Wi-Fi vs cable... any advantages?

I have an 8-Meg cable connection right now in my apartment, of which I
really only get 4 down and 0.5 up. My neighbor and I were talking the
other night, and he offered to let me use his Wi-Fi connection, which
I can pick up at 80% strength, but still slower than the 4 Megs I get
from Comcast.

If I didn't use Comcast for my phone service, I would cancel and just
use his Wi-Fi network... but as it stands, I suppose my question is:
Are there any advantages to running both a Wi-Fi & cable connection?
Or would these two connections compete with each other? Can I make
each connection serve a different purpose (i.e. update through my
cable connection and play World of Warcraft over the Wi-Fi at the same
time)? Just a thought.

On Jun 20, 8:41 pm, "negati...@gmail.com" <negati...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have an 8-Meg cable connection right now in my apartment, of which I
> really only get 4 down and 0.5 up. My neighbor and I were talking the
> other night, and he offered to let me use his Wi-Fi connection, which
> I can pick up at 80% strength, but still slower than the 4 Megs I get
> from Comcast.
>
> If I didn't use Comcast for my phone service, I would cancel and just
> use his Wi-Fi network... but as it stands, I suppose my question is:
> Are there any advantages to running both a Wi-Fi & cable connection?
> Or would these two connections compete with each other? Can I make
> each connection serve a different purpose (i.e. update through my
> cable connection and play World of Warcraft over the Wi-Fi at the same
> time)? Just a thought.

I think you are mis-stating or mis-understanding something here. WiFi
is a *Local* wireless network and to have internet connectivity (as
opposed to workgroup or machine to machine connectivity) there must be
some sort of internet service feeding the WiFi router (or "residential
gateway"). Your neighbor probably has either DSL or Cable for
broadband connectivity. If you use his WiFi for connectivity, you
would be sharing his bandwidth and likely violating his TOS (though if
your neighbor knows about you sharing, it's not likely that anything
will ever come of this)/

A WiFi router simply connects via ethernet (wired) connection to your
Cable or DSL modem and typically provides several ethernet (wired)
ports and a WiFi signal. These can definitely be used simultaneously
and there should be no bottleneck at all with 802.11G connections
(54Mbps to carry 4Mbps) No competition really, since your LAN has
plenty of bandwidth to carry both Workgroup and internet traffic.

Chris

digitalq wrote:
> On Jun 20, 8:41 pm, "negati...@gmail.com" <negati...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I have an 8-Meg cable connection right now in my apartment, of which I
>> really only get 4 down and 0.5 up.

Actually that sounds really slow for a 8 meg connection. It should be
more around 6 meg or higher.

My neighbor and I were talking the
>> other night, and he offered to let me use his Wi-Fi connection, which
>> I can pick up at 80% strength, but still slower than the 4 Megs I get
>> from Comcast.
>>
>> If I didn't use Comcast for my phone service, I would cancel and just
>> use his Wi-Fi network... but as it stands, I suppose my question is:
>> Are there any advantages to running both a Wi-Fi & cable connection?
>> Or would these two connections compete with each other? Can I make
>> each connection serve a different purpose (i.e. update through my
>> cable connection and play World of Warcraft over the Wi-Fi at the same
>> time)? Just a thought.
>
> I think you are mis-stating or mis-understanding something here. WiFi
> is a *Local* wireless network and to have internet connectivity (as
> opposed to workgroup or machine to machine connectivity) there must be
> some sort of internet service feeding the WiFi router (or "residential
> gateway"). Your neighbor probably has either DSL or Cable for
> broadband connectivity. If you use his WiFi for connectivity, you
> would be sharing his bandwidth and likely violating his TOS (though if
> your neighbor knows about you sharing, it's not likely that anything
> will ever come of this)/

It would still be a violation of the neighbors TOS with his isp.
especially if he is on cable.

>
> A WiFi router simply connects via ethernet (wired) connection to your
> Cable or DSL modem and typically provides several ethernet (wired)
> ports and a WiFi signal. These can definitely be used simultaneously
> and there should be no bottleneck at all with 802.11G connections
> (54Mbps to carry 4Mbps) No competition really, since your LAN has
> plenty of bandwidth to carry both Workgroup and internet traffic.
>
> Chris
>

"negativeB@gmail.com" <negativeB@gmail.com> hath wroth:

>I have an 8-Meg cable connection right now in my apartment, of which I
>really only get 4 down and 0.5 up.

