On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation system
hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car, as
a spare.
Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
in inside? If
so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
> system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
> as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal from the GPS unit.
If your phone has bluetooth then turn it off, and everything should be fine
:-)
"Simon Finnigan" <SimonFinnigan@hotmail.com> wrote in
message news:54g3asF20nc5dU1@mid.individual.net
> "JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
> news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> > On the television the other day was something about how
> > thieves are using something electronic to find out if
> > someone has a satelite navigation system
> > hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details
> > of it. I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove
> > compartment of the car, as a spare.
> > Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to
> > pick up that my phone in inside? If
> > so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>
> Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal
> from the GPS unit.
Eh..? How many phones in the UK even *have* GPS fitted..?
> If your phone has bluetooth then turn
> it off, and everything should be fine :-)
I have a spare 6210 in the car as an emergency spare. It's not been
switched on for the best part of a year, apart from when I fired it up
last week to make a call to keep it live. They'd have a hard job detecting
a phone that isn't switched on.
"Ivor Jones" <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote in message
news:54g7k7F20rus3U1@mid.individual.net...
> "Simon Finnigan" <SimonFinnigan@hotmail.com> wrote in
> message news:54g3asF20nc5dU1@mid.individual.net
>> "JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
>> news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
>> > On the television the other day was something about how
>> > thieves are using something electronic to find out if
>> > someone has a satelite navigation system
>> > hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details
>> > of it. I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove
>> > compartment of the car, as a spare.
>> > Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to
>> > pick up that my phone in inside? If
>> > so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>>
>> Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal
>> from the GPS unit.
>
> Eh..? How many phones in the UK even *have* GPS fitted..?
Where did I say the phone had bluetooth fitted? I use my mobile phone with
TomTom installed, and a bluetooth GPS unit. A lot of units like the TomTom
have bluetooth to allow them to work as a hands free kit for your phone.
All of this would result in a bluetooth signal being detectible outside your
car.
>> If your phone has bluetooth then turn
>> it off, and everything should be fine :-)
>
> I have a spare 6210 in the car as an emergency spare. It's not been
> switched on for the best part of a year, apart from when I fired it up
> last week to make a call to keep it live. They'd have a hard job detecting
> a phone that isn't switched on.
In which case it isn`t transmitting anything on bluetooth, so it won`t be
picked up.
In article <54g7k7F20rus3U1@mid.individual.net>, Ivor Jones says...
> Eh..? How many phones in the UK even *have* GPS fitted..?
Ho-hum....
A lot of standalone Stnav units such as TomTom allow you to connect to
your phone via Bluetooth to do such lovely things as updating traffic
info online or using your phone hands free.
>
--
Conor
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright
until you hear them speak.........
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
> system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
> as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>
>
>
Didn't see the show but I think thieves are more interested in disabling
your LoJack devices than detecting cell phones. Had my almost new Acura with
a high end alarm system stolen in San Diego and within two hours it was
completely stripped and parts already transported to Mexico.
On Feb 26, 4:46 am, "JWBH" <blue.star...@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote:
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car, as
> a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
It's not just phones or GPS they're looking for; they're also looking
for laptops. But your cheap old phone probably doesn't have GPS or
bluetooth...so it's ok presuming you've got it out of sight.
Jack wrote:
>>
>
> Didn't see the show but I think thieves are more interested in disabling
> your LoJack devices than detecting cell phones. Had my almost new Acura with
> a high end alarm system stolen in San Diego and within two hours it was
> completely stripped and parts already transported to Mexico.
>
>
I recall reading that San Diego has the highest auto theft rate in
the U.S.
--
To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell
"Jack" <Jack@xxxx.xxx> wrote in message
news:YN6dnWL6GruClH7YnZ2dnUVZ_sSmnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
> system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
> as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>
>
>
Didn't see the show but I think thieves are more interested in disabling
your LoJack devices than detecting cell phones. Had my almost new Acura with
a high end alarm system stolen in San Diego and within two hours it was
completely stripped and parts already transported to Mexico.
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using something electronic to
> find out if someone has a satelite
> navigation system hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car, as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone in inside?
Nope, if you leave it turned off, they wont be able to detect it.
On Feb 26, 7:46 am, "JWBH" <blue.star...@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote:
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
No doubt the technology exists but it's not likey cost effective for
the junkie looking to get $50 for your phone or GPS
A more low tech method is to look for the nicest looking cars as
they'll likely contain the nicest stuff.
