Wireless range question

I have a Netgear WGR614 wireless router in my house and have always
had intermittant connectivity to my laptop (hp6220 with an Intel
BG2200) and a desktop with a wireless Netgear card (cannot remember
the type at the moment).

I've looked into upgrading drivers on the wireless cards, changing
channels, using a reflector and moving the AP without much success.
The laptop has been basically unusable, even when just in the next
room, and the desktop sometimes gets a 50% signal but it is
intermittant with no identifiable change in the environment or usual
sources of interference.

I was thinking of getting another access point or replacing the
WGR614, but my concern is that if the signal is intermittant from one
room to the next, that maybe this really wouldn't help. I don't want
to run wires, but that my be my only option. Earlier, I saw a
RangeMax USB adapter card. Are the RangeMax products worth the extra
money and/or would a RangeMax USB be a frugal first step instead of
going the wired or multiple AP/replacement route?

Thanks,
Dave

"tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com" <tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com> hath wroth:

>I have a Netgear WGR614 wireless router in my house and have always
>had intermittant connectivity to my laptop (hp6220 with an Intel
>BG2200) and a desktop with a wireless Netgear card (cannot remember
>the type at the moment).

Can I assume that you've updated the router firmware and the wireless
card drivers? A considerable number of such "range" problems are due
to problems that were solved in firmware long ago. The Intel 2200BG
card is a particularly common culprit. I prefer the Intel Proset
11.1.xxx drivers rather than whatever came with the HP laptop:
<http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Product_Filter.aspx?ProductID=1637>

The WGR614 comes in several mutations.
<http://kbserver.netgear.com/products/wgr614.asp>
Be sure to install the correct version.

>I've looked into upgrading drivers on the wireless cards

Duz "looked into" mean you've simply looked but not installed?

>changing
>channels, using a reflector and moving the AP without much success.
>The laptop has been basically unusable, even when just in the next
>room, and the desktop sometimes gets a 50% signal but it is
>intermittant with no identifiable change in the environment or usual
>sources of interference.

How strong is it in the same room?
What's in the wall between the rooms?

If you have aluminum foil back insulation in the walls, give up now.
Nothing will go through that. Concrete block walls, poured concrete,
and check wire (stucco) are little better.

>I was thinking of getting another access point or replacing the
>WGR614, but my concern is that if the signal is intermittant from one
>room to the next, that maybe this really wouldn't help.

Speculation is always helpful, but I think borrowing a different
wireless router might be equally useful. However, since you have two
laptops, it might be easier to just setup an ad-hoc connection between
the two laptops, turn off the WGR614, and see how much signal you get.

>I don't want
>to run wires, but that my be my only option.

Nobody "wants" to run wired. They're ugly, messy, sometimes
expensive, and always work. I can't say that wireless solves all
these complaints.

>Earlier, I saw a
>RangeMax USB adapter card. Are the RangeMax products worth the extra
>money and/or would a RangeMax USB be a frugal first step instead of
>going the wired or multiple AP/replacement route?

No. The problem with all the post-802.11g enhancements is that they
offer substantial increases in maximum speed, but little improvements
in dealing with lack of signal strength. If you have a highly
reflective environment, a MIMO (Pre-n) type of router might be useful
in that they utilize the reflections. However, they use it to gain
speed, not reliability or signal strength, so the benifits are
marginal. I suggest you keep it simple and just get a decent 802.11g
wireless router.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com <tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I have a Netgear WGR614 wireless router in my house and have always
> had intermittant connectivity to my laptop (hp6220 with an Intel
> BG2200) and a desktop with a wireless Netgear card (cannot remember
> the type at the moment).

I have a WGR614, and adding a free reflector to it made a lot of difference
in the stability of connections around the house.

http://www.freeantennas.com EZ-12, printed on photo paper for thick stock,
with aluminum foil glued to the sail, provides a substantial boost in
signal. http://www.rahul.net/dold/clarence/EZ12-windsurfer.jpg
http://www.rahul.net/dold/clarence/w...fer-dining.JPG The netstumbler
trace shows solid signal as I walked back to the router, a dropout as I
blocked the router, taking off the reflector, and then the lower signal
without the reflector, reduced, and fluctuating in level.

Make the tabs longer than the template drawing, for easier assembly.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

On Sep 13, 1:25 pm, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:

> Can I assume that you've updated the router firmware and the wireless
> card drivers? A considerable number of such "range" problems are due
> to problems that were solved in firmware long ago. The Intel 2200BG
> card is a particularly common culprit. I prefer the Intel Proset
> 11.1.xxx drivers rather than whatever came with the HP laptop:
> <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Product_Filter.aspx?ProductID=1637>
>

Yes, I use the proset software and the wireless card drivers are the
latest rev. The router is also at the latest rev, although I realize
that it is an old version of the router.

> Duz "looked into" mean you've simply looked but not installed?
>

No, they're the latest on the laptop. On the desktop, I'll need to
recheck.

>
> How strong is it in the same room?

Non-existent. I've wondered if I'm too close.

> What's in the wall between the rooms?

