>It's time to replace the aging and now noisy Yamaha 161040 CDRW drive with a
>DVD writer CDRW burner.
>
>There are numerous makes, Sony, NEC, Pioneer, LiteON etc so which does one
>go for.
>
>£30 to £80 appears the range.
>
>dj
NEC is good and cheap in the US. Its really popular cause the
barebones version sells for as low as 48 bucks US here. Other makes
that are cheap and decent Ive heard are the BenQ and Liteon. Some
people have been hyping LG recently too in various groups.
"Bob" <spam@uce.gov> wrote in message
news:42eb2226.40046921@news-server.houston.rr.com...
> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 04:54:00 +0000 (UTC), "Ted"
> <OnThe@Upbtinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>Sony
>
> Stay away from anything made by Sony. My son bought a Sony DL DVD RW
> and Sony won't support it.
>
>>NEC
>
> The NEC 3540 is hands down the best unit on the market. Get this one.
>
>>Pioneer, LiteON etc
>
> Credible players, but the NEC 3540 is the one to buy. It has the
> widest support base.
>
>
> --
>
> Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
> http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html
>
> "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
> --Benjamin Franklin
>
yes, I looked at the 3520 but will review the 3540.
for general data saving use which type of dvd media should I buy, -R or +R
>
>yes, I looked at the 3520 but will review the 3540.
>
>for general data saving use which type of dvd media should I buy, -R or +R
>
>thanks all
Doesnt really matter. The burner is a dual format so it burns on both
type of discs. The more important thing is what brand it is. And the
thing about that is actually who makes the disks. There are a few
makers of the disks and they rebranded under various retail names like
Memorex , etc
My needs are not that critical so I buy ANYTHING that works which
means doesnt come up dead after initial burn. Nowadays especially with
the NEC which is popular and has lots of firmware updates usually to
adjust for various media out there one of the good things in buying a
popular burner ---- it can burn virtually anything to the degree you
dont get duds. However some brands may be better quality and/or more
compatible with the drive.
Some disks mentioned a lot as "quality disks" are Taiyo Yudens and
certain Riteks.
If you back up movies --- theres the old line about DVD-R being more
compatible but like Ive always posted I havent found that to be the
case. I initially bought all DVD+R here where I am its more limited
the availabiliity of various things --- and I first had a single
format DVD+R writer. It always played on all the 7 players I had
access too no problem. And like I said I bought various cheapo
brands. You can now change the booktype with the drives so that
further increases compatiblity with players if you have a problem.
Thats not to say the claim is false. I just havent found that to be
the case but there have been people posting who claim they have
massive compatiblity problems.
"John@Smith.com" <xxxxspud@newscene.com> wrote in message
news:65cme15bp8ofhat0c30p96s74q58ts2pfo@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 07:25:39 +0000 (UTC), "Ted"
> <OnThe@Upbtinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>yes, I looked at the 3520 but will review the 3540.
>>
<snip>
i have the NEC 3520
and did some HD backups.
50 DVD's were burned in a row without a single coaster!!!!
that was a few months back...and to date...the unit has been flawless...
of course the 3540 may be even a better unit...but for sure NEC is good!
"Bob" <spam@uce.gov> wrote in message
news:42eb6827.57968296@news-server.houston.rr.com...
> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 04:30:48 -0500, "philo" <philo@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>>50 DVD's were burned in a row without a single coaster!!!!
>
> What were the discs and what speed was the burn?
>
>
I used some Sony discs (DVD) that I just picked up at the closest
drugstore.
They were marked as 8x but they worked at 16x !!!
They must have been mislabeled...as one would not normally be able to burn
at a higher speed than marked.
For regular CD's I used Phillip's and I opted to burn at less than full
speed...
maybe 40x . Thus far that NEC drive has been working great.
BTW: The software I use is Nero 6. I highly recommend it.
