YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
Allow me to share with you here some information about one man his
name is muhammad.
In The Name Of Allaah,
Most Gracious, Most Merciful
YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
MUHAMMAD
(May peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him)
You may be an atheist or an agnostic; or you may belong to anyone of
the religious denominations that exist in the world today. You may be
a Communist or a believer in democracy and freedom. No matter what you
are, and no matter what your religious and political beliefs, personal
and social habits happen to be - YOU MUST STILL KNOW THIS MAN!
He was by far the most remarkable man that ever set foot on this
earth. He preached a religion, founded a state, built a nation, laid
down a moral code, initiated numberless social and political reforms,
established a dynamic and powerful society to practice and represent
his teachings, and completely revolutionized the worlds of human
thought and action for all times to come.
HIS NAME IS MUHAMMAD, peace and blessings of Almighty God be upon him
and he accomplished all these wonders in the unbelievably short span
of twenty-three years.
Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him was born in
Arabia on the 20th of August, in the year 570 of the Christian era,
and when he died after 63 years, the whole of the Arabian Peninsula
had changed from paganism and idol-worship to the worship of One God;
from tribal quarrels and wars to national solidarity and cohesion;
from drunkenness and debauchery to sobriety and piety; from
lawlessness and anarchy to disciplined living; from utter moral
bankruptcy to the highest standards of moral excellence. Human history
has never known such a complete transformation of a people or a place
before or since!
The Encyclopedia Britannica calls him "the most successful of all
religious personalities of the world". Bernard Shaw said about him
that if Muhammad were alive today he would succeed in solving all
those problems which threaten to destroy human civilization in our
times. Thomas Carlysle was simply amazed as to how one man, single-
handedly, could weld warring tribes and wandering Bedouins into a most
powerful and civilized nation in less than two decades. Napoleon and
Gandhi never tired of dreaming of a society along the lines
established by this man in Arabia fourteen centuries ago.
Indeed no other human being ever accomplished so much, in such diverse
fields of human thought and behavior, in so limited a space of time,
as did Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him. He
was a religious teacher, a social reformer, a moral guide, a political
thinker, a military genius, an administrative colossus, a faithful
friend, a wonderful companion, a devoted husband, a loving father -
all in one. No other man in history ever excelled or equaled him in
any of these difficult departments of life.
The world has had its share of great personalities. But these were one
sided figures who distinguished themselves in but one or two fields
such as religious thought or military leadership. None of the other
great leaders of the world ever combined in himself so many different
qualities to such an amazing level of perfection as did Muhammad,
peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him.
The lives and teachings of other great personalities of the world are
shrouded in the mist of time. There is so much speculation about the
time and the place of their birth, the mode and style of their life,
the nature and detail of their teachings and the degree and measure of
their success or failure that it is impossible for humanity today to
reconstruct accurately and precisely the lives and teachings of those
men.
Not so this man Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
him. Not only was he born in the fullest blaze of recorded history,
but every detail of his private and public life, of his actions and
utterances, has been accurately documented and faithfully preserved to
our day. The authenticity of the information so preserved is vouched
for not only by faithful followers but also by unbiased critics and
open-minded scholars.
At the level of ideas there is no system of thought and belief-secular
or religious, social or political-which could surpass or equal ISLAAM-
the system which Muhammad peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
him propounded. In a fast changing world, while other systems have
undergone profound transformations, Islaam alone has remained above
all change and mutation, and retained its original form for the past
1400 years. What is more, the positive changes that are taking place
in the world of human thought and behavior, truly and consistently
reflect the healthy influence of Islam in these areas. Further, it is
not given to the best of thinkers to put their ideas completely into
practice, and to see the seeds of their labors grow and bear fruit, in
their own lifetime. Except of course, Muhammad, peace and blessings of
God Almighty be upon him, who not only preached the most wonderful
ideas but also successfully translated each one of them into practice
in his own lifetime. At the time of his death his teachings were not
mere precepts and ideas straining for fulfillment, but had become the
very core of the life of tens of thousands of perfectly trained
individuals, each one of whom was a marvelous personification of
everything that Muhammad peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
him taught and stood for. At what other time or place and in relation
to what other political, social, religious system, philosophy or
ideology-did the world ever witness such a perfectly amazing
phenomenon?
Indeed no other system or ideology secular or religious, social or
political, ancient or modern - could ever claim the distinction of
having been put into practice in its fullness and entirety EVEN ONCE
in this world, either before or after the death of its founder. Except
of course ISLAAM, the ideology preached by Muhammad, peace and
blessings of God Almighty be upon him which was established as a
complete way of life by the teacher himself, before he departed from
this world. History bears testimony to this fact and the greatest
skeptics have no option but to concede this point.
In spite of these amazing achievements and in spite of the countless
absolutely convincing and authentic miracles performed by him and the
phenomenal success which crowned his efforts, he did not for a moment
claim to be God or God's incarnation or Son - but only a human being
who was chosen and ordained by God to be a teacher of truth to man
kind and a complete model and pattern for their actions.
He was nothing more or less than a human being. But he was a man with
a noble and exalted mission-and his unique mission was to unite
humanity on the worship of ONE AND ONLY GOD and to teach them the way
to honest and upright living in accordance with the laws and commands
of God. He always described himself as A MESSENGER AND SERVANT OF GOD,
and so indeed every single action and movement of his proclaimed him
to be.
A world which has not hesitated to raise to Divinity individuals whose
very lives and missions have been lost in legend and who historically
speaking did not accomplish half as much-or even one tenth-as was
accomplished by Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
him should stop to take serious note of this remarkable man's claim to
be God's messenger to mankind.
Today after the lapse of some 1400 years the life and teachings of
Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him,
have survived without the slightest loss, alteration or interpolation.
Today they offer the same undying hope for treating mankind's many
ills which they did when Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of God
Almighty be upon him, was alive. This is our honest claim and this is
the inescapable conclusion forced upon us by a critical and unbiased
study of history.
The least YOU should do as a thinking, sensitive, concerned human
being is to stop for one brief moment and ask yourself: Could it be
that these statements, extraordinary and revolutionary as they sound,
are really true? Supposing they really are true, and you did not know
this man Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him or
hear about his teachings? Or did not know him well and intimately
enough to be able to benefit from his guidance and example? Isn't it
time you responded to this tremendous challenge and made some effort
to know him? It will not cost you anything but it may well prove to be
the beginning of a completely new era in your life.
Come, let us make a new discovery of the life of this wonderful man
Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him the like of
whom never walked on this earth, and whose example and teachings can
change YOUR LIFE and OUR WORLD for the better. May God shower His
choicest blessings upon him!
Written by S.H. Pasha
Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus Christ,
savior and redeemer of this world.
I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
"abdo911" <jipksaman@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1187768931.543747.199880@j4g2000prf.googlegro ups.com...
> YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
> Allow me to share with you here some information about one man his
> name is muhammad.
>
> In The Name Of Allaah,
> Most Gracious, Most Merciful
> YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
> MUHAMMAD
> (May peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him)
> You may be an atheist or an agnostic; or you may belong to anyone of
> the religious denominations that exist in the world today. You may be
> a Communist or a believer in democracy and freedom. No matter what you
> are, and no matter what your religious and political beliefs, personal
> and social habits happen to be - YOU MUST STILL KNOW THIS MAN!
> He was by far the most remarkable man that ever set foot on this
> earth. He preached a religion, founded a state, built a nation, laid
> down a moral code, initiated numberless social and political reforms,
> established a dynamic and powerful society to practice and represent
> his teachings, and completely revolutionized the worlds of human
> thought and action for all times to come.
> HIS NAME IS MUHAMMAD, peace and blessings of Almighty God be upon him
> and he accomplished all these wonders in the unbelievably short span
> of twenty-three years.
> Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him was born in
> Arabia on the 20th of August, in the year 570 of the Christian era,
> and when he died after 63 years, the whole of the Arabian Peninsula
> had changed from paganism and idol-worship to the worship of One God;
> from tribal quarrels and wars to national solidarity and cohesion;
> from drunkenness and debauchery to sobriety and piety; from
> lawlessness and anarchy to disciplined living; from utter moral
> bankruptcy to the highest standards of moral excellence. Human history
> has never known such a complete transformation of a people or a place
> before or since!
