their customers actually use up, but the other 98% purchase out of fear
> of overages. All data a la carte, at a reasonable fee, would encourage
> conservation, and end the "spectrum crunch" visually instantly, without
> building a single new cell site.
The carriers want it both ways. They encourage data usage where stored
content would be much more practical and cost-effective, but don't want
to offer pricing that would discourage data usage.
I wonder if there will come a time when people will just get tired of
the whole 3G/4G data thing. It may just be like CB radios. Look at
tablet sales, the vast majority of tablet sales (about 90%) are for
Wi-Fi only because so few people want to pay for another data plan. I
finally have visitors asking for my Wi-Fi password for their iPad,
whereas with just a phone they never bothered.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Thu, 17 May 2012 15:03:02 -0700, AJL wrote:
>On Thu, 17 May 2012 14:35:12 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
>
>>Or pagepluscellular.com for much less than that.
>
>If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>their cell network?
I don't think Verizon is going to kick anybody off a grandfathered
data plan. They are just not going to let you upgrade your plan or
phone and keep the grandfathered data plan. So, if you want to keep
using your current phone forever, you can keep unlimited data.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On 5/18/12 12:14 PM, SMS wrote:
> On 5/17/2012 3:03 PM, AJL wrote:
>> On Thu, 17 May 2012 14:35:12 -0700, nobody@nada.com wrote:
>>
>>> Or pagepluscellular.com for much less than that.
>>
>> If Verizon can change their minds and kick their customers off the
>> Unlimited plan can they also change their minds and kick Pageplus off
>> their cell network?
>
> I think that the death knell for Pageplus will come when 3G and CDMA are
> turned off in favor of LTE, and Verizon chooses to not offer LTE to
> MVNOs. But that is probably 7-10 years away.
>
> Pageplus allows Verizon to keep those pesky low ARPU customers out of
> their financial results while still selling to them. Businesses are
> always looking for ways to sell their products through multiple channels
> at different prices.
No, that won't happen The economics and business model are exactly the
same whether the signal goes over CDMA/3G or LTE. It makes economic
sense now-- and will later. Now of course, a wrist radio sat-phone might
shake up the game somewhat;-)
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Fri, 18 May 2012 14:30:09 -0700, Jeff Grossman
<jeff.nospam@stikman.com> wrote:
>So, if you want to keep using your current phone forever,
>you can keep unlimited data.
Forever is a long time. I likely will keep it as long as Verizon will
let me, but my grandfathered Unlimited plan is already piggybacked on
top of a grandfathered ($15/mo) voice plan...
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Fri, 18 May 2012 12:56:33 -0600, Todd Allcock
<elecconnec@AnoOspamL.com> wrote:
>At 18 May 2012 10:21:52 -0700 AJL wrote:
>> Except Verizon. I doubt they would kick themselves off their own
>> network.
>
>It's not like MVNO's snuck in a backdoor somewhere and squatted on their
>chosen network. They are contracted business partners that negotiated the
>rates they receive.
Question is when is the network contract up possibly resulting in a
provider change to a different network? If I decided to change from
Verizon to a provider using their network, it would of course be my
luck that the new provider would shortly switch away from the Verizon
network.
>If Verizon raises rates too much,
>MVNO's can look to Sprint, AT&T, and T-Mo.
Exactly. If I switch I still need a phone using the Verizon network
since the others here don't have such a great reputation.
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Fri, 18 May 2012 12:44:27 -0600, Todd Allcock
<elecconnec@AnoOspamL.com> wrote:
>They stupidly offered "unlimited
>data" in a desperate attempt to increase adoption of their underutilized
>infrastructure,...
It's a business model that seems to work. Now that they've got their
subscribers hooked on data they can make some real money off it.
Amazon sold first run ebooks at a loss to increase Kindle reader
sales. Now that there is a large Kindle base those same ebooks sell
near to or more than their paper counterparts. Amazon is currently
selling their Kindle Fire Tablet at a loss. Same reason (books,
periodicals, videos).
BTW get ready for your ISP to get rid of unlimited...
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
On Fri, 18 May 2012 15:45:19 -0700, AJL <5537t8319@nosuchmail.com>
wrote:
>Amazon sold first run ebooks at a loss to increase Kindle reader
>sales. Now that there is a large Kindle base those same ebooks sell
>near to or more than their paper counterparts. Amazon is currently
>selling their Kindle Fire Tablet at a loss. Same reason (books,
>periodicals, videos).
Aren't they also being investigated for their ebook selling practices?
Re: Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer
SMS wrote on [Fri, 18 May 2012 13:27:16 -0700]:
>
> I wonder if there will come a time when people will just get tired of
> the whole 3G/4G data thing. It may just be like CB radios. Look at
> tablet sales, the vast majority of tablet sales (about 90%) are for
> Wi-Fi only because so few people want to pay for another data plan. I
> finally have visitors asking for my Wi-Fi password for their iPad,
> whereas with just a phone they never bothered.
How do you deal with the tiered home data plans and allowing others onto your
network? I constantly butt into the comcast 250GB limit.
Verizon to kill grandfathered unlimited data plans this summer 
Of course they'd never do that- their business
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