Also , my machine is an AMD-1100 with 640 megs of ram running XP pro
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 08:26:21 -0500, "philo" <philo@privacy.net> wrote:
>>>50 DVD's were burned in a row without a single coaster!!!!
>> What were the discs and what speed was the burn?
>I used some Sony discs (DVD) that I just picked up at the closest
>drugstore.
>They were marked as 8x but they worked at 16x !!!
>They must have been mislabeled...as one would not normally be able to burn
>at a higher speed than marked.
>For regular CD's I used Phillip's and I opted to burn at less than full
>speed...
>maybe 40x . Thus far that NEC drive has been working great.
>BTW: The software I use is Nero 6. I highly recommend it.
>Also , my machine is an AMD-1100 with 640 megs of ram running XP pro
I talked my son into giving me the Sony DVD burner he bought a year
ago - the one which Sony won't support, what a bunch of pricks - and
get an NEC 3540. He also got some Taiyo Yuden 16x DVD-R. No problems.
He is sooooo busy that he barely has time to rip and burn - that's why
he needs a fast burner like the NEC, one that won't give him any
hassles. I, on the other hand, have nothing but time on my hands so I
don't mind burning at 4x with that Sony. I can use those crap 8x
Memorex from Worst Buy - as long as I burn at 4x. At 8x all the Sony
could turn out is coasters, one after the other.
I run DVD Decrypter and it has a Verify feature. I burnt a bunch the
other day at 4x and all passed the Verify test. The thing I like about
Decrypter, besides Verify, is that it runs in background, letting me
do my usual stuff in foreground. Burning a batch consists mainly in
flipping discs back and forth.
I have Nero 6 OEM and I loaded it once but it puts all sorts of crap
in background so I unloaded it. I mean, what the flunk is InCD? I
still use EZ Creator for CDs anyway.
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 16:11:11 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>>Also , my machine is an AMD-1100 with 640 megs of ram running XP pro
>
>I talked my son into giving me the Sony DVD burner he bought a year
>ago - the one which Sony won't support, what a bunch of pricks - and
>get an NEC 3540. He also got some Taiyo Yuden 16x DVD-R. No problems.
>
>He is sooooo busy that he barely has time to rip and burn - that's why
>he needs a fast burner like the NEC, one that won't give him any
>hassles. I, on the other hand, have nothing but time on my hands so I
>don't mind burning at 4x with that Sony. I can use those crap 8x
>Memorex from Worst Buy - as long as I burn at 4x. At 8x all the Sony
>could turn out is coasters, one after the other.
You might seek some web forums, there's probably some info
out there to convert it back to a regular Liteon drive,
perhaps even the firmware and tools in an easy to use
package. However, if the Sony drive comes with branded
software that software may no longer work if it's flashed to
Liteon firmware.
>
>I run DVD Decrypter and it has a Verify feature. I burnt a bunch the
>other day at 4x and all passed the Verify test. The thing I like about
>Decrypter, besides Verify, is that it runs in background, letting me
>do my usual stuff in foreground. Burning a batch consists mainly in
>flipping discs back and forth.
>
>I have Nero 6 OEM and I loaded it once but it puts all sorts of crap
>in background so I unloaded it. I mean, what the flunk is InCD? I
>still use EZ Creator for CDs anyway.
InCD is a RW filesystem driver. If you don't RW, you don't
need to run it. It seems that far too many popular apps
theese days unnecessarily assume people want more background
tasks. You can always disable these from loading then try
the (needed) app/functionality.
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:40:08 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>You might seek some web forums, there's probably some info
>out there to convert it back to a regular Liteon drive,
>perhaps even the firmware and tools in an easy to use
>package. However, if the Sony drive comes with branded
>software that software may no longer work if it's flashed to
>Liteon firmware.
Therein lies the rub. If I screw around I may make the unit
inoperable.
I have the resources to get my own NEC 3540 - after all, what's 50
bucks these days. But I have the Sony and it does burn DVD-R at 4x
reliably and I have plenty of spare time on my hands.