> The Encyclopedia Britannica calls him "the most successful of all
> religious personalities of the world". Bernard Shaw said about him
> that if Muhammad were alive today he would succeed in solving all
> those problems which threaten to destroy human civilization in our
> times. Thomas Carlysle was simply amazed as to how one man, single-
> handedly, could weld warring tribes and wandering Bedouins into a most
> powerful and civilized nation in less than two decades. Napoleon and
> Gandhi never tired of dreaming of a society along the lines
> established by this man in Arabia fourteen centuries ago.
> Indeed no other human being ever accomplished so much, in such diverse
> fields of human thought and behavior, in so limited a space of time,
> as did Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him. He
> was a religious teacher, a social reformer, a moral guide, a political
> thinker, a military genius, an administrative colossus, a faithful
> friend, a wonderful companion, a devoted husband, a loving father -
> all in one. No other man in history ever excelled or equaled him in
> any of these difficult departments of life.
> The world has had its share of great personalities. But these were one
> sided figures who distinguished themselves in but one or two fields
> such as religious thought or military leadership. None of the other
> great leaders of the world ever combined in himself so many different
> qualities to such an amazing level of perfection as did Muhammad,
> peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him.
> The lives and teachings of other great personalities of the world are
> shrouded in the mist of time. There is so much speculation about the
> time and the place of their birth, the mode and style of their life,
> the nature and detail of their teachings and the degree and measure of
> their success or failure that it is impossible for humanity today to
> reconstruct accurately and precisely the lives and teachings of those
> men.
> Not so this man Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
> him. Not only was he born in the fullest blaze of recorded history,
> but every detail of his private and public life, of his actions and
> utterances, has been accurately documented and faithfully preserved to
> our day. The authenticity of the information so preserved is vouched
> for not only by faithful followers but also by unbiased critics and
> open-minded scholars.
> At the level of ideas there is no system of thought and belief-secular
> or religious, social or political-which could surpass or equal ISLAAM-
> the system which Muhammad peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
> him propounded. In a fast changing world, while other systems have
> undergone profound transformations, Islaam alone has remained above
> all change and mutation, and retained its original form for the past
> 1400 years. What is more, the positive changes that are taking place
> in the world of human thought and behavior, truly and consistently
> reflect the healthy influence of Islam in these areas. Further, it is
> not given to the best of thinkers to put their ideas completely into
> practice, and to see the seeds of their labors grow and bear fruit, in
> their own lifetime. Except of course, Muhammad, peace and blessings of
> God Almighty be upon him, who not only preached the most wonderful
> ideas but also successfully translated each one of them into practice
> in his own lifetime. At the time of his death his teachings were not
> mere precepts and ideas straining for fulfillment, but had become the
> very core of the life of tens of thousands of perfectly trained
> individuals, each one of whom was a marvelous personification of
> everything that Muhammad peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
> him taught and stood for. At what other time or place and in relation
> to what other political, social, religious system, philosophy or
> ideology-did the world ever witness such a perfectly amazing
> phenomenon?
> Indeed no other system or ideology secular or religious, social or
> political, ancient or modern - could ever claim the distinction of
> having been put into practice in its fullness and entirety EVEN ONCE
> in this world, either before or after the death of its founder. Except
> of course ISLAAM, the ideology preached by Muhammad, peace and
> blessings of God Almighty be upon him which was established as a
> complete way of life by the teacher himself, before he departed from
> this world. History bears testimony to this fact and the greatest
> skeptics have no option but to concede this point.
> In spite of these amazing achievements and in spite of the countless
> absolutely convincing and authentic miracles performed by him and the
> phenomenal success which crowned his efforts, he did not for a moment
> claim to be God or God's incarnation or Son - but only a human being
> who was chosen and ordained by God to be a teacher of truth to man
> kind and a complete model and pattern for their actions.
> He was nothing more or less than a human being. But he was a man with
> a noble and exalted mission-and his unique mission was to unite
> humanity on the worship of ONE AND ONLY GOD and to teach them the way
> to honest and upright living in accordance with the laws and commands
> of God. He always described himself as A MESSENGER AND SERVANT OF GOD,
> and so indeed every single action and movement of his proclaimed him
> to be.
> A world which has not hesitated to raise to Divinity individuals whose
> very lives and missions have been lost in legend and who historically
> speaking did not accomplish half as much-or even one tenth-as was
> accomplished by Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
> him should stop to take serious note of this remarkable man's claim to
> be God's messenger to mankind.
> Today after the lapse of some 1400 years the life and teachings of
> Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him,
> have survived without the slightest loss, alteration or interpolation.
> Today they offer the same undying hope for treating mankind's many
> ills which they did when Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of God
> Almighty be upon him, was alive. This is our honest claim and this is
> the inescapable conclusion forced upon us by a critical and unbiased
> study of history.
> The least YOU should do as a thinking, sensitive, concerned human
> being is to stop for one brief moment and ask yourself: Could it be
> that these statements, extraordinary and revolutionary as they sound,
> are really true? Supposing they really are true, and you did not know
> this man Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him or
> hear about his teachings? Or did not know him well and intimately
> enough to be able to benefit from his guidance and example? Isn't it
> time you responded to this tremendous challenge and made some effort
> to know him? It will not cost you anything but it may well prove to be
> the beginning of a completely new era in your life.
> Come, let us make a new discovery of the life of this wonderful man
> Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him the like of
> whom never walked on this earth, and whose example and teachings can
> change YOUR LIFE and OUR WORLD for the better. May God shower His
> choicest blessings upon him!
> Written by S.H. Pasha
>
On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400, "TB" <google@google.com> wrote:
>Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus Christ,
>savior and redeemer of this world.
>
>I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
I have it on good authority that both of them were created by Walt Disney's
great-great-great-grandfather...
Yeah, pedophile and murderer and common thief. What a scumbag. Must come
from banging your head on the ground all the time "praying" or whatever
these idiots claim to be doing.
"abdo911" <jipksaman@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1187768931.543747.199880@j4g2000prf.googlegro ups.com...
> YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
> Allow me to share with you here some information about one man his
> name is muhammad.
>
> In The Name Of Allaah,
> Most Gracious, Most Merciful
> YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
> MUHAMMAD
At 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400 TB wrote:
> Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus
Christ,
> savior and redeemer of this world.
>
> I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
Muhammad, Jesus, Zeus, the Easter Bunny, whatever- pick whichever one
gives you a smug sense of superiority over the rest of us, and move
on...
--
"I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work. Thanks for
all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
ACTUAL bells and whistles." -Bill Maher 9/25/2003
Peter Zenger <PeterZenger@nyweeklyjournal.com> wrote in
news:5b7oc3586fu2549tv5fjpu8n2k8udh2j34@4ax.com:
> You mean the pedophile, who marries 14 year old girls?
>
> Yeah, really upstanding guy...
>
>
First, I'd like to point out that I am an atheist. There is no God, just
a God dilusion.
I'd also like to point out that in the time of Christ and Muhammad the
average life span of a human male was around 30 years, due as much to
man's inherent ability to murder his own species as his miserable diet
and diseases.
During that era, it would behoove every male in this murderous group of
tribes to breed like rabbits as soon as the females were ripe, about 12-
14 years of age, the beginning of a human female's reproductive life.
This religious nonsense of waiting until half the female's most fertile
years are over and some religious nut has pronounced him and her as
approved for breeding would, probably, have resulted in many species of
humans under their control simply becoming extinct in a few generations.
Nature takes care of this extinction problem by making all males
"pedophiles", by natural selection. Every ad man knows this is true and
creates advertisements to cause sexual arousal for YOUTH in every ad you
see. There are no car ads depicting sexy 55 year old hags laid out over
the hood of the latest Lexus to get you to buy one. They're not stupid.
I'm a month younger than Cher. She's the only one of that age group that
excites me...(c;
On 22 , 21:48, pltrgyst <pltrg...@spamlessxhost.org> wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400, "TB" <goo...@google.com> wrote:
> >Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus Christ,
> >savior and redeemer of this world.
>
> >I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
>
> I have it on good authority that both of them were created by Walt Disney's
> great-great-great-grandfather...
>
> -- Larry
Hi Hi Hi
Allow me to share with you here some information about Jesus .
Without a doubt, you have often heard the claim that Jesus is God, the
second person in the "Holy trinity." However, the very Bible which is
used as a basis for knowledge about Jesus and as the basis for
doctrine within Christianity clearly belies this claim. We urge you to
consult your own Bible and verify that the following conclusions are
not drawn out of context:
1. God is All Knowing.....but Jesus was not
When speaking of the day of judgment, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a
limitation on his knowledge when he said, "but of that day and hour
knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the
son, but the Father." Mark 13:32, and Matt 24:36. But God knows all.
