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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2007, 06:40 PM
Peter B. Steiger
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Posts: n/a
Default What do I need for barebones WLAN?

"Don't string up another cable in the house," my wife informed me last
night, "just set up a wireless server for me instead."

It took me five years to get from FORMAT C: to knowing how to operate a
Linux server with IP masquerading and the like, and now she wants me to
become a wireless expert overnight. Where do I start???

I read Hugo Haas' wireless home LAN howto, which is mostly laptop-centric
and doesn't explain what equipment you need for a desktop server; I read
Jean Tourrilhes' extensive treatise on the history and theory of
everything related to wireless networking; I even read some 847 page tome
with brilliant illustrations of phase modulation and how my microwave
oven affects the signal. Now I'm even more clueless than when I started!

Here's what I'm trying to accomplish: I have a perfectly good ethernet
LAN right now, with a Linux server I compulsively keep up to date acting
as firewall, router, and gaming console; I have a cheap 8-port switch to
send those little electrons scurrying across the living room rug to the
other computers in the house. All I want to add is something that will
send those same electrons scurrying through the air instead of on wires,
using the same DNS, NAT, and whatever other acronyms I can throw in that
are already in use on the desktop server.

Do I need a separate WAP device? Is there a wireless equivalent of this
little 8-port network switch? My wife says she saw something like that
at Wal-Mart, but she has no idea what it does or how to use it.

Some stuff I read makes it sound like I can just plug a wireless NIC
(with built-in antenna) into the host and the NIC will act as its own
WAP. That sounds like the best (read: cheapest) solution, but I don't
want to blow fifty bucks (or 200!) on something that won't do the job. I
also need to be sure that whatever I buy has working drivers in the Linux
kernel, and I haven't been able to find a comprehensive list of Linux-
friendly, PCI-based wireless cards that aren't PCMCIA.

Any idle speculation, personal experiences, pointers to a FAQ that I
missed, or general ridicule gratefully accepted.

--
Peter B. Steiger
Cheyenne, WY
If you must reply by email, you can reach me by placing zeroes
where you see stars: wypbs_**2 at steigerfamily.com.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2007, 08:14 PM
Todd H.
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: What do I need for barebones WLAN?

"Peter B. Steiger" <see.sig@for.email.address> writes:

> "Don't string up another cable in the house," my wife informed me last
> night, "just set up a wireless server for me instead."
>
> It took me five years to get from FORMAT C: to knowing how to operate a
> Linux server with IP masquerading and the like, and now she wants me to
> become a wireless expert overnight. Where do I start???


You could add a WLAN card to your linux box and run your own access
point. But that takes time and research, gotta be picky about
drivers, and if/when your hard disk dies on that box, boy yer screwed.

I say, just buy a Linksys WRT54GL. It's a wireless router which has a
wan port, a 4port LAN switch, and in between it has a wireless access
point, SPI firewall, DHCP server, and web-based configuration
accessible at http://192.168.1.1 from the LAN side. There are two
ways to use it in your setup: either
1) Plug its WAN port into your 8 port switch. Plug anything
with dhcpdc and a webbrowser into one of the lan ports and
configure it. Read the simple instruction manual. You'll
be done inside the hour unless your house is RF hell.
You'll want to use WPA-PSK encryption, and be a good boy
and use a 20charter or better very random passphrase in
there and you should be in good shape. WPA-PSK is just
preshared key encryption. Any WPA support machine such as
winXP or any modern linux will prompt you for a WPA
passphrase when you try to join the network. quite
straightforward
or
2) plus the WRT54GL's WAN port into your broadband connection,
replacing your linux server for firewall duties, hang your
8port hub off one of the 4 LAN ports on the WRT54GL, and
the WRT54GL will be your new firewall/dhcpserver/nat box.
Sam configuration tips apply for WPA-PSK above.

FYI, the WRT54GL doles out of 192.168.1.x addresses via DHCP on its
LAN. If you use this same subnet behind your linux box currently, and
you opt for scenario 1 above, you'll need to reconfig the WRT54GL to
use a different subnet for its LAN to avoid IP address conflicts. In
scenario 2, it's less of an issue assuming all your clients are dhcp.
If they're static, you'll of course need to eithe re-IP them or change
teh linksys's local network range to match.

> Do I need a separate WAP device? Is there a wireless equivalent of
> this little 8-port network switch? My wife says she saw something
> like that at Wal-Mart, but she has no idea what it does or how to
> use it.