Like right now. I am burning the second disc of a very good series
called Tilt, with Michael Madsen, and I am typing this reply at the
same time. Task Manager tray icon says I am not using but 5-8% of the
CPU total.
>InCD is a RW filesystem driver. If you don't RW, you don't
>need to run it. It seems that far too many popular apps
>theese days unnecessarily assume people want more background
>tasks. You can always disable these from loading then try
>the (needed) app/functionality.
Thanks for the heads up. I haven't burnt a CD-RW in 8 years. They only
work reliably on the machine you burn them on. CDs are so cheap it's
not worth the hassle.
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:15:55 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:42:03 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>
>>>InCD is a RW filesystem driver. If you don't RW, you don't
>>>need to run it.
>
>>Don't know what I was thinking, it's a packet writing driver
>>not necessarily RW.
>
>Does that mean I can get away with not installing it? I believe packet
>writing is used only over a network, and I have no need to do that.
No packet writing is done with incremental CD burning.
Instead of buring entire contents of a disc at once it's
treated more like a (small) hard drive.
I dont recall if there's the option to not install, but one
of the myriad Windows startup/boot monitoring utilities can
easily enough keep it from loading.
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 20:15:01 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:40:08 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>
>>You might seek some web forums, there's probably some info
>>out there to convert it back to a regular Liteon drive,
>>perhaps even the firmware and tools in an easy to use
>>package. However, if the Sony drive comes with branded
>>software that software may no longer work if it's flashed to
>>Liteon firmware.
>
>Therein lies the rub. If I screw around I may make the unit
>inoperable.
Well this isn't exactly experimental, people do it and if
it's known to work, by now there've been a ton of people
that did it. That's the benefit of the web forum, to see
confirmation that it works on your specific drive with
(which) specific firmware.
>
>I have the resources to get my own NEC 3540 - after all, what's 50
>bucks these days. But I have the Sony and it does burn DVD-R at 4x
>reliably and I have plenty of spare time on my hands.
Fair enough, but liteons aren't exactly trash either, once
they have a modern firmware to aide in media
detection/routines it should be able to burn at full speed
on more media. Basically, Sony only flashes the old
firmware. ANY newer firmware for same drive exists for a
reason, either bug fixes or media compatibility. Providing
you use the right firmware it's a win-win situation (so long
as you confirm what works, the specific firmware and steps
to flash it).
>
>Like right now. I am burning the second disc of a very good series
>called Tilt, with Michael Madsen, and I am typing this reply at the
>same time. Task Manager tray icon says I am not using but 5-8% of the
>CPU total.
? OK but I seem to be missing the point. Any drive using
UDMA should be around that range, perhaps slightly more at
higher speed.
>
>>InCD is a RW filesystem driver. If you don't RW, you don't
>>need to run it. It seems that far too many popular apps
>>theese days unnecessarily assume people want more background
>>tasks. You can always disable these from loading then try
>>the (needed) app/functionality.
>
>Thanks for the heads up. I haven't burnt a CD-RW in 8 years. They only
>work reliably on the machine you burn them on. CDs are so cheap it's
>not worth the hassle.
I'd imagine you can packet write DVDs too, though I've never
had occasion to do so- I still have stacks of new CDRs I'll
probably give to my nephew.
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 23:23:43 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>>Therein lies the rub. If I screw around I may make the unit
>>inoperable.
>Well this isn't exactly experimental, people do it and if
>it's known to work, by now there've been a ton of people
>that did it. That's the benefit of the web forum, to see
>confirmation that it works on your specific drive with
>(which) specific firmware.
You are overlooking two very real facts. 1) The people on those forums
make serious mistakes. I recall reading one guy who posted his latest
firmware hack and convinced everyone it was stable. A couple hours
later he was screeming not to use it, it would wreck the unit. 2) An
error could occur on my end, either operator error or machine error.
