I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
Belkin suggest the two shouldn't really be able to talk to each other
and more importantly WDS doesn't support WPA?
All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
(firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?
All the best ..
T i m
p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
overlooked?
T i m wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
> list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
> into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>
> After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
> add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
> (invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>
> Belkin suggest the two shouldn't really be able to talk to each other
> and more importantly WDS doesn't support WPA?
>
> All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
> wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
> so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
> (firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?
>
> All the best ..
>
> T i m
>
> p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
> common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
> don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
> overlooked?
Belkin routers need first a valid IP address for the computer, and then
will add the MAC address automatically to the MAC filtering table when
the filtering is set to disable. You can also add the MAC address
manually if the automatic process failes. Once the MAC address is
entered in the table, re-enable filtering.
[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
In <id77l1d6sbbd41is1hgsgpo4fvktbqhpfk@4ax.com> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:06:22
GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
>list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
>into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>
>After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
>add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
>(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
spoofed.
--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular>
> I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
> list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
> into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>
> After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
> add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
> (invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>
> Belkin suggest the two shouldn't really be able to talk to each other
> and more importantly WDS doesn't support WPA?
>
> All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
> wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
> so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
> (firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?
With a few exceptions, WDS only works between APs of the same brand.
The only APs I know of that can do WDS while using WPA are Apple's
AirPort Extreme and Express base stations. They can do WDS with some
non-Apple APs, such as Buffalo's older models, that use Broadcom chips;
but they can't use anything stronger than WEP when doing WDS with
non-Apple APs.
If you just need to add one PC to your wireless network, put an internal
wireless adapter in it or get an external adapter or "bridge" unit that
can operate in client mode. Forget about WDS.
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:28:47 -0600, "Quaoar" <quaoar@tenthplanet.net>
wrote:
>> p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
>> common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
>> don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
>> overlooked?
>
>Belkin routers need first a valid IP address for the computer, and then
>will add the MAC address automatically to the MAC filtering table when
>the filtering is set to disable. You can also add the MAC address
>manually if the automatic process failes. Once the MAC address is
>entered in the table, re-enable filtering.
Hi Q and thanks for the prompt reply ;-)
How would the above pan out if the 'device' connecting to them was a
wireles AP (connecting in bridge mode)?
I don't think I had filtering turned on (because I know it isn't
*that* secure and actually have a mac table on the existing ME102 AP
(FWIW)) and the Belkin router wouldn't let me ad *any* mac address
(inc all 0's or 1's etc) because (I think I now understand from
Belkin) they aren't 'Belkin' mac addresses???
My next test was to see if I could spoof a Belkin mac address in the
Asus (but then I couldn't make the link again so reverted the Asus
back to a simple AP).?
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:28:49 GMT, John Navas
<spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
>In <id77l1d6sbbd41is1hgsgpo4fvktbqhpfk@4ax.com> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:06:22
>GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>
>>I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
>>list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
>>into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>>
>>After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
>>add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
>>(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>
>FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
>spoofed.
Indeed, but I didn't know if it acted differently when set in the
"allow only AP's with these mac addresses to connect" rather than
straight client roles John?
>> All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
>> wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
>> so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
>> (firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?
>
>With a few exceptions, WDS only works between APs of the same brand.
Ok, and sorta what the Belkin guy suggested .. however I'm pretty sure
I *had* connection to the net with this setup ..?
Laptop, Ethernet, WL-300g, <802.11g WiFi> i, Belkin, DSL, Inet ..?
The only reason I called then was to find out why I got an "Invalid
mac" message box as soon as I tried to 'apply' the Asus WiFi mac add
in the Belkin's 'AP's that can connect' box? It was then they
suggested that they were surprised it was working at all (being a non
Belkin box at the other end).
>
>The only APs I know of that can do WDS while using WPA are Apple's
>AirPort Extreme and Express base stations.
Ok ..
They can do WDS with some
>non-Apple APs, such as Buffalo's older models, that use Broadcom chips;
(this Asus had 'Broadcom' as the SSID after I applied the firmware
update ??)