That would be a simple wireless access point, which you'd just plu
into your 8 port switch, and yeah they do exist and they aren't
difficult to deal with either.

These things don't care about your operating system generally. They
tend to be configurable from anything that accepts a DHCP address and
has a web browser.

Now, if you wanna have linux fun with these devices later after you're
up and running,look into the fun of running third party open source
firmware on them. Linux on a $60 appliance is kewl. dd-wrt.com is a
popular one and hte WRTG54L supports all its flavors. Buffalo WHR
G54s is cheaper if that's important to ya. openwrt is another popular
3rd party firmware.

Best Regards,
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 04-05-2007, 03:06 AM
Peter B. Steiger
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: What do I need for barebones WLAN?

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 15:14:39 -0500, Todd H. sez:

> I say, just buy a Linksys WRT54GL. It's a wireless router which has a
> wan port, a 4port LAN switch, and in between it has a wireless access
> point, SPI firewall, DHCP server, and web-based configuration accessible
> at http://192.168.1.1 from the LAN side.


Excellent! This is probably a stupid question that will answer itself
when I get this router and plug it into the hub, but... how do I tell the
firewall (which currently allows only 192.168.xxx.0/24 connections on the
in-house ethernet line) to allow, for example, my wife's laptop on
192.168.1.xyz but not Nosy Neighbor who piggybacks on my signal and
acquires 192.168.1.abc from the router's DHCP? As often as I have
borrowed an unsecure signal when travelling I would be a hypocrite not to
share bandwidth, but I don't want the files on my hard drive to go beyond
my family.

--
Peter B. Steiger
Cheyenne, WY
If you must reply by email, you can reach me by placing zeroes
where you see stars: wypbs_**2 at steigerfamily.com.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 04-05-2007, 04:08 AM
Todd H.
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: What do I need for barebones WLAN?

"Peter B. Steiger" <see.sig@for.email.address> writes:

> On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 15:14:39 -0500, Todd H. sez:
>
> > I say, just buy a Linksys WRT54GL. It's a wireless router which has a
> > wan port, a 4port LAN switch, and in between it has a wireless access
> > point, SPI firewall, DHCP server, and web-based configuration accessible
> > at http://192.168.1.1 from the LAN side.

>
> Excellent! This is probably a stupid question that will answer itself
> when I get this router and plug it into the hub, but... how do I tell the
> firewall (which currently allows only 192.168.xxx.0/24 connections on the
> in-house ethernet line) to allow, for example, my wife's laptop on
> 192.168.1.xyz but not Nosy Neighbor who piggybacks on my signal and
> acquires 192.168.1.abc from the router's DHCP?


Nosy Neighbor will not be allowed to associate with your wireless
access point if he doesn't know the WPA pre-shared key value that
you'll dutifully configure when you setup your router.

WPA with a strong pre-shared key secures your wireless connection.
Folks running wide open access points are those too lazy or ignorant
to have configured WPA.

Best REgards,
--
Todd H.
http://www.toddh.net/

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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04-05-2007, 01:16 PM
barry@sme-online.com
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: What do I need for barebones WLAN?

On Apr 4, 2:40 pm, "Peter B. Steiger" <see....@for.email.address>
wrote:
> "Don't string up another cable in the house," my wife informed me last
> night, "just set up a wireless server for me instead."
>
> It took me five years to get from FORMAT C: to knowing how to operate a
> Linux server with IP masquerading and the like, and now she wants me to
> become a wireless expert overnight. Where do I start???
>
> I read Hugo Haas' wireless home LAN howto, which is mostly laptop-centric
> and doesn't explain what equipment you need for a desktop server; I read
> Jean Tourrilhes' extensive treatise on the history and theory of
> everything related to wireless networking; I even read some 847 page tome
> with brilliant illustrations of phase modulation and how my microwave
> oven affects the signal. Now I'm even more clueless than when I started!
>
> Here's what I'm trying to accomplish: I have a perfectly good ethernet
> LAN right now, with a Linux server I compulsively keep up to date acting
> as firewall, router, and gaming console; I have a cheap 8-port switch to
> send those little electrons scurrying across the living room rug to the
> other computers in the house. All I want to add is something that will
> send those same electrons scurrying through the air instead of on wires,
> using the same DNS, NAT, and whatever other acronyms I can throw in that
> are already in use on the desktop server.
>
> Do I need a separate WAP device? Is there a wireless equivalent of this
> little 8-port network switch? My wife says she saw something like that
> at Wal-Mart, but she has no idea what it does or how to use it.
>
> Some stuff I read makes it sound like I can just plug a wireless NIC
> (with built-in antenna) into the host and the NIC will act as its own
> WAP. That sounds like the best (read: cheapest) solution, but I don't
> want to blow fifty bucks (or 200!) on something that won't do the job. I
> also need to be sure that whatever I buy has working drivers in the Linux
> kernel, and I haven't been able to find a comprehensive list of Linux-
> friendly, PCI-based wireless cards that aren't PCMCIA.
>
> Any idle speculation, personal experiences, pointers to a FAQ that I
> missed, or general ridicule gratefully accepted.
>
> --
> Peter B. Steiger
> Cheyenne, WY
> If you must reply by email, you can reach me by placing zeroes
> where you see stars: wypbs_**2 at steigerfamily.com.
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com