His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own
admission, did not know when the day of judgment would be, is clear
proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not
God.
2. God is All Powerful.....but Jesus was not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the
power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said,
"Verily, verily I say unto you, the Son can do nothing of himself, but
what he seeth the Father do..." St. John 5:19. Again he said, "I can
of mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgment is
just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father
which hath sent me." St. John 5:30. But God is not only all-powerful,
He is also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his
own admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus
is not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.
3. God does not have a God.....but Jesus did have a God.
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call
upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was one
whom he worshipped and to whom he prayed when he said, "l ascend unto
my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." St. John
20:17. He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, "My
God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?" Matt 27:46. If Jesus were God,
then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself why hast thou forsaken
me?" Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord's
prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of
Gethsemane he prayed, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup
pass from me: Nevertheless not as I will but as thou wilt." Matt
26:36-39. Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own
admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed
to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.
4. God is an invisible spirit.....but Jesus was flesh and blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that
this could not be done with God when he said. "No man hath seen God at
any time." St. John 1:18. '"Ye have neither heard His voice at any
time nor seen His shape." St. John 5:37. He also said in St. John
4:24. "God is a spirit and they that worship him must worship him in
spirit and in truth." That Jesus would say that no one had seen or
heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is
clear proof that Jesus was not God.
5. No one is greater than God and no one can direct Him but Jesus
acknowledged someone greater than himself whose will was distinct from
his own.
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not
equal, and therefore not one and the same, come again from the mouth
of Jesus himself who said in St. John 14:28, "My Father is greater
than I." When someone referred to him as good master in Matt 19:17,
Jesus responded, "Why callest thou me good? There is none good but
one, that is God..." Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions
between himself and God when he said, "I proceeded forth and came from
God, neither came I of myself but He sent me." St. John 8:42. Jesus
gave clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his
equality with God,when he said in Luke 22:42, "not my will but thine
be done" and in St. John 5:30, "I seek not mine own will but the will
of the Father which hath sent me." That Jesus would admit that he did
not come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do
so, that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself,
and that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the
will of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One
and therefore Jesus is not God.
Conclusion
The Church recognizes the Bible as the primary source of knowledge
about God and Jesus. But since the Bible makes it clear that Jesus is
not the Supreme Being and the Supreme Being is not Jesus, upon what
basis have you come to believe otherwise?
My brother or sister, the belief that the Supreme Being is a Trinity
is false and completely inconsistent with the words of Jesus as
presented in the Bible. God is one, not three. He is a perfect unity.
If you are interested in the truth about God and your relationship to
Him, we invite you to investigate the religion of Islam.
What is the word of God about Jesus:
A. Regarding Sonship of Jesus:
That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth, concerning which they
are doubting. It is not for God to take a son unto Him. Glory be to
Him! When He decrees a thing he but says to it "Be", and it is.
(Qur'an 19:34,35).
And they say, 'The All-merciful has taken unto Himself a son.' You
have indeed advanced something hideous. The heavens are well nigh rent
of it and the earth split asunder, and the mountains well nigh fall
down crashing for that they have attributed to the All-Merciful a son;
and it behoves not the All-Merciful to take a son. None is there in
the heavens and earth but comes to the All-Merciful as a servant
(Qur'an 19:88-93).
Truly the likeness of Jesus, in God's sight, is as Adam's likeness; He
created him of dust, then said He unto him, "Be", and he was. (Qur'an
3:59).
People of the Book, go not beyond the bounds in your religion, and say
not as to God but the Truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only
the Messenger of God, and His Word that He committed to Mary, and a
spirit from Him. So believe in God and His Messengers. and say not,
'Three', Refrain, better is it for you. God is only One God. Glory be
on Him - that He should have a son! To Him belongs that which is in
the heavens and on the earth, God suffices for a guardian. (Qur'an
4:171)
B. Regarding Jesus being God:
And when God said. 'O Jesus son of Mary,did you say unto men, "Take me
and my mother as gods, apart from God?" He Said, 'To You be Glory! It
is not mine to say what I have no right to. If I indeed said it, You
knew it, knowing what is within my soul, and I do not know what is
within Your soul; You know the things unseen. I only said to them what
You did command me: "Serve God, my Lord and your Lord." And I was a
witness over them, while I remained among them; but when You did take
me to Yourself the Watcher over them; You are the witness of
everything. (Quran 5:116,117)
C. Regarding Crucifiction of Jesus:
And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty
calumny, and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of
Mary, the Messenger of God'...yet they did not slay him, neither
crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who
are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they
have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they
did not slay him of certainty... no indeed, God raised him up to Him;
God is Almighty, All-Wise. There is not one of the people of the Book
but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the
Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them. (Qur'an
4:156-159)
On 22 , 21:48, pltrgyst <pltrg...@spamlessxhost.org> wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400, "TB" <goo...@google.com> wrote:
> >Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus Christ,
> >savior and redeemer of this world.
>
> >I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
>
> I have it on good authority that both of them were created by Walt Disney's
> great-great-great-grandfather...
>
> -- Larry
here some information about Jesus .
Without a doubt, you have often heard the claim that Jesus is God, the
second person in the "Holy trinity." However, the very Bible which is
used as a basis for knowledge about Jesus and as the basis for
doctrine within Christianity clearly belies this claim. We urge you to
consult your own Bible and verify that the following conclusions are
not drawn out of context:
1. God is All Knowing.....but Jesus was not
When speaking of the day of judgment, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a
limitation on his knowledge when he said, "but of that day and hour
knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the
son, but the Father." Mark 13:32, and Matt 24:36. But God knows all.
His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own
admission, did not know when the day of judgment would be, is clear
proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not
God.
2. God is All Powerful.....but Jesus was not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the
power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said,
"Verily, verily I say unto you, the Son can do nothing of himself, but
what he seeth the Father do..." St. John 5:19. Again he said, "I can
of mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgment is
just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father
which hath sent me." St. John 5:30. But God is not only all-powerful,
He is also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his
own admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus
is not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.
3. God does not have a God.....but Jesus did have a God.
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call
upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was one
whom he worshipped and to whom he prayed when he said, "l ascend unto
my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." St. John
20:17. He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, "My
God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?" Matt 27:46. If Jesus were God,
then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself why hast thou forsaken
me?" Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord's
prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of
Gethsemane he prayed, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup
pass from me: Nevertheless not as I will but as thou wilt." Matt
26:36-39. Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own
admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed
to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.
4. God is an invisible spirit.....but Jesus was flesh and blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that
this could not be done with God when he said. "No man hath seen God at
any time." St. John 1:18. '"Ye have neither heard His voice at any
time nor seen His shape." St. John 5:37. He also said in St. John
4:24. "God is a spirit and they that worship him must worship him in
spirit and in truth." That Jesus would say that no one had seen or
heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is
clear proof that Jesus was not God.
5. No one is greater than God and no one can direct Him but Jesus
acknowledged someone greater than himself whose will was distinct from
his own.
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not
equal, and therefore not one and the same, come again from the mouth
of Jesus himself who said in St. John 14:28, "My Father is greater
than I." When someone referred to him as good master in Matt 19:17,
Jesus responded, "Why callest thou me good? There is none good but
one, that is God..." Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions
between himself and God when he said, "I proceeded forth and came from
God, neither came I of myself but He sent me." St. John 8:42. Jesus
gave clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his
equality with God,when he said in Luke 22:42, "not my will but thine
be done" and in St. John 5:30, "I seek not mine own will but the will
of the Father which hath sent me." That Jesus would admit that he did
not come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do
so, that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself,
and that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the
will of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One
and therefore Jesus is not God.
Conclusion
The Church recognizes the Bible as the primary source of knowledge
about God and Jesus. But since the Bible makes it clear that Jesus is
not the Supreme Being and the Supreme Being is not Jesus, upon what
basis have you come to believe otherwise?
My brother or sister, the belief that the Supreme Being is a Trinity
is false and completely inconsistent with the words of Jesus as
presented in the Bible. God is one, not three. He is a perfect unity.
If you are interested in the truth about God and your relationship to
Him, we invite you to investigate the religion of Islam.
What is the word of God about Jesus:
A. Regarding Sonship of Jesus:
That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth, concerning which they
are doubting. It is not for God to take a son unto Him. Glory be to
Him! When He decrees a thing he but says to it "Be", and it is.
(Qur'an 19:34,35).
