Re: Laptop Battery recalls moronic hysteria or actual big spike in problems?

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:26:16 GMT, "JohnS@hawaii.rr.com"
<JohnS@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:

>This issue was posted a while ago in this group but I noticed some
>people are really jumping on it at various websites.
>
>Ive read the articles and frankly theyve always said Lith Ion is
>inherently dangerous though the probability of a problem is veryvery
>low. So given the fact that at this price point with this technology
>---- its considered an acceptable risk just like the fact we drive
>around in gas powered cars that can burn us to a crisp in the right
>crash etc. is it really that much of a story? Almost all devices have
>some degree of risk.

Consider that the car has to crash, but the laptop could be
sitting there innocently. Also consider that laptops are
(as a %), more often owned by the rich than poor, so of
course there's more weight behind the paranoia.

Yes Li-Ion is an inherantly dangerous technology, requiring
every duck to be in a row in today's rapid-charge,
rapid-discharge, make-everything-small-as-possible, market.
Plus there's that issue that some of these devices are used
on laps or against ears, not just sittinng in a corner.

>
>For one thing the articles admit laptop and other device fires have
>been going on for years though its very rare compared to the tens of
>millions of devices sold. Are the numbers way up this year?

The problem is that now internet news and general
communication has dramatically risen, we're exposed to news
we wouldn't have been a few short years ago. Certainly Dell
et al. aren't going to be forthcoming about past battery
explosions if it's possible to conceil these product
failures, but today it's harder to hide it, AND notebooks
are ever more common... and at lower price-points, AND there
was a time not so long ago when notebooks didnt' even use
Lithium cells, so whether % of problems has gone up or not,
total # of explosions has, and that is a definite liability
issue.


>Some say
>probably not. One article compares it to the shark stories where you
>have the same very low number of shark attacks but if one gruesome
>story is caught on film or pushed by the press then suddenly hysteria
>about sharks ensues for that year. The fact these fires are caught on
>video and dumped on the net now make the dangers seem much more real.

.... but I don't know if they'd established that there are
more sharks, or more people in the water, while there are
certainly more laptops in use today than ever before. As
for percentages, I think we still aren't seeing ALL the
news, only that which was captured with a camera at the
time.



>
>Personally id like to see a Valence Lith Ion battery option if its
>safer as they claim even at a slightly higher price but so far though
>I thought people in this newsgroup were a bit quick on jumping on that
>guy who wanted a "safer" battery for a laptop for his kid, when I see
>the ridiculously idiotic hysterical posting at websites as if tens of
>thousands of laptops are bursting into flames acting as if the
>probability is as high as 80% , its getting ridiculous.

I think the idea of a safter battery is a good one, but
practically speaking, we have to buy what the market is
selling. We can desire a safer battery but when all is said
and done, most would gamble with a typical battery instead
of paying significantly more.

I have an entirely different take on batteries than some
people though, I wouldn't care if a laptop weighed two
pounds more and 10 cu. in. larger to use NiMH. Going
further, I'd rather the entire laptop were 1/2" thicker and
5 lbs. heavier if it could then run for 8 hours per charge,
I consider it ridiculous that they are currently averaging
around 2.5-3.5 hours runtime unless lightly used. Sure, I
could carry a spare battery or two or three but that goes
against the whole idea of a laptop, that it's all integrated
into one *piece* of gear.

My main use laptop has a 17" screen and they couldn't even
manage to fit a second battery bay in it... and while I
accept that a large screen may use more power, and that more
or larger batteries may raise the price $100, I still don't
see so many laptops offering real alternatives instead of 32
flavors of essentially the same thing, only built around a
different # of features and screen size, thickness.

>
>Just google exploding phones and probably other devices and youll see
>stories going way back.
>
>Here one example :
>
>A string of laptop fires, sparked by faulty or overheated batteries,
>is raising concern with industry experts and computer manufacturers.
>As many as 43 laptop fires have been reported in the United States
>since 2001, according to statistics compiled by the U.S. Consumer
>Product Safety Commission.
>
>No one died, but some laptop users were severely injured, CPSC
>spokesperson Julie Vallese said. To curb this trend, laptop companies
>have recalled more than 150,000 batteries since Jan. 1, 2005.
>
>Hewlett-Packard (NYSE: HPQ) recalled 15,700 of them in April alone.
>
>Dell (Nasdaq: DELL) recalled 22,000 batteries in December, and Apple
>recalled about 120,000 batteries in 2005.

I think one of the key things right now is that Sony's cells
may have an internal defect, against what Sony had
originally suggested, that it was a Dell-unique battery
problem. If this is the case, those same Sony cells may be
in a signfiicant % of laptops sold (and still running).