When I was home for the Easter weekend, I set up a wireless network
for my parents. I tested everything before I left and it all seemed
to be fine.
A couple of days after I left, my Mum couldn't connect to the network
anymore. After talking her through a few things, I discovered that
she was getting assigned some really random IP address (something like
169.255.etc) instead of what the network was set up on (standard
192.168.etc). I got her to change the settings to choose a manual
address which was OK for a day or so, then she had issues as it
claimed there was a conflict of addresses (she had good signal
strength, but limited or no connectivity because of this issue). I'm
hesitant to get her to try another manual address because I only set
up a limited range of trusted IP addresses for her firewall, and she
will find it too hard to add more (can't talk her through it as I've
only seen her firewall software twice, so I can't remember where
everything was).
This seems really random to me, and I'm not sure why the address she
is getting assigned isn't correct - their network is the only one
listed in the network list to automatically connect to.
Any thoughts?
> When I was home for the Easter weekend, I set up a wireless network
> for my parents. I tested everything before I left and it all seemed
> to be fine.
> A couple of days after I left, my Mum couldn't connect to the network
> anymore. After talking her through a few things, I discovered that
> she was getting assigned some really random IP address (something like
> 169.255.etc) instead of what the network was set up on (standard
> 192.168.etc). I got her to change the settings to choose a manual
> address which was OK for a day or so, then she had issues as it
> claimed there was a conflict of addresses (she had good signal
> strength, but limited or no connectivity because of this issue). I'm
> hesitant to get her to try another manual address because I only set
> up a limited range of trusted IP addresses for her firewall, and she
> will find it too hard to add more (can't talk her through it as I've
> only seen her firewall software twice, so I can't remember where
> everything was).
> This seems really random to me, and I'm not sure why the address she
> is getting assigned isn't correct - their network is the only one
> listed in the network list to automatically connect to.
> Any thoughts?
Windows will drop in a 169.254.0.0-169.254.255.255 address as an
autoconfig address. It uses these if it cannot get a response out of
a DHCP server.
I'd instruct her to power cycle the wireless access point and hope for
the best.
"WiLLerZ" <willerz69@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1176699367.348311.101950@q75g2000hsh.googlegr oups.com...
> When I was home for the Easter weekend, I set up a wireless network
> for my parents. I tested everything before I left and it all seemed
> to be fine.
> A couple of days after I left, my Mum couldn't connect to the network
> anymore. After talking her through a few things, I discovered that
> she was getting assigned some really random IP address (something like
> 169.255.etc) instead of what the network was set up on (standard
> 192.168.etc)....
Restore the Windows operating system to a point when you know it was
working. I run into this 169.x.x.x thing all of the time. You'd think at
Microsoft they could design a pop-up message that wasn't cryptic nonsense,
but if they did that, they wouldn't be Microsoft.
There are a few things you can try to rebuild to reset the protocol stack,
but they rarely work in fixing this problem, in my experience. If the
restore point doesn't work I almost always have to run a "repair install"
with XP. The downside to that is you will spend a few hours or more as the
system re-downloads the numerous bug fixes, patches, and upgrades after the
re-install.
Another thing that works about 80% of the time is to use a new, different
card.
Again, if you search the Microsoft (lack of) Knowledge Base, you will find
instructions for running a command line program to reset the protocol stack.
Give that a try first. This is the URL that gets bandied about the most:
All good advice from my experience too, though a "repair install" of
XP seems drastic.
Yep, getting that 169.255... address means it's broken, but they are
not admitting it; The router is not giving one out or the client
software is tweaked. The stack, or whatever.
Reboot router. Reboot pc, try again. Might just do it.
Toggle from windows zero config to the manufacturer's client software
and reboot. Do that a couple of times...
Run that MS stack fix Maxwell linked to.
Try a different wireless adapter. Sometimes using another adapter
fixes it for the broken one too.
Uninstall and reinstall the current adapter.
Have you mom turn in a circle three times and say the secret words.
Three days later it will magically work again.