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car, as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
If you leave your phone turned on, then yes, it can be detected by
someone with the right kind of spectrum analyzer. A phone transmits
periodically to the nearest cell tower so they know where to route
any incoming calls.
You can even detect signal leakage from devices that don't intentionally
transmit, such as a gps receiver.
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
> system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
> as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>
>
>
Just make sure it is switched off and you are safe.
--
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
> system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
That would be because there werent any, as its complete bollocks.
--
Tumbleweed
email replies not necessary but to contact use;
tumbleweednews at hotmail dot com
Don K <dk@dont_bother_me.com> wrote
> JWBH <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote
>> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using something electronic to
>> find out if someone has a satelite
>> navigation system hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the
>> car, as a spare. Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my
>> phone in inside? If so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
> If you leave your phone turned on, then yes, it can be detected by
> someone with the right kind of spectrum analyzer. A phone transmits
> periodically to the nearest cell tower so they know where to route
> any incoming calls.
Its more complicated than that in practice with hordes of other phones doing
that too, and that not happening very often at all with a particular phone.
> You can even detect signal leakage from devices that don't intentionally transmit, such as a gps
> receiver.
Again, it isnt that easy to work out which car its coming from tho.
In article <1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net>,
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote:
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car, as
> a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
As long as the phone is off, I don't see how detecting it would be
possible.
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
> system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
> as a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>
>
>
Most thieves steal the car itself. Anything inside is gravy. Why pass up a
$40,000 car and steal a $60.00 cellular phone?
SimonFinnigan@hotmail.com declared for all the world to hear...
> Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal from the GPS unit.
> If your phone has bluetooth then turn it off, and everything should be fine
> :-)
It's more likely they would be actively searching for a particular
metal, maybe the lithium in a battery.
--
Regards
Jon
SimonFinnigan@hotmail.com declared for all the world to hear...
> Where did I say the phone had bluetooth fitted? I use my mobile phone with
> TomTom installed, and a bluetooth GPS unit. A lot of units like the TomTom
> have bluetooth to allow them to work as a hands free kit for your phone.
> All of this would result in a bluetooth signal being detectible outside your
> car.
While it was switched off? I hope not.
--
Regards
Jon
"JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
system
> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>
> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
as
> a spare.
> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my phone
> in inside? If
> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>
Are you sure they were looking for satellite navigation systems? Weren't
they looking for an anti-theft device to be sure that if they steal the car,
their every move will not be registered by the owner and eventually the
police? The modems in these devices send periodic signals to the cell phone
network and it must be possible to detect this.
"Conor" <conor.turton@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.204d0207ec6123e698a000@news.karoo.co.uk
> In article <54g7k7F20rus3U1@mid.individual.net>, Ivor
> Jones says...
>
> > Eh..? How many phones in the UK even *have* GPS
> > fitted..?
>
> Ho-hum....
>
> A lot of standalone Stnav units such as TomTom allow you
> to connect to your phone via Bluetooth to do such lovely
> things as updating traffic info online or using your
> phone hands free.
A little too much snipping there. The point I replied to was:
>Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal from the GPS unit.
I ask again, how many *phones* have GPS..? Nowhere did the OP say he even
had a satnav system, just a spare phone left in the glovebox, I assume
switched off.
"Jon" <spam@jonparker.plus.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.204dede442ceb1a598a79c@text.usenet.plus.n et
> SimonFinnigan@hotmail.com declared for all the world to
> hear...
> > Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal
> > from the GPS unit. If your phone has bluetooth then
> > turn it off, and everything should be fine :-)
>
> It's more likely they would be actively searching for a
> particular metal, maybe the lithium in a battery.
Right, please tell me how someone is (a) going to be able to detect
lithium in a battery that might be in some device in possibly a moving car
and (b) how they're going to tell it's in a phone..?
ivor@despammed.invalid declared for all the world to hear...
> Right, please tell me how someone is (a) going to be able to detect
> lithium in a battery that might be in some device in possibly a moving car
> and (b) how they're going to tell it's in a phone..?
I have no idea, it's not my area of expertise.
--
Regards
Jon
"George Grapman" <sfgeorge@paccbell.net> wrote in message
news:CPEEh.2090$jx3.867@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net ...