And they say, 'The All-merciful has taken unto Himself a son.' You
have indeed advanced something hideous. The heavens are well nigh rent
of it and the earth split asunder, and the mountains well nigh fall
down crashing for that they have attributed to the All-Merciful a son;
and it behoves not the All-Merciful to take a son. None is there in
the heavens and earth but comes to the All-Merciful as a servant
(Qur'an 19:88-93).
Truly the likeness of Jesus, in God's sight, is as Adam's likeness; He
created him of dust, then said He unto him, "Be", and he was. (Qur'an
3:59).
People of the Book, go not beyond the bounds in your religion, and say
not as to God but the Truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only
the Messenger of God, and His Word that He committed to Mary, and a
spirit from Him. So believe in God and His Messengers. and say not,
'Three', Refrain, better is it for you. God is only One God. Glory be
on Him - that He should have a son! To Him belongs that which is in
the heavens and on the earth, God suffices for a guardian. (Qur'an
4:171)
B. Regarding Jesus being God:
And when God said. 'O Jesus son of Mary,did you say unto men, "Take me
and my mother as gods, apart from God?" He Said, 'To You be Glory! It
is not mine to say what I have no right to. If I indeed said it, You
knew it, knowing what is within my soul, and I do not know what is
within Your soul; You know the things unseen. I only said to them what
You did command me: "Serve God, my Lord and your Lord." And I was a
witness over them, while I remained among them; but when You did take
me to Yourself the Watcher over them; You are the witness of
everything. (Quran 5:116,117)
C. Regarding Crucifiction of Jesus:
And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty
calumny, and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of
Mary, the Messenger of God'...yet they did not slay him, neither
crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who
are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they
have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they
did not slay him of certainty... no indeed, God raised him up to Him;
God is Almighty, All-Wise. There is not one of the people of the Book
but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the
Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them. (Qur'an
4:156-159)
On 22 , 21:48, pltrgyst <pltrg...@spamlessxhost.org> wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400, "TB" <goo...@google.com> wrote:
> >Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus Christ,
> >savior and redeemer of this world.
>
> >I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
>
> I have it on good authority that both of them were created by Walt Disney's
> great-great-great-grandfather...
>
> -- Larry
Twelve Proofs that Muhammad is a True Prophet
Shaykh `Abdul Rahman `Abdul Khaliq
Originally published by IANA
________________________________________
My brothers and sisters everywhere! With this essay, I am not singling
out the adherents of Islam - to which I ascribe - but rather I am
writing this essay to every man and woman throughout the whole world.
I ask Allah that He facilitates tat this essay reaches every ear,
falls under the sight of every eye, and is understood by every
heart...
Muhammad the son of `Abdullah is Allah's Prophet and the Final
Messenger Sent by Allah to the Inhabitants of Earth.
My brothers and sisters everywhere! You should know that the
Messenger, Muhammad the son of `Abdullah (may Allah's blessings and
peace be upon him) is Allah's Messenger in reality and truth. The
evidences that show his veracity are abundant. None but an infidel,
who out of arrogance alone, could deny these signs.
Among these proofs:
1. Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) was raised
illiterate, unable to read or write, and remained like that till his
death. Among all his people, he was known as being truthful and
trustworthy. Before receiving revelation, he had no prior knowledge of
Religion or any previously sent Message. He remained like that for his
first forty years. Revelation then came to Muhammad with the Koran
that we now have between our hands. This Koran mentioned most of the
accounts found in the previous scriptures, telling us about these
events in the greatest detail as if he witnessed them. These accounts
came precisely as they were found in the Torah sent down to Moses and
in the Gospel sent down to Jesus. Neither the Jews or Christians were
able to belie him regarding anything that he said.
2. Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) also
foretold of everything that would occur to him and his community after
him, pertaining to victory, the removal of the tyrannical kingdoms of
Chosroes [the royal title for the Zoroastrian kings of Persia] and
Caesar, and the establishment of the religion of Islam throughout the
earth. These events occurred exactly as Muhammad foretold, as if he
was reading the future from an open book.
3. Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) also brought
an Arabic Koran that is the peak of eloquence and clarity. The Koran
challenged those eloquent and fluent Arabs of his time, who initially
belied him, to bring forth a single chapter like the Koran. The
eloquent Arabs of his day were unable to contest this Koran.
Indeed, till our day, none has ever dared to claim that he has been
able to compose words that equal-or even approach-the order, grace,
beauty, and splendor of this Glorious Koran.
4. The life history of this Noble Prophet was a perfect example of
being upright, merciful, compassionate, truthful, brave, generous,
distant from all evil character, and ascetic in all worldly matters,
while striving solely for the reward of the Hereafter. Moreover, in
all his actions and dealings, he was ever mindful and fearful of
Allah.
5. Allah instilled great love for Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and
peace be upon him) in the hearts of all who believed in and met him.
This love reached such a degree that any of his companions would
willingly sacrifice his (or her) self, mother or father for him.
Till today, those who believe in Muhammad honor and love him. Anyone
of those who believe in him would ransom his own family and wealth to
see him, even if but once.
6. All of history has not preserved the biography of any person in the
manner it has preserved the life of Muhammad, who is the most
influential human in history.
Nor has the entire earth known of anyone whom every morning and
evening, and many times thereafter throughout the day, is thought of
by those who believe in him. Upon remembering Muhammad, the believers
in him will greet him and ask Allah to bless him. They do such with
full hearts and true love for him.
7. Nor has there every been a man on earth whom is still followed in
all his doings by those who believe in him.
Those who believe in Muhammad, sleep in the manner he slept; purify
themselves (through ablution and ritual washing) in the manner he
purified himself; and adhere to his practice in the way they eat,
drink, and clothe themselves.
Indeed in all aspects of their lives, the believers in Muhammad adhere
to the teachings he spread among them and the path that he traveled
upon during his life.
During every generation, from his day till our time, the believers in
this Noble Prophet have fully adhered to his teachings. With some,
this has reached the degree that they desire to follow and adhere to
the Prophet's way in his personal matters regarding which Allah has
not sought of them to adhere to in worship. For example, some will
only eat those specific foods or only wear those specific garments
that the Messenger liked.
Let alone all that, all those who believe in Muhammad repeat those
praises of Allah, special prayers, and invocations that he would say
during each of his actions during day and night, like: what he would
say when he greeted people, upon entering and leaving the house,
entering and leaving the mosque, entering and leaving the bathroom,
going to sleep and awaking from sleep, observing the new crescent,
observing the new fruit on trees, eating, drinking, dressing, riding,
traveling and returning from travel, etc.
Let alone all that, all those who believe in Muhammad fully perform-
even to the minute detail-every act of worship-like prayer, fasting,
charity, and pilgrimage-as this Noble Messenger (may Allah's blessings
and peace be upon him) taught and as he himself performed.
All of this allows those who believe in him, to live their lives in
all aspects with this Noble Messenger as their example, as if he was
standing before them, for them to follow in all their doings.
8. There has never been nor will there ever be a man anywhere upon
this earth who has received such love, respect, honor, and obedience
in all matters-small and large alike-as has this Noble Prophet.
9. Since his day, in every region of the earth and during every
period, this Noble Prophet has been followed by individuals from all
races, colors and peoples. Many of those who followed him were
previously Christians, Jews, pagans, idolaters, or without any
religion. Among those who chose to follow him, were those who were
known for their sound judgment, wisdom, reflection, and foresight.
They chose to follow this Noble Prophet after they witnessed the signs
of his truthfulness and the evidences of his miracles. They did not
choose to follow Muhammad out of compulsion or coercion or because
they had adopted the ways of their fathers and mothers.
Indeed many of the followers of this Prophet (may Allah's blessings
peace be upon him), chose to follow him during the time when Islam was
weak, when there were few Muslims, and when there was severe
persecution of his followers on earth. Most people who have followed
this Prophet (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) have done
so not to acquire some material benefits. Indeed many of his followers
have suffered the greatest forms of harm and persecution as a result
of following this Prophet. Despite all this harm and persecution, this
did not turn them back from his religion.
My brethren! All of this clearly indicates to anyone possessing any
sense, that this Prophet was truly and really Allah's messenger and
that he was not just a man who claimed prophethood or spoke about
Allah without knowledge.
10. With all this, Muhammad came with a great religion in its credal
and legal make-up.
Muhammad described Allah with qualities of complete perfection, and at
the same time in a manner that is free of ascribing to Him any
imperfection. Neither the philosophers or the wise could ever describe
Allah like such. Indeed it is impossible to imagine that any human
mind could conceive of an existing being that possesses such complete
ability, knowledge, and greatness; Who has subdued the creation; Who
has encompassed everything in the universe, small or large; and Who
possesses such perfect mercy.