And, may be a bit "retro" but there are very useful books on wireless
networking, to get you up to speed, and understand the acronyms
and pitfalls. On Amazon books searching on "wireless" returned
many, many, many hits. (Sorry, Commandant Lessard.)

HTH,
J


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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 04-05-2007, 04:11 PM
Jeff Liebermann
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: What do I need for barebones WLAN?

"Peter B. Steiger" <see.sig@for.email.address> hath wroth:

>"Don't string up another cable in the house," my wife informed me last
>night, "just set up a wireless server for me instead."


Smart lady. I think it best to keep her happy.

>It took me five years to get from FORMAT C: to knowing how to operate a
>Linux server with IP masquerading and the like, and now she wants me to
>become a wireless expert overnight. Where do I start???


The Windoze "Start" button is in the lower left hand corner of the
screen, but can be moved elsewhere. If it's not in its traditional
location, look in the other corners of the screen.

>I read Hugo Haas' wireless home LAN howto, which is mostly laptop-centric
>and doesn't explain what equipment you need for a desktop server;


Wrong. You're not building a server. What you apparently missed is
that *ALL* wireless is bridging. There are no IP's involved in
wireless except to connect to the device to configure it. What 802.11
wireless does is encapsulate 802.3 ethernet packets, inside 802.11
packets, thus acting like an ethernet extension cord. There is no
"server" anywhere in sight.

>I read
>Jean Tourrilhes' extensive treatise on the history and theory of
>everything related to wireless networking; I even read some 847 page tome
>with brilliant illustrations of phase modulation and how my microwave
>oven affects the signal. Now I'm even more clueless than when I started!


Did you learn to drive a vehicle by reading about thermodynamics and
Carnot Cycle Heat Engine theory? While these will certainly help you
understand how the engine functions, it won't help you decide on which
vehicle to purchase or how to operate it.

You didn't read our FAQ:
http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi
http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To
http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Fast_...Wi-Fi_Problems
This is normally a capital crime punishable by death, a support call
to India, or both, but we'll forgo punishment because you've already
suffered enough reading about wireless theory. It's also obvious that
you didn't read the IEEE-802.11a/b/g documentation, as you are still
sane.

Also, I suggest you download and browser the Intel Wireless Hot Spot
Guide from:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/crud/Intel%20HotSpot%20Guide.pdf>
Lots of good info on how Wi-Fi and such work included.

>Here's what I'm trying to accomplish: I have a perfectly good ethernet
>LAN right now, with a Linux server I compulsively keep up to date acting
>as firewall, router, and gaming console; I have a cheap 8-port switch to
>send those little electrons scurrying across the living room rug to the
>other computers in the house. All I want to add is something that will
>send those same electrons scurrying through the air instead of on wires,
>using the same DNS, NAT, and whatever other acronyms I can throw in that
>are already in use on the desktop server.


Incidentally, congratulations. Yours is the first posting in months
that I've seen that actually supplied the most basic information
required to answer a technical question.
1. What are you trying to accomplish?
2. What do you have to work with?
3. Where are you stuck?
It's quite refreshing and thanks.

>Do I need a separate WAP device?


Yes. You can do it with an internal PCI card or USB contrivance
inside the Linux server, but I don't recommend it. The computer
generates too much RFI, the metal box acts as an RF barricade, the
position of the antenna tends to be mediocre, and it will be yet
another service to screw with under Linux. Keep it simple and just
get an AP (access point).

However, I would not purchase something designated specifically as
only an AP. A "wireless router" is nothing more than a conglomeration
of:
- ethernet router
- wireless access point (i.e. bridge)
- 4 port ethernet switch
If you buy a wireless router instead of an access point, all you need
to do is disable the DHCP server and ignore the router section and you
have an access point. It's also cheaper this way as there are many
more wireless routers sold than access points.