>Fair enough, but liteons aren't exactly trash either, once
>they have a modern firmware to aide in media
>detection/routines it should be able to burn at full speed
>on more media. Basically, Sony only flashes the old
>firmware. ANY newer firmware for same drive exists for a
>reason, either bug fixes or media compatibility. Providing
>you use the right firmware it's a win-win situation (so long
>as you confirm what works, the specific firmware and steps
>to flash it).
Where would I go to find such firmware? I don't even know what model
of LiteOn that my Sony has. My model is "Sony DVD RW DW-D18A".
>>Like right now. I am burning the second disc of a very good series
>>called Tilt, with Michael Madsen, and I am typing this reply at the
>>same time. Task Manager tray icon says I am not using but 5-8% of the
>>CPU total.
>? OK but I seem to be missing the point. Any drive using
>UDMA should be around that range, perhaps slightly more at
>higher speed.
My point is that because I can run the machine while burning, I really
do not care if I am burning at 4x.
On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 23:17:41 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>I dont recall if there's the option to not install, but one
>of the myriad Windows startup/boot monitoring utilities can
>easily enough keep it from loading.
I use "msconfig". I can also remove the Registry key.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 08:19:57 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>Where would I go to find such firmware? I don't even know what model
>of LiteOn that my Sony has. My model is "Sony DVD RW DW-D18A".
You flash at your own risk. Read the instructions very carefully for
any differences in models or software you need. Read the whole site
just in case theres some overall important info thats not just where
your model description is.
Ive flashed various drives to other drives that were popular with
people into cd and dvd burners and they all worked but Ive never done
this one. One thing I noticed I wasnt to flash my Maddog into a NEC
but most people say you cant so far . Maddog has changed the drives so
there is no sign of NEC on it anymore . In the past they had a NEC
sticker. And I havent seen any easy to flash it to a NEC. MADDOG
does give you firmware updates so I dont see any problem with it for
now. There are the NEC updates but people say dont use them on the
MADDOG drives.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 08:19:57 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 23:23:43 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>
>>>Therein lies the rub. If I screw around I may make the unit
>>>inoperable.
>
>>Well this isn't exactly experimental, people do it and if
>>it's known to work, by now there've been a ton of people
>>that did it. That's the benefit of the web forum, to see
>>confirmation that it works on your specific drive with
>>(which) specific firmware.
>
>You are overlooking two very real facts. 1) The people on those forums
>make serious mistakes. I recall reading one guy who posted his latest
>firmware hack and convinced everyone it was stable. A couple hours
>later he was screeming not to use it, it would wreck the unit. 2) An
>error could occur on my end, either operator error or machine error.
Not overlooking, the point of the forum was not to find some
"latest mod", it is to find known-good firmware that others
have used and report success with, to let someone else do
the alpha/beta testing then reap the benefits of their work.
It's true an operator error or machine error could occur,
though such is the case with *anything*, not just flashing a
drive's firmware. Maybe it's not worth the risk to you, but
becoming educated about it and practicing, you reduce that
risk. Possibly it is best if/when drive doesn't do what
you want of it, but I would want full burning speed if there
is a chance of gaining that *more often*.
>Where would I go to find such firmware? I don't even know what model
>of LiteOn that my Sony has. My model is "Sony DVD RW DW-D18A".
>
>>>Like right now. I am burning the second disc of a very good series
>>>called Tilt, with Michael Madsen, and I am typing this reply at the
>>>same time. Task Manager tray icon says I am not using but 5-8% of the
>>>CPU total.
>
>>? OK but I seem to be missing the point. Any drive using
>>UDMA should be around that range, perhaps slightly more at
>>higher speed.
>
>My point is that because I can run the machine while burning, I really
>do not care if I am burning at 4x.