Nor is it in the ability of any human being to place a perfect law
based upon justice, equality, mercy and objectivity for all human
activity on earth like the laws that Muhammad brought for all spheres
of human activity - like buying and selling, marriage and divorce,
renting, testimony, custody, and all other contracts that are
necessary to uphold life and civilization on earth.
11. It is impossible that any person conceive wisdom,, morals, good
manners, nobleness of characters as what this honorable Prophet (may
Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) brought.
In a full and complete manner, Muhammad spread a teaching regarding
character and manners toward one' parents, relatives, fiends, family,
humanity, animals, plants and inanimate objects. It is impossible for
the human mind alone to grasp all of that teaching or come with a
similar teaching.
All of that unequivocally indicates that this Messenger did not bring
an) of this religion from his own accord, but that it was rather a
teaching and inspiration that he received from the One Who created the
earth and the high heavens above and created this universe in its
miraculous architecture and perfection.
12. The legal and credal make-up of the religion that the Messenger,
Muhammad, (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) brought
resembles the engineering of the heavens and the earth. All of that
indicates that He who created the heavens and the earth is the One Who
sent down this great law and upright religion.
The degree of inimitability of the Divine law that was sent down upon
Muhammad is to the same degree of inimitability of the Divine creation
of the heavens and earth. For just as humanity cannot create this
universe, in the same manner humanity cannot bring forth a law like
Allah's law that He sent down upon His servant and messenger Muhammad
(may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him).
On 23 , 01:59, Todd Allcock <eleccon...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> At 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400 TB wrote:
>
> > Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus
> Christ,
> > savior and redeemer of this world.
>
> > I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
>
> Muhammad, Jesus, Zeus, the Easter Bunny, whatever- pick whichever one
> gives you a smug sense of superiority over the rest of us, and move
> on...
>
> --
>
> "I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
> or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work. Thanks for
> all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
> ACTUAL bells and whistles." -Bill Maher 9/25/2003
Twelve Proofs that Muhammad is a True Prophet
Shaykh `Abdul Rahman `Abdul Khaliq
Originally published by IANA
________________________________________
My brothers and sisters everywhere! With this essay, I am not singling
out the adherents of Islam - to which I ascribe - but rather I am
writing this essay to every man and woman throughout the whole world.
I ask Allah that He facilitates tat this essay reaches every ear,
falls under the sight of every eye, and is understood by every
heart...
Muhammad the son of `Abdullah is Allah's Prophet and the Final
Messenger Sent by Allah to the Inhabitants of Earth.
My brothers and sisters everywhere! You should know that the
Messenger, Muhammad the son of `Abdullah (may Allah's blessings and
peace be upon him) is Allah's Messenger in reality and truth. The
evidences that show his veracity are abundant. None but an infidel,
who out of arrogance alone, could deny these signs.
Among these proofs:
1. Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) was raised
illiterate, unable to read or write, and remained like that till his
death. Among all his people, he was known as being truthful and
trustworthy. Before receiving revelation, he had no prior knowledge of
Religion or any previously sent Message. He remained like that for his
first forty years. Revelation then came to Muhammad with the Koran
that we now have between our hands. This Koran mentioned most of the
accounts found in the previous scriptures, telling us about these
events in the greatest detail as if he witnessed them. These accounts
came precisely as they were found in the Torah sent down to Moses and
in the Gospel sent down to Jesus. Neither the Jews or Christians were
able to belie him regarding anything that he said.
2. Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) also
foretold of everything that would occur to him and his community after
him, pertaining to victory, the removal of the tyrannical kingdoms of
Chosroes [the royal title for the Zoroastrian kings of Persia] and
Caesar, and the establishment of the religion of Islam throughout the
earth. These events occurred exactly as Muhammad foretold, as if he
was reading the future from an open book.
3. Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) also brought
an Arabic Koran that is the peak of eloquence and clarity. The Koran
challenged those eloquent and fluent Arabs of his time, who initially
belied him, to bring forth a single chapter like the Koran. The
eloquent Arabs of his day were unable to contest this Koran.
Indeed, till our day, none has ever dared to claim that he has been
able to compose words that equal-or even approach-the order, grace,
beauty, and splendor of this Glorious Koran.
4. The life history of this Noble Prophet was a perfect example of
being upright, merciful, compassionate, truthful, brave, generous,
distant from all evil character, and ascetic in all worldly matters,
while striving solely for the reward of the Hereafter. Moreover, in
all his actions and dealings, he was ever mindful and fearful of
Allah.
5. Allah instilled great love for Muhammad (may Allah's blessings and
peace be upon him) in the hearts of all who believed in and met him.
This love reached such a degree that any of his companions would
willingly sacrifice his (or her) self, mother or father for him.
Till today, those who believe in Muhammad honor and love him. Anyone
of those who believe in him would ransom his own family and wealth to
see him, even if but once.
6. All of history has not preserved the biography of any person in the
manner it has preserved the life of Muhammad, who is the most
influential human in history.
Nor has the entire earth known of anyone whom every morning and
evening, and many times thereafter throughout the day, is thought of
by those who believe in him. Upon remembering Muhammad, the believers
in him will greet him and ask Allah to bless him. They do such with
full hearts and true love for him.
7. Nor has there every been a man on earth whom is still followed in
all his doings by those who believe in him.
Those who believe in Muhammad, sleep in the manner he slept; purify
themselves (through ablution and ritual washing) in the manner he
purified himself; and adhere to his practice in the way they eat,
drink, and clothe themselves.
Indeed in all aspects of their lives, the believers in Muhammad adhere
to the teachings he spread among them and the path that he traveled
upon during his life.
During every generation, from his day till our time, the believers in
this Noble Prophet have fully adhered to his teachings. With some,
this has reached the degree that they desire to follow and adhere to
the Prophet's way in his personal matters regarding which Allah has
not sought of them to adhere to in worship. For example, some will
only eat those specific foods or only wear those specific garments
that the Messenger liked.
Let alone all that, all those who believe in Muhammad repeat those
praises of Allah, special prayers, and invocations that he would say
during each of his actions during day and night, like: what he would
say when he greeted people, upon entering and leaving the house,
entering and leaving the mosque, entering and leaving the bathroom,
going to sleep and awaking from sleep, observing the new crescent,
observing the new fruit on trees, eating, drinking, dressing, riding,
traveling and returning from travel, etc.
Let alone all that, all those who believe in Muhammad fully perform-
even to the minute detail-every act of worship-like prayer, fasting,
charity, and pilgrimage-as this Noble Messenger (may Allah's blessings
and peace be upon him) taught and as he himself performed.
All of this allows those who believe in him, to live their lives in
all aspects with this Noble Messenger as their example, as if he was
standing before them, for them to follow in all their doings.
8. There has never been nor will there ever be a man anywhere upon
this earth who has received such love, respect, honor, and obedience
in all matters-small and large alike-as has this Noble Prophet.
9. Since his day, in every region of the earth and during every
period, this Noble Prophet has been followed by individuals from all
races, colors and peoples. Many of those who followed him were
previously Christians, Jews, pagans, idolaters, or without any
religion. Among those who chose to follow him, were those who were
known for their sound judgment, wisdom, reflection, and foresight.
They chose to follow this Noble Prophet after they witnessed the signs
of his truthfulness and the evidences of his miracles. They did not
choose to follow Muhammad out of compulsion or coercion or because
they had adopted the ways of their fathers and mothers.
Indeed many of the followers of this Prophet (may Allah's blessings
peace be upon him), chose to follow him during the time when Islam was
weak, when there were few Muslims, and when there was severe
persecution of his followers on earth. Most people who have followed
this Prophet (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) have done
so not to acquire some material benefits. Indeed many of his followers
have suffered the greatest forms of harm and persecution as a result
of following this Prophet. Despite all this harm and persecution, this
did not turn them back from his religion.
My brethren! All of this clearly indicates to anyone possessing any
sense, that this Prophet was truly and really Allah's messenger and
that he was not just a man who claimed prophethood or spoke about
Allah without knowledge.
10. With all this, Muhammad came with a great religion in its credal
and legal make-up.
Muhammad described Allah with qualities of complete perfection, and at
the same time in a manner that is free of ascribing to Him any
imperfection. Neither the philosophers or the wise could ever describe
Allah like such. Indeed it is impossible to imagine that any human
mind could conceive of an existing being that possesses such complete
ability, knowledge, and greatness; Who has subdued the creation; Who
has encompassed everything in the universe, small or large; and Who
possesses such perfect mercy.