> Jack wrote:
>>>
>>
>> Didn't see the show but I think thieves are more interested in disabling
>> your LoJack devices than detecting cell phones. Had my almost new Acura
>> with a high end alarm system stolen in San Diego and within two hours it
>> was completely stripped and parts already transported to Mexico.
> I recall reading that San Diego has the highest auto theft rate in the
> U.S.
>
And with high insurance premium to match.
> --
> To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell
"lostparts" <clem641@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:TmFEh.45064$I8.19968@bignews8.bellsouth.net.. .
> Must of been one of Bush's guest worker groups.
>
Guest workers with special skills. The thing is when you found cars stolen
from the states and transported to Mexico, including American police cars,
there is no way to force the Mexican government to return it back to the US.
> "Jack" <Jack@xxxx.xxx> wrote in message
> news:YN6dnWL6GruClH7YnZ2dnUVZ_sSmnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
>
> "JWBH" <blue.star777@REMOOOOVEvirgin.net> wrote in message
> news:1FAEh.33647$3a3.26391@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
>> On the television the other day was something about how thieves are using
>> something electronic to find out if someone has a satelite navigation
>> system
>> hidden in their car. I didn't get any of the details of it.
>>
>> I usually keep a cheap mobile phone in the glove compartment of the car,
>> as a spare.
>> Could similar means (what ever they were) be used to pick up that my
>> phone
>> in inside? If
>> so I wouldn't leave it in the car.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Didn't see the show but I think thieves are more interested in disabling
> your LoJack devices than detecting cell phones. Had my almost new Acura
> with
> a high end alarm system stolen in San Diego and within two hours it was
> completely stripped and parts already transported to Mexico.
>
>
>
Ivor Jones wrote:
> "Conor" <conor.turton@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.204d0207ec6123e698a000@news.karoo.co.uk
>> In article <54g7k7F20rus3U1@mid.individual.net>, Ivor
>> Jones says...
>>
>>> Eh..? How many phones in the UK even *have* GPS
>>> fitted..?
>> Ho-hum....
>>
>> A lot of standalone Stnav units such as TomTom allow you
>> to connect to your phone via Bluetooth to do such lovely
>> things as updating traffic info online or using your
>> phone hands free.
>
> A little too much snipping there. The point I replied to was:
>
>> Most likely they`d be searching for a bluetooth signal from the GPS unit.
>
> I ask again, how many *phones* have GPS..? Nowhere did the OP say he even
> had a satnav system, just a spare phone left in the glovebox, I assume
> switched off.
>
> Ivor
GPS has nothing to do with it - it's the BT signal that people can pick up.
I have a TomTom GPS BT device. If it's on, then it's discoverable. If
it's off, then it's silent.
Similarly, my phone can be discoverable. It doesn't have GPS, but still
the BT signal can be picked up.
Thieves don't care if they pick up a phone or a SatNav device.
On Tue, 27 Feb 2007 13:34:04 +0100, "Andreas van Hooijdonk"
<ahooijdZ@scarletZ.beZ> wrote:
>Are you sure they were looking for satellite navigation systems?
I expect so. These are valuable and portable, with a ready market.
>Weren't
>they looking for an anti-theft device to be sure that if they steal the car,
>their every move will not be registered by the owner and eventually the
>police?
No, there are three types of tracker device. The "normal" sort is
passive, and needs to be switched on by the control centre. Once
enabled, they transmit a beacon signal that the police track. Until
triggered, undetectable.
Another sort is similar, but it detects movement of the vehicle,
contacts the control centre who phone the owner before switching on
the tracker. Until triggered, undetectable.
>The modems in these devices send periodic signals to the cell phone
>network and it must be possible to detect this.
The third sort uses GPS to track its position, which is transmitted by
SMS or GPRS from an embedded mobile phone. The chances of being able
to know that this is not just from some mobile phone in the vicinity
is just about nil.
Similarly, it is not credible that anyone could detect the signal from
a GPS receiver - these things are listening to a signal that is
significantly /below/ the noise floor. They can't put out any noise of
their own. The only detectable transmission would be any Bluetooth. It
would make sense not to have that discoverable!
hairydog@despammed.com wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Feb 2007 13:34:04 +0100, "Andreas van Hooijdonk"
> <ahooijdZ@scarletZ.beZ> wrote:
>
> >Are you sure they were looking for satellite navigation systems?
>
> I expect so. These are valuable and portable, with a ready market.