Ok, don't flash it then. The web forums will likely point
out what gain there is as well, then you can decide for
yourself if the gain is important to your use.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 12:57:09 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 10:00:17 GMT, "John@Smith.com"
><xxxxspud@newscene.com> wrote:
>
>>>Where would I go to find such firmware? I don't even know what model
>>>of LiteOn that my Sony has. My model is "Sony DVD RW DW-D18A".
>
>>http://codeguys.rpc1.org/dvdrw_overview.html
>>http://dhc014.rpc1.org/indexOEM.htm#DW-D18A
>
>According to those websites, my burner is a LiteOn SOHW-832S OEM.
>
>The latest firmware listed is the same as what I have, VYS2 - Dated
>"Jun18 ,2004".
>
>Thanks for the info.
Are those recent "documents"? Liteon shows newer firmware.
One thing you could do is flash same firmware with the
Liteon branding, then from that point on you can treat the
drive as a Liteon and forget that it was ever a sony. IE-
the following firmware that is newer would flash to it the
same as if it where a Liteon to begin with, now or when even
newer firmware is released, http://www.liteonit.com/ODD/English/...odel=SHOW-832S
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 18:07:22 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>Not overlooking, the point of the forum was not to find some
>"latest mod", it is to find known-good firmware that others
>have used and report success with, to let someone else do
>the alpha/beta testing then reap the benefits of their work.
I thought those sites were hacker sites. My mistake.
I did learn that my current firmware is the latest for the drive,
which is reassuring in a way.
>It's true an operator error or machine error could occur,
>though such is the case with *anything*, not just flashing a
>drive's firmware. Maybe it's not worth the risk to you, but
>becoming educated about it and practicing, you reduce that
>risk.
I have done my share of flashing in my day, and I have also done my
share of resetting. I do not like the idea that one uncontrollable
glitch could completely destroy a piece of hardware. You would think
the manufacturer would have a better design - to allow a hardware
reset like on modems, routers, motherboards, etc.
>Possibly it is best if/when drive doesn't do what
>you want of it, but I would want full burning speed if there
>is a chance of gaining that *more often*.
If I want more speed, then I would get the 3540. But I do not want
more speed for now, so I am going to leave the firmware alone.
>>Where would I go to find such firmware? I don't even know what model
>>of LiteOn that my Sony has. My model is "Sony DVD RW DW-D18A".
I tried some variations of that and got garbage. I always use Google
first before anything else.
Sony told me to contact my vendor for support so I called Directron
where my son bought the drive over a year ago. The head of support
told me that the best they could offer is their forum on
<directron.net>. He said to ask for help in terms of newer firmware. I
did just that and set the preferences to email me when I get a hit. No
hits thus far but then it is a bit early.
>>My point is that because I can run the machine while burning, I really
>>do not care if I am burning at 4x.
>Ok, don't flash it then. The web forums will likely point
>out what gain there is as well, then you can decide for
>yourself if the gain is important to your use.
As I said, the web forums were helpful in telling me there is no newer
firmware. It is lightening fast on CDs though, which is something I do
once in a while.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 18:17:22 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>I did learn that my current firmware is the latest for the drive,
>which is reassuring in a way.
Assuming your drive is the liteon model you reported, the
firmware you reported is not the most recent, there are
several released since then. Ignore the automated file
download on the following link (for the time being, it may
be the correct firmware though) and see their list, http://www.liteonit.com/ODD/English/...odel=SHOW-832S
>
>>It's true an operator error or machine error could occur,
>>though such is the case with *anything*, not just flashing a
>>drive's firmware. Maybe it's not worth the risk to you, but
>>becoming educated about it and practicing, you reduce that
>>risk.
>
>I have done my share of flashing in my day, and I have also done my
>share of resetting. I do not like the idea that one uncontrollable
>glitch could completely destroy a piece of hardware. You would think
>the manufacturer would have a better design - to allow a hardware
>reset like on modems, routers, motherboards, etc.
Consider what a hardware reset does- it clears temporary
configuration settings and reloads the firmware defaults.