On 16 Apr 2007 22:18:57 -0700, seaweedsteve <seaweedsteve@gmail.com>
wrote in <1176787137.536212.242900@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups. com>:
>All good advice from my experience too, though a "repair install" of
>XP seems drastic.
Agreed. Recommend against it.
>Yep, getting that 169.255... address means it's broken, but they are
>not admitting it; The router is not giving one out or the client
>software is tweaked. The stack, or whatever.
Probably a problem with the wireless router.
>Reboot router. Reboot pc, try again. Might just do it.
Likely to solve the problem. Usually the best course of action.
>Toggle from windows zero config to the manufacturer's client software
>and reboot. Do that a couple of times...
>
>Run that MS stack fix Maxwell linked to.
>
>Try a different wireless adapter. Sometimes using another adapter
>fixes it for the broken one too.
>
>Uninstall and reinstall the current adapter.
>
>Have you mom turn in a circle three times and say the secret words.
>Three days later it will magically work again.
Probably not a wireless client or stack problem.
Make sure the wireless router has the latest firmware. If that doesn't
help, replace the wireless router with a different better unit (e.g.,
Buffalo high-power).
--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>
On 16 Apr 2007 00:04:06 -0500, comphelp@toddh.net (Todd H.) wrote in
<844pnggbax.fsf@ripco.com>:
>"WiLLerZ" <willerz69@hotmail.com> writes:
>
>> When I was home for the Easter weekend, I set up a wireless network
>> for my parents. I tested everything before I left and it all seemed
>> to be fine.
>> A couple of days after I left, my Mum couldn't connect to the network
>> anymore. After talking her through a few things, I discovered that
>> she was getting assigned some really random IP address (something like
>> 169.255.etc) instead of what the network was set up on (standard
>> 192.168.etc). I got her to change the settings to choose a manual
>> address which was OK for a day or so, then she had issues as it
>> claimed there was a conflict of addresses (she had good signal
>> strength, but limited or no connectivity because of this issue). I'm
>> hesitant to get her to try another manual address because I only set
>> up a limited range of trusted IP addresses for her firewall, and she
>> will find it too hard to add more (can't talk her through it as I've
>> only seen her firewall software twice, so I can't remember where
>> everything was).
>> This seems really random to me, and I'm not sure why the address she
>> is getting assigned isn't correct - their network is the only one
>> listed in the network list to automatically connect to.
>> Any thoughts?
>
>Windows will drop in a 169.254.0.0-169.254.255.255 address as an
>autoconfig address. It uses these if it cannot get a response out of
>a DHCP server.
>
>I'd instruct her to power cycle the wireless access point and hope for
>the best.
Yep. And if that helps, replace the wireless router/access point with a
different brand and model (e.g., Buffalo high-power).
--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>
>
> Yep. And if that helps, replace the wireless router/access point with a
> different brand and model (e.g., Buffalo high-power).
>
I am pleased with our Buffalo (running DD-WRT firmware), BUT I have
also had this happen at least once with the Buffalo.
It was a Belkin pcmcia adapter that, after working for months,
suddenly could not get a lease anymore. Assigning an IP address did
not help. No ping to the router. Rebooting the router did not help.
Then, installing the same adapter on a different pc at the same
location, it worked ! Reinstalling a different version of the adapter
driver on the problem pc seemed to be what fixed it.
Perhaps it's better to say that this was the time that rebooting did
not help. There have been other times/problems when rebooting did the
trick. This time I attributed the problem to the laptop going in and
out of standby frequently during a lease, sometimes very roughly,
while downloading. If I remember correctly. Something about that
adapter on that pc with that driver installation got skewed, or looked
wrong to the router.
Since you got your mom's to work again briefly with an assigned
address, then it broke again, you might ask your mom about how they
manage shutdown/standy/hibernate for their pcs. Question what they
are they doing in that dimension and maybe change it to hard
shutdowns?
Perhaps, just as John says, it is an indication that her router's
firmware is not working right...
Oh, one more thing, since you are not present to solve problems, you
might want to make sure there is an ethernet cable alternative as a
backup when the wireless fails. Even if they have to temporarily run
the cable through the hallway or something, at least they can get
online.