Nor is it in the ability of any human being to place a perfect law
based upon justice, equality, mercy and objectivity for all human
activity on earth like the laws that Muhammad brought for all spheres
of human activity - like buying and selling, marriage and divorce,
renting, testimony, custody, and all other contracts that are
necessary to uphold life and civilization on earth.
11. It is impossible that any person conceive wisdom,, morals, good
manners, nobleness of characters as what this honorable Prophet (may
Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) brought.
In a full and complete manner, Muhammad spread a teaching regarding
character and manners toward one' parents, relatives, fiends, family,
humanity, animals, plants and inanimate objects. It is impossible for
the human mind alone to grasp all of that teaching or come with a
similar teaching.
All of that unequivocally indicates that this Messenger did not bring
an) of this religion from his own accord, but that it was rather a
teaching and inspiration that he received from the One Who created the
earth and the high heavens above and created this universe in its
miraculous architecture and perfection.
12. The legal and credal make-up of the religion that the Messenger,
Muhammad, (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) brought
resembles the engineering of the heavens and the earth. All of that
indicates that He who created the heavens and the earth is the One Who
sent down this great law and upright religion.
The degree of inimitability of the Divine law that was sent down upon
Muhammad is to the same degree of inimitability of the Divine creation
of the heavens and earth. For just as humanity cannot create this
universe, in the same manner humanity cannot bring forth a law like
Allah's law that He sent down upon His servant and messenger Muhammad
(may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him).
On 23 , 01:59, Todd Allcock <eleccon...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:
> At 22 Aug 2007 13:20:42 -0400 TB wrote:
>
> > Funny. In this whole passage there was not one mention of Jesus
> Christ,
> > savior and redeemer of this world.
>
> > I guess Jesus must be his "Inconvenient Truth".
>
> Muhammad, Jesus, Zeus, the Easter Bunny, whatever- pick whichever one
> gives you a smug sense of superiority over the rest of us, and move
> on...
>
> --
>
> "I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
> or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work. Thanks for
> all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
> ACTUAL bells and whistles." -Bill Maher 9/25/2003
here some information about Jesus .
Without a doubt, you have often heard the claim that Jesus is God, the
second person in the "Holy trinity." However, the very Bible which is
used as a basis for knowledge about Jesus and as the basis for
doctrine within Christianity clearly belies this claim. We urge you to
consult your own Bible and verify that the following conclusions are
not drawn out of context:
1. God is All Knowing.....but Jesus was not
When speaking of the day of judgment, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a
limitation on his knowledge when he said, "but of that day and hour
knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the
son, but the Father." Mark 13:32, and Matt 24:36. But God knows all.
His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own
admission, did not know when the day of judgment would be, is clear
proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not
God.
2. God is All Powerful.....but Jesus was not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the
power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said,
"Verily, verily I say unto you, the Son can do nothing of himself, but
what he seeth the Father do..." St. John 5:19. Again he said, "I can
of mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgment is
just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father
which hath sent me." St. John 5:30. But God is not only all-powerful,
He is also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his
own admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus
is not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.
3. God does not have a God.....but Jesus did have a God.
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call
upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was one
whom he worshipped and to whom he prayed when he said, "l ascend unto
my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." St. John
20:17. He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, "My
God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?" Matt 27:46. If Jesus were God,
then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself why hast thou forsaken
me?" Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord's
prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of
Gethsemane he prayed, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup
pass from me: Nevertheless not as I will but as thou wilt." Matt
26:36-39. Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own
admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed
to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.
4. God is an invisible spirit.....but Jesus was flesh and blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that
this could not be done with God when he said. "No man hath seen God at
any time." St. John 1:18. '"Ye have neither heard His voice at any
time nor seen His shape." St. John 5:37. He also said in St. John
4:24. "God is a spirit and they that worship him must worship him in
spirit and in truth." That Jesus would say that no one had seen or
heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is
clear proof that Jesus was not God.
5. No one is greater than God and no one can direct Him but Jesus
acknowledged someone greater than himself whose will was distinct from
his own.
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not
equal, and therefore not one and the same, come again from the mouth
of Jesus himself who said in St. John 14:28, "My Father is greater
than I." When someone referred to him as good master in Matt 19:17,
Jesus responded, "Why callest thou me good? There is none good but
one, that is God..." Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions
between himself and God when he said, "I proceeded forth and came from
God, neither came I of myself but He sent me." St. John 8:42. Jesus
gave clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his
equality with God,when he said in Luke 22:42, "not my will but thine
be done" and in St. John 5:30, "I seek not mine own will but the will
of the Father which hath sent me." That Jesus would admit that he did
not come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do
so, that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself,
and that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the
will of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One
and therefore Jesus is not God.
Conclusion
The Church recognizes the Bible as the primary source of knowledge
about God and Jesus. But since the Bible makes it clear that Jesus is
not the Supreme Being and the Supreme Being is not Jesus, upon what
basis have you come to believe otherwise?
My brother or sister, the belief that the Supreme Being is a Trinity
is false and completely inconsistent with the words of Jesus as
presented in the Bible. God is one, not three. He is a perfect unity.
If you are interested in the truth about God and your relationship to
Him, we invite you to investigate the religion of Islam.
What is the word of God about Jesus:
A. Regarding Sonship of Jesus:
That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth, concerning which they
are doubting. It is not for God to take a son unto Him. Glory be to
Him! When He decrees a thing he but says to it "Be", and it is.
(Qur'an 19:34,35).
And they say, 'The All-merciful has taken unto Himself a son.' You
have indeed advanced something hideous. The heavens are well nigh rent
of it and the earth split asunder, and the mountains well nigh fall
down crashing for that they have attributed to the All-Merciful a son;
and it behoves not the All-Merciful to take a son. None is there in
the heavens and earth but comes to the All-Merciful as a servant
(Qur'an 19:88-93).
Truly the likeness of Jesus, in God's sight, is as Adam's likeness; He
created him of dust, then said He unto him, "Be", and he was. (Qur'an
3:59).
People of the Book, go not beyond the bounds in your religion, and say
not as to God but the Truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only
the Messenger of God, and His Word that He committed to Mary, and a
spirit from Him. So believe in God and His Messengers. and say not,
'Three', Refrain, better is it for you. God is only One God. Glory be
on Him - that He should have a son! To Him belongs that which is in
the heavens and on the earth, God suffices for a guardian. (Qur'an
4:171)
B. Regarding Jesus being God:
And when God said. 'O Jesus son of Mary,did you say unto men, "Take me
and my mother as gods, apart from God?" He Said, 'To You be Glory! It
is not mine to say what I have no right to. If I indeed said it, You
knew it, knowing what is within my soul, and I do not know what is
within Your soul; You know the things unseen. I only said to them what
You did command me: "Serve God, my Lord and your Lord." And I was a
witness over them, while I remained among them; but when You did take
me to Yourself the Watcher over them; You are the witness of
everything. (Quran 5:116,117)
C. Regarding Crucifiction of Jesus:
And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty
calumny, and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of
Mary, the Messenger of God'...yet they did not slay him, neither
crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who
are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they
have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they
did not slay him of certainty... no indeed, God raised him up to Him;
God is Almighty, All-Wise. There is not one of the people of the Book
but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the
Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them. (Qur'an
4:156-159)
On 23 , 03:52, Larry <no...@home.com> wrote:
> Peter Zenger <PeterZen...@nyweeklyjournal.com> wrote innews:5b7oc3586fu2549tv5fjpu8n2k8udh2j34@4ax.com:
>
> > You mean the pedophile, who marries 14 year old girls?
>
> > Yeah, really upstanding guy...
>
> First, I'd like to point out that I am an atheist. There is no God, just
> a God dilusion.
>
> I'd also like to point out that in the time of Christ and Muhammad the
> average life span of a human male was around 30 years, due as much to
> man's inherent ability to murder his own species as his miserable diet
> and diseases.
>
> During that era, it would behoove every male in this murderous group of
> tribes to breed like rabbits as soon as the females were ripe, about 12-
> 14 years of age, the beginning of a human female's reproductive life.
>
> This religious nonsense of waiting until half the female's most fertile
> years are over and some religious nut has pronounced him and her as
> approved for breeding would, probably, have resulted in many species of
> humans under their control simply becoming extinct in a few generations.