If your flashing went awry, where are these firmware
defaults coming from? It's similar situation to when one
had a glitch flashing a motherboard et al bios.
>Sony told me to contact my vendor for support so I called Directron
>where my son bought the drive over a year ago. The head of support
>told me that the best they could offer is their forum on
><directron.net>. He said to ask for help in terms of newer firmware. I
>did just that and set the preferences to email me when I get a hit. No
>hits thus far but then it is a bit early.
Yep, it's unusual for someone to go out of their way if/when
the data is already out there. DIrectron's forum is a good
way to get info on Directron-specific issues though when it
comes to mainstream hardware there's a larger user base and
more advanced scenarios detailed at hardware-specific
forums.
>
>>>My point is that because I can run the machine while burning, I really
>>>do not care if I am burning at 4x.
>
>>Ok, don't flash it then. The web forums will likely point
>>out what gain there is as well, then you can decide for
>>yourself if the gain is important to your use.
>
>As I said, the web forums were helpful in telling me there is no newer
>firmware. It is lightening fast on CDs though, which is something I do
>once in a while.
What often happens is that the firmware change is made by
everyone in the forum at that point in time. Then then need
no newer Sony-Liteon conversion because their drive is then
a "Liteon" from that point on. They don't need to consider
a newer conversion firmware because they can just flash
newer Liteon firmware normally... or flash that old liteon
firmware mod and THEN flash the newer one.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 18:12:10 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>Are those recent "documents"?
Beats me - I just went to the links provided.
>Liteon shows newer firmware.
>One thing you could do is flash same firmware with the
>Liteon branding, then from that point on you can treat the
>drive as a Liteon and forget that it was ever a sony. IE-
>the following firmware that is newer would flash to it the
>same as if it where a Liteon to begin with, now or when even
>newer firmware is released,
>http://www.liteonit.com/ODD/English/...odel=SHOW-832S
I can't see any reason to flash the unit with newer firmware. As they
say on the site:
"It's not necessary to upgrade the firmware of your opto-drive unless
you meet problem."
I am not having a problem other than trying to burn crappy discs at
8x. If I use FujiFilm 8x discs I have no problems. It's those
MemorWreck 8x that my son got ar Worst Buy for 10 cents that I have to
burn at 4x. But as I said, I don't mind since burning at 4x only takes
15 minutes at most and it's a background process. I always run the
Verify that is available on DVD Decrypter and so far I have not gotten
one coaster.
But I will keep that website in mind in case something happens. I
notice that LiteOn has the following proviso:
"Customers, please be aware, that LiteON IT will no longer provide
services to the products that have been " Illegally Firmware Upgraded,
such as flashing to other models' firmware."
These pricks don't want to support their hardware either.
My son and I learned our lesson - stay completely away from anything
with the Sony name on it. We also learned something that I knew for
decades - ask around before you buy. But he was impetuous to get that
drive back then so I did not object. Now, after surveying the users on
these forums, I talked him into that NEC 3540 which means he has the
best drive you can get for any price.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 19:16:29 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>>I did learn that my current firmware is the latest for the drive,
>>which is reassuring in a way.
>Assuming your drive is the liteon model you reported,
I assume that although I got it only from one reference.
>the firmware you reported is not the most recent, there are
>several released since then. Ignore the automated file
>download on the following link (for the time being, it may
>be the correct firmware though) and see their list,
>http://www.liteonit.com/ODD/English/...odel=SHOW-832S
I read your earlier post and replied to it.
>Consider what a hardware reset does- it clears temporary
>configuration settings and reloads the firmware defaults.
>If your flashing went awry, where are these firmware
>defaults coming from?
Non-vol ram like in modems, etc. The factory defaults are kept in
EEPROM or equiv.
>It's similar situation to when one
>had a glitch flashing a motherboard et al bios.
But motherboard BIOS can be restored by removing the battery for a
while.