"John Navas" <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote in message
news:ihl923lrt9ks5737gm446lvaprj32mbkrd@4ax.com...
> On 16 Apr 2007 22:18:57 -0700, seaweedsteve <seaweedsteve@gmail.com>
> wrote in <1176787137.536212.242900@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups. com>:
>
>>All good advice from my experience too, though a "repair install" of
>>XP seems drastic.
>
> Agreed. Recommend against it.
The 169.x.x.x thing is not always easily solved. If the other remedies
described don't work, I know from experience the repair install will work
most of the time. It is nowhere near as drastic as restamping the machine.
>>Yep, getting that 169.255... address means it's broken, but they are
>>not admitting it; The router is not giving one out or the client
>>software is tweaked. The stack, or whatever.
>
> Probably a problem with the wireless router.
No, not probably. In fact, almost never.
>>Reboot router. Reboot pc, try again. Might just do it.
>
> Likely to solve the problem. Usually the best course of action.
No, not likely. I've run into the 169.x.x.x issue hundreds of times. That
169.x.x.x address is Microsoft's cryptic way of saying, "You're fucked."
> Probably not a wireless client or stack problem.
>
> Make sure the wireless router has the latest firmware. If that doesn't
> help, replace the wireless router with a different better unit (e.g.,
> Buffalo high-power).
No, no, no! It almost always is a wireless client problem -- a desktop
problem. Again, I've fixed this problem many times by simply restoring the
system to a check point when the system was known to have functioned
properly.
On Tue, 17 Apr 2007 13:09:04 -0400, "Maxwell Edison"
<majoringin@medicine.com> wrote in
<4624ff8e$0$1418$4c368faf@roadrunner.com>:
>"John Navas" <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote in message
>news:ihl923lrt9ks5737gm446lvaprj32mbkrd@4ax.com.. .
>> On 16 Apr 2007 22:18:57 -0700, seaweedsteve <seaweedsteve@gmail.com>
>> wrote in <1176787137.536212.242900@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups. com>:
>>
>>>All good advice from my experience too, though a "repair install" of
>>>XP seems drastic.
>>
>> Agreed. Recommend against it.
>
>The 169.x.x.x thing is not always easily solved. If the other remedies
>described don't work, I know from experience the repair install will work
>most of the time. It is nowhere near as drastic as restamping the machine.
My own experience is that Repair Install is massive overkill that
usually has nothing to do with the real problem, which is usually a
problem (firmware, settings) with the wireless router.
>>>Yep, getting that 169.255... address means it's broken, but they are
>>>not admitting it; The router is not giving one out or the client
>>>software is tweaked. The stack, or whatever.
>>
>> Probably a problem with the wireless router.
>
>No, not probably. In fact, almost never.
My experience is just the opposite of yours.
>>>Reboot router. Reboot pc, try again. Might just do it.
>>
>> Likely to solve the problem. Usually the best course of action.
>
>No, not likely.
Again, my experience is just the opposite of yours.
>I've run into the 169.x.x.x issue hundreds of times.
Likewise.
>That
>169.x.x.x address is Microsoft's cryptic way of saying, "You're fucked."
It's actually Microsoft's way of making a LAN workable with DHCP
configured but no DHCP available.
>> Probably not a wireless client or stack problem.
>>
>> Make sure the wireless router has the latest firmware. If that doesn't
>> help, replace the wireless router with a different better unit (e.g.,
>> Buffalo high-power).
>
>No, no, no!
Yes, yes, yes.
>It almost always is a wireless client problem -- a desktop
>problem.
That's not my experience.
>Again, I've fixed this problem many times by simply restoring the
>system to a check point when the system was known to have functioned
>properly.
I've fixed this problem many times with the advice I posted. In my
experience, System Restore rarely does any good, and can result in other
problems.
--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>
On Apr 18, 12:42 am, seaweedsteve <seaweedst...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Yep. And if that helps, replace the wireless router/access point with a
> > different brand and model (e.g., Buffalo high-power).
>
> I am pleased with our Buffalo (running DD-WRT firmware), BUT I have
> also had this happen at least once with the Buffalo.