>
> Nature takes care of this extinction problem by making all males
> "pedophiles", by natural selection. Every ad man knows this is true and
> creates advertisements to cause sexual arousal for YOUTH in every ad you
> see. There are no car ads depicting sexy 55 year old hags laid out over
> the hood of the latest Lexus to get you to buy one. They're not stupid.
>
> I'm a month younger than Cher. She's the only one of that age group that
> excites me...(c;
>
> Larry
> --
> Cher NEVER has to sleep alone!
here some information about Jesus .
Without a doubt, you have often heard the claim that Jesus is God, the
second person in the "Holy trinity." However, the very Bible which is
used as a basis for knowledge about Jesus and as the basis for
doctrine within Christianity clearly belies this claim. We urge you to
consult your own Bible and verify that the following conclusions are
not drawn out of context:
1. God is All Knowing.....but Jesus was not
When speaking of the day of judgment, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a
limitation on his knowledge when he said, "but of that day and hour
knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the
son, but the Father." Mark 13:32, and Matt 24:36. But God knows all.
His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own
admission, did not know when the day of judgment would be, is clear
proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not
God.
2. God is All Powerful.....but Jesus was not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the
power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said,
"Verily, verily I say unto you, the Son can do nothing of himself, but
what he seeth the Father do..." St. John 5:19. Again he said, "I can
of mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgment is
just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father
which hath sent me." St. John 5:30. But God is not only all-powerful,
He is also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his
own admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus
is not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.
3. God does not have a God.....but Jesus did have a God.
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call
upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was one
whom he worshipped and to whom he prayed when he said, "l ascend unto
my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." St. John
20:17. He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, "My
God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?" Matt 27:46. If Jesus were God,
then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself why hast thou forsaken
me?" Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord's
prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of
Gethsemane he prayed, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup
pass from me: Nevertheless not as I will but as thou wilt." Matt
26:36-39. Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own
admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed
to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.
4. God is an invisible spirit.....but Jesus was flesh and blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that
this could not be done with God when he said. "No man hath seen God at
any time." St. John 1:18. '"Ye have neither heard His voice at any
time nor seen His shape." St. John 5:37. He also said in St. John
4:24. "God is a spirit and they that worship him must worship him in
spirit and in truth." That Jesus would say that no one had seen or
heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is
clear proof that Jesus was not God.
5. No one is greater than God and no one can direct Him but Jesus
acknowledged someone greater than himself whose will was distinct from
his own.
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not
equal, and therefore not one and the same, come again from the mouth
of Jesus himself who said in St. John 14:28, "My Father is greater
than I." When someone referred to him as good master in Matt 19:17,
Jesus responded, "Why callest thou me good? There is none good but
one, that is God..." Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions
between himself and God when he said, "I proceeded forth and came from
God, neither came I of myself but He sent me." St. John 8:42. Jesus
gave clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his
equality with God,when he said in Luke 22:42, "not my will but thine
be done" and in St. John 5:30, "I seek not mine own will but the will
of the Father which hath sent me." That Jesus would admit that he did
not come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do
so, that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself,
and that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the
will of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One
and therefore Jesus is not God.
Conclusion
The Church recognizes the Bible as the primary source of knowledge
about God and Jesus. But since the Bible makes it clear that Jesus is
not the Supreme Being and the Supreme Being is not Jesus, upon what
basis have you come to believe otherwise?
My brother or sister, the belief that the Supreme Being is a Trinity
is false and completely inconsistent with the words of Jesus as
presented in the Bible. God is one, not three. He is a perfect unity.
If you are interested in the truth about God and your relationship to
Him, we invite you to investigate the religion of Islam.
What is the word of God about Jesus:
A. Regarding Sonship of Jesus:
That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth, concerning which they
are doubting. It is not for God to take a son unto Him. Glory be to
Him! When He decrees a thing he but says to it "Be", and it is.
(Qur'an 19:34,35).
And they say, 'The All-merciful has taken unto Himself a son.' You
have indeed advanced something hideous. The heavens are well nigh rent
of it and the earth split asunder, and the mountains well nigh fall
down crashing for that they have attributed to the All-Merciful a son;
and it behoves not the All-Merciful to take a son. None is there in
the heavens and earth but comes to the All-Merciful as a servant
(Qur'an 19:88-93).
Truly the likeness of Jesus, in God's sight, is as Adam's likeness; He
created him of dust, then said He unto him, "Be", and he was. (Qur'an
3:59).
People of the Book, go not beyond the bounds in your religion, and say
not as to God but the Truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only
the Messenger of God, and His Word that He committed to Mary, and a
spirit from Him. So believe in God and His Messengers. and say not,
'Three', Refrain, better is it for you. God is only One God. Glory be
on Him - that He should have a son! To Him belongs that which is in
the heavens and on the earth, God suffices for a guardian. (Qur'an
4:171)
B. Regarding Jesus being God:
And when God said. 'O Jesus son of Mary,did you say unto men, "Take me
and my mother as gods, apart from God?" He Said, 'To You be Glory! It
is not mine to say what I have no right to. If I indeed said it, You
knew it, knowing what is within my soul, and I do not know what is
within Your soul; You know the things unseen. I only said to them what
You did command me: "Serve God, my Lord and your Lord." And I was a
witness over them, while I remained among them; but when You did take
me to Yourself the Watcher over them; You are the witness of
everything. (Quran 5:116,117)
C. Regarding Crucifiction of Jesus:
And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty
calumny, and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of
Mary, the Messenger of God'...yet they did not slay him, neither
crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who
are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they
have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they
did not slay him of certainty... no indeed, God raised him up to Him;
God is Almighty, All-Wise. There is not one of the people of the Book
but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the
Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them. (Qur'an
4:156-159)
On 23 , 03:52, Larry <no...@home.com> wrote:
> Peter Zenger <PeterZen...@nyweeklyjournal.com> wrote innews:5b7oc3586fu2549tv5fjpu8n2k8udh2j34@4ax.com:
>
> > You mean the pedophile, who marries 14 year old girls?
>
> > Yeah, really upstanding guy...
>
> First, I'd like to point out that I am an atheist. There is no God, just
> a God dilusion.
>
> I'd also like to point out that in the time of Christ and Muhammad the
> average life span of a human male was around 30 years, due as much to
> man's inherent ability to murder his own species as his miserable diet
> and diseases.
>
> During that era, it would behoove every male in this murderous group of
> tribes to breed like rabbits as soon as the females were ripe, about 12-
> 14 years of age, the beginning of a human female's reproductive life.
>
> This religious nonsense of waiting until half the female's most fertile
> years are over and some religious nut has pronounced him and her as
> approved for breeding would, probably, have resulted in many species of
> humans under their control simply becoming extinct in a few generations.
>
> Nature takes care of this extinction problem by making all males
> "pedophiles", by natural selection. Every ad man knows this is true and
> creates advertisements to cause sexual arousal for YOUTH in every ad you
> see. There are no car ads depicting sexy 55 year old hags laid out over
> the hood of the latest Lexus to get you to buy one. They're not stupid.
>
> I'm a month younger than Cher. She's the only one of that age group that
> excites me...(c;
>
> Larry
> --
> Cher NEVER has to sleep alone!
How Do Muslims Treat the Elderly?
In the Islamic world, one rarely finds "old people's homes." The
strain of caring for one's parents in this most difficult time of
their lives is considered an honor and a blessing and an opportunity
for great spiritual growth. In Islam, it is not enough that we only
pray for our parents, but we should act with limitless compassion,
remembering that when we were helpless children, they preferred us to
themselves. Mothers are particularly honored. When Muslim parents
reach old age, they are treated mercifully, with kindness and
selflessness.
abdo911 <jipksaman@gmail.com> wrote in news:1187869326.807461.85080
@m37g2000prh.googlegroups.com:
> Without a doubt, you have often heard the claim that Jesus is God, the
> second person in the "Holy trinity." However, the very Bible which is
> used as a basis for knowledge about Jesus and as the basis for
> doctrine within Christianity clearly belies this claim. We urge you to
> consult your own Bible and verify that the following conclusions are
> not drawn out of context:
>
>
Have you guys seen the video about some construction workers digging up an
ancient grave and the researchers finding Jesus' family, including a box
with his bones in it and his name on it, in that vault?
Most interesting. I wonder if we'd survive the murders if the populations
across the planet found proof it was all a big lie. It's almost too scary
to contemplate, given some of the religious genocide the planet has such a
terrible history of producing.
abdo911 <jipksaman@gmail.com> wrote in news:1187869641.837062.270010
@l22g2000prc.googlegroups.com:
> How Do Muslims Treat the Elderly?