>What often happens is that the firmware change is made by
>everyone in the forum at that point in time. Then then need
>no newer Sony-Liteon conversion because their drive is then
>a "Liteon" from that point on. They don't need to consider
>a newer conversion firmware because they can just flash
>newer Liteon firmware normally... or flash that old liteon
>firmware mod and THEN flash the newer one.
When I get a 3540 for myself one day (I will likely inherit my son's
when he upgrades), I will not be as cautious about fooling with
firmware upgrades because NEC has such a large user base. I just don't
have the same confidence in attempting to flash a Sony into a LiteOn,
especially when I don't have a strong enough reason to do it.
When I get the 3540 from my son, I will give the Sony to my daughter.
I would rather give her a working retail unit than something I have
buggered.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:10:31 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>But I will keep that website in mind in case something happens. I
>notice that LiteOn has the following proviso:
>
>"Customers, please be aware, that LiteON IT will no longer provide
>services to the products that have been " Illegally Firmware Upgraded,
>such as flashing to other models' firmware."
>
>These pricks don't want to support their hardware either.
Put yourself in their place. If you had sold hardware and
someone forked it up by replacing the known good firmware
with (who knows what), would you feel obligated to pay for
their mistake?
Even so, this is more of a logistics situation rather than a
technical one since it is in fact a liteon drive and the
proposed "mod" is to use genuine liteon firmware.
>
>My son and I learned our lesson - stay completely away from anything
>with the Sony name on it.
Well, their support is poor but they certainly could've
chosen worse (cheaper) brands to relabel like BTC or BenQ.
Can't knock them for using Liteon, only that they need put
more into support. Actually it would've been nice if they'd
simply used liteon firmware and just linked to the liteon
firmware page on their website.
>We also learned something that I knew for
>decades - ask around before you buy. But he was impetuous to get that
>drive back then so I did not object. Now, after surveying the users on
>these forums, I talked him into that NEC 3540 which means he has the
>best drive you can get for any price.
Yes they're good drives. Come to think of it I still have a
few Sony CDRW drives that I actually like MORE than the
same-thing in the liteon version because the Sonys had a
sculpted bezel. It's a rather trivial difference but after
a few years you get tired of building generic-clone-looking
boxes and it's nice to have complimentary lines and colors
on a box. IMO, there's part of why people like Dells,
they'd be less popular if the boxes had been bland beige
boxes. Inside the typical low-end Dell, they're pretty much
identical to a Compaq or HP so far as the case goes. In
fact they're so similar it looks a lot like they used same
case manufacturer sometimes.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:16:54 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>>Consider what a hardware reset does- it clears temporary
>>configuration settings and reloads the firmware defaults.
>>If your flashing went awry, where are these firmware
>>defaults coming from?
>
>Non-vol ram like in modems, etc. The factory defaults are kept in
>EEPROM or equiv.
So they are in a CDRW/DVD/etc too. One could similarly
damage a modem by (improperly) flashing it or failing at the
flash attempt.
>
>>It's similar situation to when one
>>had a glitch flashing a motherboard et al bios.
>
>But motherboard BIOS can be restored by removing the battery for a
>while.
Different situation. Removing the battery simply clears the
volatile memory. It still has the correct bios in the
EPROM, a firmware. Likewise, the DVD drive would have the
correct firmware in the EPROM. The major difference between
the two is that the DVD drive has no volatile memory that
needs battery backup, they both have the EPROM that has to
have correct/viable bios stored intact. Rmoving battery or
jumper on a motherboard does nothing to that EPROM firmware
(bios).
>
>>What often happens is that the firmware change is made by
>>everyone in the forum at that point in time. Then then need
>>no newer Sony-Liteon conversion because their drive is then
>>a "Liteon" from that point on. They don't need to consider
>>a newer conversion firmware because they can just flash
>>newer Liteon firmware normally... or flash that old liteon
>>firmware mod and THEN flash the newer one.