>
> It was a Belkin pcmcia adapter that, after working for months,
> suddenly could not get a lease anymore. Assigning an IP address did
> not help. No ping to the router. Rebooting the router did not help.
> Then, installing the same adapter on a different pc at the same
> location, it worked ! Reinstalling a different version of the adapter
> driver on the problem pc seemed to be what fixed it.
>
> Perhaps it's better to say that this was the time that rebooting did
> not help. There have been other times/problems when rebooting did the
> trick. This time I attributed the problem to the laptop going in and
> out of standby frequently during a lease, sometimes very roughly,
> while downloading. If I remember correctly. Something about that
> adapter on that pc with that driver installation got skewed, or looked
> wrong to the router.
>
> Since you got your mom's to work again briefly with an assigned
> address, then it broke again, you might ask your mom about how they
> manage shutdown/standy/hibernate for their pcs. Question what they
> are they doing in that dimension and maybe change it to hard
> shutdowns?
>
> Perhaps, just as John says, it is an indication that her router's
> firmware is not working right...
>
> Oh, one more thing, since you are not present to solve problems, you
> might want to make sure there is an ethernet cable alternative as a
> backup when the wireless fails. Even if they have to temporarily run
> the cable through the hallway or something, at least they can get
> online.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
Yep, I've got her using an ethernet cable as a temporary solution
which works fine. I guess I'd be a little surprised if it was a
router problem given that my Dad's laptop connects without any
problems. My gut feel is that it is something to do with her laptop -
whether it's a problem with the installation of the adapter or some
other conflict or whatever. I will get her to check the standby issue
stuff - I hadn't even considered that as a potential cause. I've got
her to reboot everything to see if that worked, but she's had no joy
with that. It's just all very irritating because I tested it before I
left and it was working fine, so I know that it CAN work. I've got to
the point where I've suggested she get someone to come out and have a
look at it (much cheaper than flying me back for a weekend when I
certainly can't promise that I can do anything that she hasn't!).
She mentioned last night that her laptop didn't even detect that our
network was within range (usually it detects it, but can't assign an
address for whatever reason). I find this very weird since at the
moment, her laptop is within a metre or so of the router! I know this
is stupid, but could there be any issues from being TOO close?! Or
maybe having some other sort of equipment around that might be
interfering with the signal and creating too much noise. I know I'm
reaching here...
Anyway, thanks for all your suggestions guys. I know wireless
networks can be a bit funny at the best of times, but will keep
plugging away.
>
> Yep, I've got her using an ethernet cable as a temporary solution
> which works fine. I guess I'd be a little surprised if it was a
> router problem given that my Dad's laptop connects without any
> problems.
Still, have them unplug the router and replug it. It's too easy to
do.
What IS the router, by the way? Linksys WRT54G v6? Netgear XXX or
what?
>My gut feel is that it is something to do with her laptop -
> whether it's a problem with the installation of the adapter or some
> other conflict or whatever.
Right. After trying the powercycle on the router, I would then be
uninstalling the adapter's driver and reinstalling. Knee-jerk
reaction perhaps, but...
Also, as I said, Toggling between windows zero config and the
adapter's client manager. Sometimes these things get crossed and
nobody has proper control.
> I will get her to check the standby issue
> stuff - I hadn't even considered that as a potential cause. I've got
> her to reboot everything to see if that worked, but she's had no joy
> with that.
IF this theory is true, I think that once it's screwed up, then
rebooting the pc doesn't necessarily fix it. It's more of an idea for
preventing reoccurances. I could be totally off-base on this.
Also, have you tried another adapter yet? I know, not easy to install
at a distance.....
> I've got to
> the point where I've suggested she get someone to come out and have a
> look at it (much cheaper than flying me back for a weekend when I
> certainly can't promise that I can do anything that she hasn't!).
You can, but yes, I suppose I'd let them call Geek Squad or whomever.
They may make a mess of things and sell her more products, but it will
probably work until you come through again.