>but they can't use anything stronger than WEP when doing WDS with
>non-Apple APs.
Hmm, no (potentially) outside of Apple's arena, WDS doesn't support
WPA ?
>
>If you just need to add one PC to your wireless network, put an internal
>wireless adapter in it or get an external adapter or "bridge" unit that
>can operate in client mode. Forget about WDS.
Welll, that was what I was sorta hoping to do with the Asus WL-300g
but still connect into the Belkin (removing the two Netgear ME102
AP's). It was 'Clueless' (of this very list) that suggested the Asus
on the basis that it would take alternative firmware and therefore
(probably?) do what I wanted?
If I can make this Asus unit work in client mode (and that was a
previous question that received no replies? please see "Asus WL-300g
in 'client mode')" then that would be fine ;-)
Failing that ... would a pair working in AP (local) and WDS / Hybrid
(remote) be more likely to support WPA whilst 'bridging' would you
know / think please Neill?
T i m wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:28:47 -0600, "Quaoar" <quaoar@tenthplanet.net>
> wrote:
>
>>> p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
>>> common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
>>> don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
>>> overlooked?
>>
>> Belkin routers need first a valid IP address for the computer, and
>> then will add the MAC address automatically to the MAC filtering
>> table when the filtering is set to disable. You can also add the
>> MAC address manually if the automatic process failes. Once the MAC
>> address is entered in the table, re-enable filtering.
>
> Hi Q and thanks for the prompt reply ;-)
>
> How would the above pan out if the 'device' connecting to them was a
> wireles AP (connecting in bridge mode)?
>
> I don't think I had filtering turned on (because I know it isn't
> *that* secure and actually have a mac table on the existing ME102 AP
> (FWIW)) and the Belkin router wouldn't let me ad *any* mac address
> (inc all 0's or 1's etc) because (I think I now understand from
> Belkin) they aren't 'Belkin' mac addresses???
>
> My next test was to see if I could spoof a Belkin mac address in the
> Asus (but then I couldn't make the link again so reverted the Asus
> back to a simple AP).?
>
> I'll have a look again later though .. ;-)
>
> All the best ..
>
> T i m
Belkin doesn't exclude non-Belkin products. The MAC address on the
device is separated by colons: 00:04:... but in the MAC table there are
no colons, simply a string of lower case hex digits. If the MAC
filtering is not enabled in the router, then there is no issue there.
What do you see in the router DHCP client table? Does the access point
show up there?
[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
In <bak7l1dfkmblhtj6gl8v6k9lq59ce29cte@4ax.com> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 16:30:41
GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:28:49 GMT, John Navas
><spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
>>In <id77l1d6sbbd41is1hgsgpo4fvktbqhpfk@4ax.com> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:06:22
>>GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
>>>list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
>>>into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>>>
>>>After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
>>>add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
>>>(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>>
>>FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
>>spoofed.
>
>Indeed, but I didn't know if it acted differently when set in the
>"allow only AP's with these mac addresses to connect" rather than
>straight client roles John?
No better in that filtering role than in any other filtering role.
--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular>
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 17:52:12 GMT, John Navas
<spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>>FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
>>>spoofed.
>>
>>Indeed, but I didn't know if it acted differently when set in the
>>"allow only AP's with these mac addresses to connect" rather than
>>straight client roles John?
>
>No better in that filtering role than in any other filtering role.
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 17:52:12 GMT, John Navas
<spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
>No better in that filtering role than in any other filtering role.
Somone has pointed out that these Netgear ME102's should also support
'point-to-point' mode?
Would this (with 129b WEP) be more secure than AP > 'AP Client mode'
and would that in turn be more / less secure than 'bridging' with a
strong WPA can you say please?
(and would I loose any functionallity for my 'remote pc connecting to
the main house' scanario)?
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 20:40:25 GMT, John Navas
<spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
<snip> Thanks for those answers John ;-)
>
>>(and would I loose any functionallity for my 'remote pc connecting to
>>the main house' scanario)?
>
>If you want to connect beyond a wireless node, then you'll need bridging in
>one of those nodes.