> In the Islamic world, one rarely finds "old people's homes." The
> strain of caring for one's parents in this most difficult time of
> their lives is considered an honor and a blessing and an opportunity
> for great spiritual growth. In Islam, it is not enough that we only
> pray for our parents, but we should act with limitless compassion,
> remembering that when we were helpless children, they preferred us to
> themselves. Mothers are particularly honored. When Muslim parents
> reach old age, they are treated mercifully, with kindness and
> selflessness.
>
>
I have some first-hand knowledge to support this statement. In 1978-
1979, I worked for Pan Am Tech Services, a part of Pan Am Airlines, who
had a contract with the Iranian Air Force at Doshen-Tappeh IAFB in
Tehran. We were in the SIGINT/ELINT business keeping an eye on Iran's
neighbors, recording their transmissions and RF emissions with C-130
aircraft and Watkins-Johnson equipment. My job was to build an
electronic calibration laboratory as part of the mission
support/logistics contract on the base.
Each day, after the Air Force people had cleared the mess halls, a long
stream of elderly men (I don't remember ever seeing any women but that
doesn't mean they didn't participate in another area I was not near on
the large base)....these men wore metal ID tags around their necks, very
poor old men, and they were fed by the Air Force mess halls. This goes
along with this "elderly compassion" for those who either didn't have
families, or their families, themselves, could not care for them.
I was, also, involved with many Iranian families, both in my neighborhood
and elsewhere, that I'd become friendly with. In all these homes,
elderly parents, grandparents and great grandparents were being taken
care of by the families and held with great respect. Many of these older
people had never seen an American, except on TV, and I spent a good deal
of time with the younger children acting as my interpreter answering
their questions about Americans, America and Sears Roebuck Stores they
had heard about...(c;
Mothers, the source of the families' boys so cherished, were treated with
much respect AFTER the boys had been born.
Another amazing thing is how children were raised. Until they were 7,
they pretty much did as they pleased with little interference until their
games became dangerous. At 7, the boys were spoiled ROTTEN, which
accounted for how those Iranian Air Force officers and homofars (warrant
officers) I had daily dealings with at work acted, spoiled rotten...and
the girls were made into those burka'd submissives (I'm being nice).
All this was total culture shock to an American WASP plopped down in
their culture with no preparation at all from the company.
It's really too bad they're taught to hate Americans by the theocracy-in-
charge-at-the-moment. Once acclimated to being told most things were "It
is forbidden.", I had a great tour for 2.6 years right up until the end
with the submachine gun fire waking me up at dawn in '79.
I never got over what Iranian school children were taught in school.
High School students (our standards) were easily in their 2nd or 3rd year
of college level work before they were 16. I had no trouble getting one
of them into Cornell University to study in America. He literally aced
the entrance exams!
> It's really too bad they're taught to hate Americans by the theocracy-in-
> charge-at-the-moment.
It does suck. Stupid Muslim fundamentalists give the rest of them a bad name.
I've given up trying to convince Americans that not all Muslims are crazed
jihadists and suicide bombers.
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
- Natasha Beddingfield
Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in
news:slrnfctrdi.i6a.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.net:
> I've given up trying to convince Americans that not all Muslims are
> crazed jihadists and suicide bombers.
>
>
Put a little fun in your browser. Visit Mahmood in Bahrain! Mahmood owns
a TV production business and is the greatest blogger in my favorite little
kingdom, Bahrain. Be prepared to have some fun and marvel at his garden!
He'll blow everything Tel Aviv tried to brainwash you with about Arabs out
the window. Watch his video blogs from here, too. He had great coverage
of the Bahraini Formula One racing and street racing....all very
professional.
Some of my friends got confused when his wife gave him a new gas grille for
the patio for Christmas....(c; The kids made Christmas cookies....
Larry wrote:
> Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in
> news:slrnfctrdi.i6a.sjsobol@amethyst.justthe.net:
>
>> I've given up trying to convince Americans that not all Muslims are
>> crazed jihadists and suicide bombers.
>>
>>
>
> Put a little fun in your browser. Visit Mahmood in Bahrain! Mahmood owns
> a TV production business and is the greatest blogger in my favorite little
> kingdom, Bahrain. Be prepared to have some fun and marvel at his garden!
>
> http://mahmood.tv/
>
> He'll blow everything Tel Aviv tried to brainwash you with about Arabs out
> the window. Watch his video blogs from here, too. He had great coverage
> of the Bahraini Formula One racing and street racing....all very
> professional.
>
> Some of my friends got confused when his wife gave him a new gas grille for
> the patio for Christmas....(c; The kids made Christmas cookies....
>
> I wish I had Arab neighbors like Mahmood....(c;
>
> Larry
Jim Higgins <gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote in news:13cuuj2oq6p0q81
@corp.supernews.com:
> Larry wrote:
>> Jim Higgins <gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote in news:13cuo6pdahlpg50
>> @corp.supernews.com:
>>
>>> www.thereligionofpeace.com
>>
>> http://www.jewwatch.com/
>>
>
> Another Bar Mitzvah failure, eh?
>
Balanced reporting.....
3 of my friends died on USS Liberty at Israeli hands. It could have just
as well been me as we were in the same electronics school.
> 3 of my friends died on USS Liberty at Israeli hands. It could have just
> as well been me as we were in the same electronics school.
Do I need to educate you again, on the fact that Israeli doesn't necessarily
mean Jewish, and that not all Jews agree with everything Israel, AS A
POLITICAL ENTITY, does?
I have no problem with your beef against Israel regarding the _Liberty._ I
believe you have every right to be upset. But you're using your (justified)
anger as an excuse to vilify all Jews. (Again.)
What reason do you have to believe that the _Liberty_ incident was a result of
religious ideology?
I'd love to hear your answer. Of course, I'm still waiting to find out how you
figure I'm a member of Mossad...
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
- Natasha Beddingfield
Larry wrote :
> Jim Higgins <gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote in news:13cuuj2oq6p0q81
> @corp.supernews.com:
>
>> Larry wrote:
>>> Jim Higgins <gordian238@hotmail.com> wrote in news:13cuo6pdahlpg50
>>> @corp.supernews.com:
>>>
>>>> www.thereligionofpeace.com
>>>
>>> http://www.jewwatch.com/
>>>
>>
>> Another Bar Mitzvah failure, eh?
>>
>
> Balanced reporting.....
>
> 3 of my friends died on USS Liberty at Israeli hands. It could have just
> as well been me as we were in the same electronics school.
>
> Larry
Larry,
You're just an anti semetic POS. Should have been you.
Steve Sobol wrote:
> On 2007-08-25, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
>
>> 3 of my friends died on USS Liberty at Israeli hands. It could have just
>> as well been me as we were in the same electronics school.
>
> Do I need to educate you again, on the fact that Israeli doesn't necessarily
> mean Jewish, and that not all Jews agree with everything Israel, AS A
> POLITICAL ENTITY, does?
>
> I have no problem with your beef against Israel regarding the _Liberty._ I
> believe you have every right to be upset. But you're using your (justified)
> anger as an excuse to vilify all Jews. (Again.)
>
> What reason do you have to believe that the _Liberty_ incident was a result of
> religious ideology?
>
> I'd love to hear your answer. Of course, I'm still waiting to find out how you
> figure I'm a member of Mossad...
You're wasting your time trying to reason with this guy.
On 2007-08-25, Notan <notan@ddressthatcanbespammed> wrote:
> You're wasting your time trying to reason with this guy.
> Do you *really* expect an intelligent answer?
I expect to be ignored, but I still have to say *something.*
--
Steve Sobol, Victorville, California PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
- Natasha Beddingfield
Steve Sobol wrote:
> On 2007-08-25, Notan <notan@ddressthatcanbespammed> wrote:
>
>> You're wasting your time trying to reason with this guy.
>
>> Do you *really* expect an intelligent answer?
>
> I expect to be ignored, but I still have to say *something.*
On Sun, 26 Aug 2007 03:17:27 +0000, Larry <noone@home.com> wrote:
>TeddeLI <Spam@nospam.neat> wrote in news:mn.cbd97d78088e2bb9.69402
>@nospam.neat:
>
>> Larry,
>> You're just an anti semetic POS. Should have been you.
>>
>>
>>
>
>So aren't "they".....isolated from birth and told the rest of us are just
>pack animals.
>
YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN 
Linear Mode