> She mentioned last night that her laptop didn't even detect that our
> network was within range (usually it detects it, but can't assign an
> address for whatever reason). I find this very weird since at the
> moment, her laptop is within a metre or so of the router! I know this
> is stupid, but could there be any issues from being TOO close?! Or
> maybe having some other sort of equipment around that might be
> interfering with the signal and creating too much noise. I know I'm
> reaching here...
That's a possibility. Maybe somebody else who has experience with
interference could address that.
> Anyway, thanks for all your suggestions guys. I know wireless
> networks can be a bit funny at the best of times, but will keep
> plugging away
Worst case#1: Stays on Ethernet (assuming that the cables are a mess)
Worst case #2: Geek squad sets her up with a usb adapter for now.
On Apr 18, 10:58 pm, seaweedsteve <seaweedst...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Yep, I've got her using an ethernet cable as a temporary solution
> > which works fine. I guess I'd be a little surprised if it was a
> > router problem given that my Dad's laptop connects without any
> > problems.
>
> Still, have them unplug the router and replug it. It's too easy to
> do.
> What IS the router, by the way? Linksys WRT54G v6? Netgear XXX or
> what?
It's a Belkin Wireless G Plus Mimo router.
>
> >My gut feel is that it is something to do with her laptop -
> > whether it's a problem with the installation of the adapter or some
> > other conflict or whatever.
>
> Right. After trying the powercycle on the router, I would then be
> uninstalling the adapter's driver and reinstalling. Knee-jerk
> reaction perhaps, but...
There's no way I could get my Mum to do that. She's scared enough
when I get her to go into Command and get the current IP
configuration! She does OK, but not THAT well! :-)
>
> Also, as I said, Toggling between windows zero config and the
> adapter's client manager. Sometimes these things get crossed and
> nobody has proper control.
This is out of my league - haven't really had much experience with
networking, so not really sure what you mean.
>
> > I will get her to check the standby issue
> > stuff - I hadn't even considered that as a potential cause. I've got
> > her to reboot everything to see if that worked, but she's had no joy
> > with that.
>
> IF this theory is true, I think that once it's screwed up, then
> rebooting the pc doesn't necessarily fix it. It's more of an idea for
> preventing reoccurances. I could be totally off-base on this.
>
> Also, have you tried another adapter yet? I know, not easy to install
> at a distance.....
>
> > I've got to
> > the point where I've suggested she get someone to come out and have a
> > look at it (much cheaper than flying me back for a weekend when I
> > certainly can't promise that I can do anything that she hasn't!).
>
> You can, but yes, I suppose I'd let them call Geek Squad or whomever.
> They may make a mess of things and sell her more products, but it will
> probably work until you come through again.
>
> > She mentioned last night that her laptop didn't even detect that our
> > network was within range (usually it detects it, but can't assign an
> > address for whatever reason). I find this very weird since at the
> > moment, her laptop is within a metre or so of the router! I know this
> > is stupid, but could there be any issues from being TOO close?! Or
> > maybe having some other sort of equipment around that might be
> > interfering with the signal and creating too much noise. I know I'm
> > reaching here...
>
> That's a possibility. Maybe somebody else who has experience with
> interference could address that.
>
> > Anyway, thanks for all your suggestions guys. I know wireless
> > networks can be a bit funny at the best of times, but will keep
> > plugging away
>
> Worst case#1: Stays on Ethernet (assuming that the cables are a mess)
> Worst case #2: Geek squad sets her up with a usb adapter for now.
She's happy enough to use cables for now - it's not a big deal, but
there are a couple of things that make it annoying for her.
>
> Steve
It could just be a bad configuration in the card manager. We still haven't
figured it out, but I helped a friend get an old dead laptop working. I could
connect to her AP with no problem, she on the other hand kept getting the MS
default address. I rebooted my machine a few times to make sure I could still
connect - no problems. Her AP was set to give out 100 DHCP addresses, so it
wasn't out of addresses. She could still connect to open systems, even hers
when we turned off WEP. I didn't have time to trouble shoot her card manager,
but that is a HBH (Huge Black Hole). Moral - get someone else to connect his
system to your AP to confirm that it is working. Start from scratch, one easy
step at a time.
Weird IP address picked using DHCP 
Linear Mode