Ok .. so (just so I understand the 'rules') would 'bridging' preclude
the use of WPA (or is it only 'WDS' that does that (in some / all
cases?))?
I defaulted the WL-300g (again) last night and re set the fields and
actually got back to (wireless) connectivity with the Belkin router
;-)
I think I got it into 'Hybrid mode'
This morning, with nothing changed, I'm getting DHCP over the link
from the Belkin router but can't surf the net (more tests today then
...)?
[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
In <qs59l11dn5jaf8d67pfs2j15q42dloup10@4ax.com> on Tue, 18 Oct 2005 08:56:54
GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 20:40:25 GMT, John Navas
><spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
><snip> Thanks for those answers John ;-)
>>
>>>(and would I loose any functionallity for my 'remote pc connecting to
>>>the main house' scanario)?
>>
>>If you want to connect beyond a wireless node, then you'll need bridging in
>>one of those nodes.
>
>Ok .. so (just so I understand the 'rules') would 'bridging' preclude
>the use of WPA (or is it only 'WDS' that does that (in some / all
>cases?))?
>
>[SNIP]
That would depend on the device. I'm not familiar with that device.
--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular>
On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 13:21:03 GMT, John Navas
<spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>Ok .. so (just so I understand the 'rules') would 'bridging' preclude
>>the use of WPA (or is it only 'WDS' that does that (in some / all
>>cases?))?
>>
>>[SNIP]
>
>That would depend on the device. I'm not familiar with that device.
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 20:40:25 GMT, John Navas
<spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
>In <hru7l1t3ft9lkgp50cabo7506cp5vo0tck@4ax.com> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 19:33:22
>GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>
>>Somone has pointed out that these Netgear ME102's should also support
>>'point-to-point' mode?
>Ad hoc mode.
The ME102, WPA11, and DWL-900 series of routers will not do ad-hoc
mode and cannot participate in an ad-hoc network. However, they can
do:
1. Access point client mode.
2. Bridge Mode (point to point)
3. Bridge Mode (point to multipoint)
>If you want to connect beyond a wireless node, then you'll need bridging in
>one of those nodes.
[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
In <sm3al15fnbjng35ha6f8or5dn9ngc83npj@4ax.com> on Tue, 18 Oct 2005 15:05:42
GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 13:21:03 GMT, John Navas
><spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
>>>Ok .. so (just so I understand the 'rules') would 'bridging' preclude
>>>the use of WPA (or is it only 'WDS' that does that (in some / all
>>>cases?))?
>>>
>>>[SNIP]
>>
>>That would depend on the device. I'm not familiar with that device.
>
>Ah, so it's not 'across the board' though then?
A great many things aren't 'across the board'.
--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular>
On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 08:40:41 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
<jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us> wrote:
>The ME102, WPA11, and DWL-900 series of routers will not do ad-hoc
>mode and cannot participate in an ad-hoc network. However, they can
>do:
> 1. Access point client mode.
> 2. Bridge Mode (point to point)
> 3. Bridge Mode (point to multipoint)
*My* ME102 also has:
0. Access point
;-)
So, last night I felt I had the Asus > Belkin working (Asus in Hybrid
mode with WPA) and when I went to test it this morning I couldn't
browse the web. I could though via my main PC (so guessed it wasn't my
Belkin router / cable connection etc) so looked at the new link again.
That seemed ok as I was getting DHCP over it (always a good sign) but
I couldn't browse the web?
Stranger I could ping anywhere (ie www..google.com) and that would
resolve the i/p and give me a positive ping?
But still no smtp, pop, nntp or http ?
So, I moved the laptop from the 'remore' Asus link and put it straight
into the Belkin router .. still nothing! I then put it straight into
the cable modem (30 sec reset to change mac address) and still the
same .. ping ok but nothing else!
Then it dawned on me that my main PC was using my neighbours gateway
(hard wired, with permission!) so that was why that was working when
everything else wasn't. (doh)
A call to the ISP yealded 'some network upgrades' and my cable modem
being left behind registered on the 'wrong' server ... ;-( ( I had
actually checked their status page before I phoned and nothing was
pending).