The external AP also has a security benifit. Since it's not part of
the server, you can turn it off when it's not being used. I know of
several that are powered by AC lamp timer.

>Is there a wireless equivalent of this
>little 8-port network switch?


Yep. Wireless router. Leave your 8 port ethernet switch alone. Run
a CAT5 cable between the switch and one of the LAN ports on the
wireless router, and you now have a 7+3= 10 port switch.

>My wife says she saw something like that
>at Wal-Mart, but she has no idea what it does or how to use it.


Translation: You make the purchase so that you get blamed if it goes
wrong. Is your wife a manager at some large company?

>Some stuff I read makes it sound like I can just plug a wireless NIC
>(with built-in antenna) into the host and the NIC will act as its own
>WAP.


Yes. You can do that, but I advise against it. Just leave your
existing network alone and add a wireless access point (or wireless
router acting like an access point).

>That sounds like the best (read: cheapest) solution, but I don't
>want to blow fifty bucks (or 200!) on something that won't do the job.


I usually avoid specific hardware recommendations, but I'll make an
exception here. Since you are apparently well versed in Linux, it
might be best if you use a router that supports alternative open
source Linux firmware. I suggest a Buffalo WHR-HP-54G router, running
DD-WRT firmware. The feature and function list is far more extensive
than the cheap routers. The cost is about $50-$70. You don't really
need the router section, but as I previously mumbled, just use the
access point features.
<http://www.dd-wrt.com>
<http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Installation#Buffalo_WHR-G54S.2C_WHR-HP-G54.2C_WZR-HP-G54.2C_and_WZR-RS-G54>
<http://www.buffalo-technology.com/products/product-detail.php?productid=124>
It will also save you the cost of the lamp timer as it has cron based
access and reboot control.

>I
>also need to be sure that whatever I buy has working drivers in the Linux
>kernel, and I haven't been able to find a comprehensive list of Linux-
>friendly, PCI-based wireless cards that aren't PCMCIA.


Nope. That's another reason NOT to buy an internal card to play
access point. With an external AP, you don't need to do anything to
your Linux box. No drivers, cards, or even anything to plug in. The
ethernet cable from the wireless access point goes to your 8 port
switch (unless it's already crammed full of CAT5 cables in which case
I sympathize with your wife's position).

>Any idle speculation, personal experiences, pointers to a FAQ that I
>missed, or general ridicule gratefully accepted.


It's possible that your house is not suitable for wireless. Look for
metal in the walls such as aluminum foil backed wallpaper or
fiberglass insulation. Wireless will do one conventional drywall
easily. Two walls are a bit of an effort and require aftermarket
antennas. 3 walls or more are a crap shoot. Floors are also a
problem and may require more than one WAP for a large house.

If coverage is going to be a problem, or you have a very large house,
you might also consider alternatives to wireless such as:

Power Line networking:
<http://www.homeplug.com>

Phone line networking:
<http://www.homepna.com>

CATV coax sharing:
<http://www.coaxsys.com>
<http://www.multilet.com>
<http://www.mocalliance.org> (sorta, maybe)

In all cases, you do NOT need to add anything inside your Linux server
as all of these have external ethernet connections.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 04-05-2007, 05:19 PM
John Navas
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: What do I need for barebones WLAN?

On 05 Apr 2007 03:06:46 GMT, "Peter B. Steiger"
<see.sig@for.email.address> wrote in
<pan.2007.04.05.03.59.40@for.email.address>:

>On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 15:14:39 -0500, Todd H. sez:
>
>> I say, just buy a Linksys WRT54GL. It's a wireless router which has a
>> wan port, a 4port LAN switch, and in between it has a wireless access
>> point, SPI firewall, DHCP server, and web-based configuration accessible
>> at http://192.168.1.1 from the LAN side.

>
>Excellent! This is probably a stupid question that will answer itself
>when I get this router and plug it into the hub, but... how do I tell the
>firewall (which currently allows only 192.168.xxx.0/24 connections on the
>in-house ethernet line) to allow, for example, my wife's laptop on
>192.168.1.xyz but not Nosy Neighbor who piggybacks on my signal and
>acquires 192.168.1.abc from the router's DHCP? As often as I have
>borrowed an unsecure signal when travelling I would be a hypocrite not to
>share bandwidth, but I don't want the files on my hard drive to go beyond
>my family.


Your firewall won't be able to tell the difference. Better to keep your
neighbor off your network by means of WPA.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

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