They may indeed have some market value, but the claim was that the
thieves were using some kind of electronic device to identify which
cars to break into. A GPS hidden by the owner in the glove box or
trunk would almost certainly be turned off while the car is parked so
it wouldn't be emitting any telltale signals for the thieves to home
in on. So I remain skeptical that this is what was actually
happening. Using an electronic listening device to detect a car anti-
theft tracking system seems much more feasible.
>
> >Weren't
> >they looking for an anti-theft device to be sure that if they steal the car,
> >their every move will not be registered by the owner and eventually the
> >police?
>
> No, there are three types of tracker device. The "normal" sort is
> passive, and needs to be switched on by the control centre. Once
> enabled, they transmit a beacon signal that the police track. Until
> triggered, undetectable.
Sure, but the thieves would have a great incentive to know just when
the device is triggered to transmit and therefore becomes detectable.
At that time they can act quickly to locate and disable the device or,
if that's not feasible, they can abandon that particular vehicle to
avoid being caught. So I wouldn't be at all surprised to hear that
sophisticated car-theft rings have started using special radio
receivers to detect such anti-theft tracking devices.
>
> Another sort is similar, but it detects movement of the vehicle,
> contacts the control centre who phone the owner before switching on
> the tracker. Until triggered, undetectable.
And again, it would be to the thieves' advantage to detect the device
as soon as it starts transmitting and to disable it so they can't be
tracked.
>
> >The modems in these devices send periodic signals to the cell phone
> >network and it must be possible to detect this.
Yes, systems like On-Star could be detected by the cellular data
messages they transmit from the car. LoJack-type systems send out
their own type of radio homing signal that the police use to track the
vehicle and this could also be detected by an appropriate radio
receiver.
>
> The third sort uses GPS to track its position, which is transmitted by
> SMS or GPRS from an embedded mobile phone. The chances of being able
> to know that this is not just from some mobile phone in the vicinity
> is just about nil.
Not really. The thief is inside the vehicle and signals from the
embedded phone hidden in that vehicle will be much stronger and
consistent than signals from some random phone somewhere in the same
neighborhood.
>
> Similarly, it is not credible that anyone could detect the signal from
> a GPS receiver - these things are listening to a signal that is
> significantly /below/ the noise floor. They can't put out any noise of
> their own.
This is also not really true. While GPS receivers are designed not to
put out tranmissions at the GPS satellite frequency, they do have
superheterodyne receiver circuits that use a local oscillator. There
are some detectable radio emissions from this local oscillator. It's
pretty common knowledge that many GPS receivers interfere with certain
radio channels in the 2m amateur band when the GPS is held in
proximity to the radio receiver. The emissions are very low power but
they could easily be detected by a receiver designed specifically for
that purpose. But, as I pointed out above, when a car has been left
parked the owner would normally leave the GPS device turned off - so
then it would not be creating such emissions, nor would it send any
Bluetooth signals.
>The only detectable transmission would be any Bluetooth. It
> would make sense not to have that discoverable!
hairydog@despammed.com wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Feb 2007 13:34:04 +0100, "Andreas van Hooijdonk"
> <ahooijdZ@scarletZ.beZ> wrote:
>
>> Are you sure they were looking for satellite navigation systems?
>
> I expect so. These are valuable and portable, with a ready market.
>
>> Weren't
>> they looking for an anti-theft device to be sure that if they steal
>> the car, their every move will not be registered by the owner and
>> eventually the police?
>
> No, there are three types of tracker device. The "normal" sort is
> passive, and needs to be switched on by the control centre. Once
> enabled, they transmit a beacon signal that the police track. Until
> triggered, undetectable.
>
> Another sort is similar, but it detects movement of the vehicle,
> contacts the control centre who phone the owner before switching on
> the tracker. Until triggered, undetectable.
>
>> The modems in these devices send periodic signals to the cell phone
>> network and it must be possible to detect this.
>
> The third sort uses GPS to track its position, which is transmitted by
> SMS or GPRS from an embedded mobile phone. The chances of being able
> to know that this is not just from some mobile phone in the vicinity
> is just about nil.
> Similarly, it is not credible that anyone could detect the signal from a
> GPS receiver - these things are listening to a signal that is significantly
> /below/ the noise floor. They can't put out any noise of their own.
Wrong with emissions outside the band that the satellites use.
> The only detectable transmission would be any Bluetooth.
So much for your previous claim.
> It would make sense not to have that discoverable!
detecting hidden sat nav or phone in car 
Linear Mode