>
>When I get a 3540 for myself one day (I will likely inherit my son's
>when he upgrades), I will not be as cautious about fooling with
>firmware upgrades because NEC has such a large user base. I just don't
>have the same confidence in attempting to flash a Sony into a LiteOn,
>especially when I don't have a strong enough reason to do it.
>
>When I get the 3540 from my son, I will give the Sony to my daughter.
>I would rather give her a working retail unit than something I have
>buggered.
I still can't see what kind of distinction you're trying to
make here. There is nothing at all negative about having a
newer Liteon firmware over an old Sony firmware, except if
the Sony-bundled software (is to be used and ...) requires a
"Sony" identification to be valid/licensed (to run). This
is in fact the case with some bundled versions of Nero, but
at some point Sony was bundling something else, a less
common software the name of which escapes me at the moment.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 21:54:00 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>Well, their support is poor
That's an understatement - there is NO support. Zilch, Zip, Nada. They
hide behind *their* redefinition of "OEM". To Sony, "OEM" means it is
made by another manufacturer and therefore Sony is not responsible for
supporting it even though it was branded as a Sony unit.
You would have to be a complete fool to do business with crooks like
that.
>but they certainly could've
>chosen worse (cheaper) brands to relabel like BTC or BenQ.
I think someone said that BenQ is made by Acer.
>Can't knock them for using Liteon, only that they need put
>more into support. Actually it would've been nice if they'd
>simply used liteon firmware and just linked to the liteon
>firmware page on their website.
That's something that concerns me. Is it really LiteOn firmware inside
now? Or did Sony bugger it so that it has lost its LiteOn identity? If
so, flashing with LiteOn firmware is likely to cause it to
malfunction.
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:10:31 GMT, spam@uce.gov (Bob) wrote:
>"Customers, please be aware, that LiteON IT will no longer provide
>services to the products that have been " Illegally Firmware Upgraded,
>such as flashing to other models' firmware."
>
>These pricks don't want to support their hardware either.
>
>My son and I learned our lesson - stay completely away from anything
>with the Sony name on it. We also learned something that I knew for
>decades - ask around before you buy. But he was impetuous to get that
>drive back then so I did not object. Now, after surveying the users on
>these forums, I talked him into that NEC 3540 which means he has the
>best drive you can get for any price.
Nobody wants you to mess around with firmware thats not official.
Thats just the way it is. People have been messing around with it for
ages. And its pretty common for them not to support OEM products.
Also no support for bad flashes except that they might replace or
repair it through warranty. People used to be really reckless and
flash Liteons up to better models when the hardware permitted it
with CDRWs. I did that several times. Now thats hairy. Right now
theres all kinds of firmware thats hacked going around too. You cant
expect them to support that .
Anyway you arent going to get much detailed support for these
especially old models which theyve long since forgotten. They probably
make pennies of profit on most of these things buying from China and
then reselling at a sometimes even negative price since the
competition is so brutal and they get undersold by others so quickly.
I remember reading in the WSJ in the late 90s they mentioned a scanner
company that was buying them from Taiwan , which ended up selling them
at a loss cause the mkt had declined so fast on them all they wanted
to do is get rid of inventory I know the feeling as I tried to buy
some clone 3dFX cards if you remember them, directly from Taiwan
after seeing a Canadian company doing it and seemingly make decent
money from it . The prices would change from fat profit margin to
miniscule all the way to minus in no time. It was scary. I quit after
two batches. The best way would be to have it drop shipped with real
time inventory systems connected to the big suppliers/distributors so
that you dont have to risk all that.
Thats why I would only buy the popular burners and stick with them
cause those are the ones which will get a lot of firmware upgrades and
youll get a lot of feedback from users on media etc. However even
those -- if its old , the firmware upgrades and feedback will
disappear. Nobody cares about old stuff. That said my old NEC --- it
burned everything I threw at it. My new NEC --- burns everything so
far too.
Upgrading to DVD writer 
Linear Mode