There's something wrong with your unspecified equipment. All of my
cable modem benchmarks are running at maximum speed (and faster),
except when the system gets really busy. In short bursts, I've seen
15Mbits/sec. If you're getting 4Mbit/sec download, there's something
wrong. See the test results for Comcast at:
<http://www.dslreports.com/archive?f=g&dnsdom=comcast.net&dnsdom1=&domsum=Dra w+Graph>
Hmmm... big spike at 3.7Mbits/sec. Those are probably 802.11b
wireless connections. The speed isn't being limited by the cable
modem connection, it's limited by the 4.5Mbit/sec maximum you can cram
through an 802.11b connection. Anything faster requires 802.11g.

It's also possible to purchase a router with a bad case of thruput
constipation. See table at:
<http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/component/option,com_chart/Itemid,189/chart,119/>
The routers near the bottom just can't pass the traffic fast enough
for a cable modem.

So, what hardware do you have (makers and model numbers) and how are
you measuring it?

>My neighbor and I were talking the
>other night, and he offered to let me use his Wi-Fi connection, which
>I can pick up at 80% strength, but still slower than the 4 Megs I get
>from Comcast.

Half the speed, half the price. I don't see the problem.

>If I didn't use Comcast for my phone service, I would cancel and just
>use his Wi-Fi network... but as it stands, I suppose my question is:

You might want to read the Comcast TOS (terms of service).
<http://www.comcast.net/terms/>
There's probably an unenforceable clause in there about not sharing
connections.

>Are there any advantages to running both a Wi-Fi & cable connection?

That depends on what is at the other end of the Wi-Fi connection. If
it's another cable modem on the same system, you won't improve
reliability. If you want more speed, there's no way to "bond" two
different IP's into a single IP connection. You can get a load
balancing router to that you can automagically use either connection,
but the speeds don't add up.

>Or would these two connections compete with each other?

It would be an either/or proposition. You can't just plug everything
into an ethernet switch and expect things to magically work. See load
balancing routers for an explanation:
<http://www.edimax.com/en/produce_detail.php?pd_id=226&pl1_id=3&pl2_id=20>
<http://www.edimax.com/en/produce_detail.php?pd_id=49&pl1_id=3&pl2_id=20>

>Can I make
>each connection serve a different purpose (i.e. update through my
>cable connection and play World of Warcraft over the Wi-Fi at the same
>time)? Just a thought.

Not easily. You would need to specify a different gateway IP for each
connection and then explicitely define the route (source routing) to
each server using static routes. It can be done, but whether you want
to go through the ordeal is a bit much. A load balancing router will
do that for you. If one connection is clogged with traffic, it will
move any new traffic to the other connection.



--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

David <youcantoo@findmoore.net> wrote:
> digitalq wrote:
> > On Jun 20, 8:41 pm, "negati...@gmail.com" <negati...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I have an 8-Meg cable connection right now in my apartment, of which I
> >> really only get 4 down and 0.5 up.

> Actually that sounds really slow for a 8 meg connection. It should be
> more around 6 meg or higher.

I would agree. My "8Mbps" service downloads at 14Mbps, uploads somewhere
between 300-500Kbps. How did you decide that you had 8Mbps service?
I signed on at 3Mbps, and later I noticed that the web site said 5, now 8,
with an option for 15. My downloads have always been higher than the
advertised speed.

The download could easily be constrained by something else.

Some routers just won't go any faster, or some protocols won't go any
faster, or some download sites limit bandwidth on a particular connection.

I see higher throughput with two or three ftp sessions on the same PC than
I do with a single ftp session on that one PC. Two PCs downloading
simultaneously see about the same throughput as one PC with multiple
downloads.

You should try multiple downloads simultaneously, maybe on separate PCs.
You could connect directly to the cable modem, if you are normally using a
router.

What cable ISP do you have? What locality? What router are you using?

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5