Anyway ... I tried setting an incorrect WPA code in the Asus and it
wouldn't connect to the Belkin, changing it back to the real one gave
connection again (so I will assume WPA is working in this mode)?
So, do I reposition the Belkin (to offer better coverage where I want
it) or buy another WL-300g and leave the Belkin where it is?
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:51:06 -0600, "Quaoar" <quaoar@tenthplanet.net>
wrote:
Sri I didn't get back before ..
>
>Belkin doesn't exclude non-Belkin products.
Ok ..
The MAC address on the
>device is separated by colons: 00:04:... but in the MAC table there are
>no colons, simply a string of lower case hex digits.
understood ..
If the MAC
>filtering is not enabled in the router, then there is no issue there.
Other than it appears I can't add *some* mac address without it
complaining (like all 0's or 1's) .. must be a syntax checker on
there? I have just tried again and It can't make up it's mind when it
want's accept an address or not?
>
>What do you see in the router DHCP client table?
<checks router> At the moment, just *this* wired PC's i/p, host and
mac add.
> Does the access point
>show up there?
<turns on 'remote' laptop ..
<refresh Belkin DHCP list> No .. but the laptop connected wirelessly
via the Asus does.
<ISP>
<Belkin Router with 'enable wireless bridging ticked'><Me on this PC>
air
<Asus AP in Hybrid mode and WPA on> wired to
<non-wireless-built-in-and-WiFi-card-removed-laptop>
<Me browing the web> ;-)
AND .. I just turned on another old laptop with a Buffalo 54g PCMCIA
card in it and 'joined' this WiFi network. I could see from the
Buffalo client software that I had actually joined the Belkin router
so I set that NOT to accept wireless clients and I seem to have
'roamed' across to the Asus unit (confirmed by the wireless status
from the Asus saying the second laptop is "associated authorized")
;-)
So one wired and 1 wireless remote lapopys connecting to the cnet and
me acccessing the diag port on the Asus from this PC (so 3 'sessions'
over the witreless link) ;-)
For those interested .. the WL-300g (firmware 1.8.1.9) is set as ..
Bridge
AP Mode = Hybrid
Chan = 8 (same as Belkin)
Connect to AP's in Remote briidge list = Yes
Allow Anonymous = no
Mac add = 0030bda1a1a1 (Belkin mac .. (example))
On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 17:55:45 GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 08:40:41 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
><jeffl@comix.santa-cruz.ca.us> wrote:
>
>
>>The ME102, WPA11, and DWL-900 series of routers will not do ad-hoc
>>mode and cannot participate in an ad-hoc network. However, they can
>>do:
>> 1. Access point client mode.
>> 2. Bridge Mode (point to point)
>> 3. Bridge Mode (point to multipoint)
>
>*My* ME102 also has:
>
>0. Access point
What can I say? I only included the modes that might be useful for
the original application. It's an access point, so of course it has
an access point mode (which really should be called an "infrastructure
access point"). Anyway, my only point was that it doesn't support
ad-hoc (non-infrastructure) modes.
(...)
>A call to the ISP yealded 'some network upgrades' and my cable modem
>being left behind registered on the 'wrong' server ...
It's common knowledge that chickens no longer lay small eggs. Instead,
they lay large, extra-large, and jumbo eggs. Program bugs have been
upgraded to "unimplimented features". Similarly, ISP's no longer have
equipment failures, but only suffer from "network upgrades".
>Anyway ... I tried setting an incorrect WPA code in the Asus and it
>wouldn't connect to the Belkin, changing it back to the real one gave
>connection again (so I will assume WPA is working in this mode)?
Yep. Good test.
>So, do I reposition the Belkin (to offer better coverage where I want
>it) or buy another WL-300g and leave the Belkin where it is?
Or use a reflector antenna to shovel more signal in the desired
direction? Or maybe a different antenna? Or an AC power line
wireless bridge extension?
WPA won't work with WDS ? 
Linear Mode