Plaster/lathe.

>
> If you have aluminum foil back insulation in the walls, give up now.
> Nothing will go through that. Concrete block walls, poured concrete,
> and check wire (stucco) are little better.

I don't have aluminum foil backed insulation, but the farthest desktop
is 3 walls away.

What is curious is that I pick up signals from neighbor's houses at
the far end desktop.

>
> >I was thinking of getting another access point or replacing the
> >WGR614, but my concern is that if the signal is intermittant from one
> >room to the next, that maybe this really wouldn't help.
>
> Speculation is always helpful, but I think borrowing a different
> wireless router might be equally useful. However, since you have two
> laptops, it might be easier to just setup an ad-hoc connection between
> the two laptops, turn off the WGR614, and see how much signal you get.
>
I will try this. Couldn't hurt, if only to see whether I can connect
at all from one end of the house to the other.

> No. The problem with all the post-802.11g enhancements is that they
> offer substantial increases in maximum speed, but little improvements
> in dealing with lack of signal strength. If you have a highly
> reflective environment, a MIMO (Pre-n) type of router might be useful
> in that they utilize the reflections. However, they use it to gain
> speed, not reliability or signal strength, so the benifits are
> marginal. I suggest you keep it simple and just get a decent 802.11g
> wireless router.
>

Ok. Thank you for your advice and input.
> --
> Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
> 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
> Santa Cruz CA 95060http://802.11junk.com
> Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sep 13, 5:08 pm, d...@01.usenet.us.com wrote:
> tom_sawye...@yahoo.com <tom_sawye...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > I have a Netgear WGR614 wireless router in my house and have always
> > had intermittant connectivity to my laptop (hp6220 with an Intel
> > BG2200) and a desktop with a wireless Netgear card (cannot remember
> > the type at the moment).
>
> I have a WGR614, and adding a free reflector to it made a lot of difference
> in the stability of connections around the house.
>
> http://www.freeantennas.comEZ-12, printed on photo paper for thick stock,
> with aluminum foil glued to the sail, provides a substantial boost in
> signal. http://www.rahul.net/dold/clarence/E...-dining.JPGThe netstumbler
> trace shows solid signal as I walked back to the router, a dropout as I
> blocked the router, taking off the reflector, and then the lower signal
> without the reflector, reduced, and fluctuating in level.
>
> Make the tabs longer than the template drawing, for easier assembly.
>
> --
> Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5


I set up one of the reflectors and it did help with the signal. The
problem is that to the desktop, it's intermittant...works one day and
not the next...with no difference in other devices being on,
additional interference, etc.

tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com <tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com> wrote:
> problem is that to the desktop, it's intermittant...works one day and

Have you tried turning your WAP off, and "finding" networks? Maybe there
is another WAP that is on occasionally. My neighbor has hers on a power
strip, only on when she's using it.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

"tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com" <tom_sawyer70@yahoo.com> hath wroth:

>Yes, I use the proset software and the wireless card drivers are the
>latest rev. The router is also at the latest rev, although I realize
>that it is an old version of the router.

You mentioned it's a WGR614 but you didn't mention the hardware
revision. There are 8 hardware versions of the WGR614. It has no
bearing on the problem, but I like to know such details.

>> How strong is it in the same room?
>
>Non-existent. I've wondered if I'm too close.

There's no way you can be too close unless you're within a few inches
of the wireless router. If you can't connect in the same room,
there's a real possibility that you're actually trying to connect to a
neighbors wireless router. Do you have a unique SSID that is easily
identified, or are you using the default SSID? It it doesn't work in
the same room as the WGR614 then there's something really wrong.

>> What's in the wall between the rooms?
>
>Plaster/lathe.

Bad. Anything with water in it is going to block 2.4GHz RF. The wood
lathe isn't going to block anything, but the plaster might. How much
depends on the composition of the plaster, and especially if there was
some rework done with wire mesh backing. Got a stud finder? If so,
use it to determine if there's any metal in the walls.

>I don't have aluminum foil backed insulation, but the farthest desktop
>is 3 walls away.

Going through three walls is a crap shoot. One wall is usually easy.
Two walls are a problem depending on what's in the wall. Three walls
require luck and almost paper walls. What's the straight line
distance through the three walls?

>What is curious is that I pick up signals from neighbor's houses at
>the far end desktop.

How far is the far end desktop from your WGR614? How far from the
neighbors? Compare signal strengths. If the neighbors wireless is
very strong, it might be creating some interference, which will make
maintaining a connection when they're moving traffic somewhat
difficult. You may wanna try other channels (1, 6, or 11).

>I will try this. Couldn't hurt, if only to see whether I can connect
>at all from one end of the house to the other.

If you're going for the long distance record, try a simple reflector:
<http://www.freeantennas.com>
to improve signal strength and reduce pickup from the neighbors. Too
bad the WGR614 has a non-removeable antenna, which makes aftermarket
and home made antennas difficult. If you don't mind butchering your
WGR614, it's fairly easy to replace the antenna connector with an
RP-SMA pigtail plus a bit of soldering.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558