Legal to drive with mobile phone on handsfree?

QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?

-----

Am assuming no voice-activated calls: I would have to press the buttons
on the handset to make a call.

I remember a law was passed a few years ago about not driving while
holding a mobile. And then ISTR it was amended and I beleive it is
being changed again at the end of Feb.

-----

In case there's any confusion on account of PHF, Bluetooth, car kits,
etc .... by "handsfree" I mean a wire from the phone to an earpiece and
which looks something like this: http://tinyurl.com/3x57k5

"Jonno" <jonno@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns98DDD6BCAA8F917E53A@127.0.0.1...
> QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
> handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?
>
> -----
>
> Am assuming no voice-activated calls: I would have to press the buttons
> on the handset to make a call.
>
> I remember a law was passed a few years ago about not driving while
> holding a mobile. And then ISTR it was amended and I beleive it is
> being changed again at the end of Feb.
>
> -----
>
> In case there's any confusion on account of PHF, Bluetooth, car kits,
> etc .... by "handsfree" I mean a wire from the phone to an earpiece and
> which looks something like this: http://tinyurl.com/3x57k5
>

Why wouldn't it be - it's no different to speaking to people in the car!
Operating the buttons on the phone meaning you have to take your eyes off
the road - as you do for tuning some radios or selecting a cd track - might
not be acceptable. Most people I know can use a radio or phone and drive.
It's only the daft woman type that can't do too many things at once and use
it as an excuse - people like that can't drive anyway.

"Jonno" <jonno@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns98DDD6BCAA8F917E53A@127.0.0.1...
> QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
> handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?
>
> -----
>
> Am assuming no voice-activated calls: I would have to press the buttons
> on the handset to make a call.

My old phone would automaticaly answer calls with a headset plugged in.
This would be OK under the new law. But it would not originate without
pressing at least one button (to initiate the voice ativated dial), so
didn't quite. I rarely want to do this and then usually because of being
stuck in traffic.

My new car has a phone wired in so I just press a button on the streering
wheel to answer and similarly can initiate calls without taking my hands off
the wheel.

>
> I remember a law was passed a few years ago about not driving while
> holding a mobile. And then ISTR it was amended and I beleive it is
> being changed again at the end of Feb.

It is only the penalty that changes (3 points as well).

>

Of course the plods are allowed to use two way radios in the car (where you
have to push to talk each time) even when it is not an emergency, so it is
literally one rule for them and another for the rest of us.

The average TC will not like being reminded about [t]his hypocracy, and may
decide to ticket you for something else as well if you do.

On Tue, 20 Feb 2007 21:06:34 GMT, Jonno <jonno@nomail.com> wrote:

>QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
>handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?

Yes
--
Cheers

Peter

Please remove the invalid to reply

>
> Of course the plods are allowed to use two way radios in the car (where
> you have to push to talk each time) even when it is not an emergency, so
> it is literally one rule for them and another for the rest of us.
>
> The average TC will not like being reminded about [t]his hypocracy, and
> may decide to ticket you for something else as well if you do.
>

Anyone can use 2 way radio. However, the new generation of Police "Airwave"
radios, such as this Motorola MTH 800:
http://www.motorola.com/governmentan..._1422i/id_530i

have mobile phone functions (voice, data & SMS) as well as 2 way radio, and
so can only be used with a car kit.

Which is not only fair, but also eminently sensible. I lose count of the
number of to$$ers I see every day in 20k cars who can't afford 80 quid for a
proper kit. 3 points per infringement couldn't have come soon enough. 4
strikes and you're banned. Excellent!

Though I'd agree that even a fine and a driving ban are better than being a
complete to$$er with a Bluetooth set on your ear.........

(And yes, I use fitted kits for both my MTH800 and my w810i)

Mind how you go.............

Jonno wrote:
> QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
> handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?
>
> -----
>
> Am assuming no voice-activated calls: I would have to press the buttons
> on the handset to make a call.

Pressing buttons is fine, as long as the phone is not being held (by a
person, held in a cradle is legal).

jonno@nomail.com declared for all the world to hear...
> QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
> handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?

Yes. And no touching the device to initiate a call.

> Am assuming no voice-activated calls: I would have to press the buttons
> on the handset to make a call.

You'd be very hard done by to get caught doing that.

> I remember a law was passed a few years ago about not driving while
> holding a mobile. And then ISTR it was amended and I beleive it is
> being changed again at the end of Feb.

To introduce stiffer penalties.

> In case there's any confusion on account of PHF, Bluetooth, car kits,
> etc .... by "handsfree" I mean a wire from the phone to an earpiece and
> which looks something like this: http://tinyurl.com/3x57k5

My understanding is that as long as the phone is securely mounted and
you dont have to touch it, you're OK.
--
Regards
Jon

On 20 Feb, 21:06, Jonno <j...@nomail.com> wrote:
> QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
> handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?
>
I received the following advice in an email from a manufacturer of
mobile devices, so they should have a good idea what they are talking
about:

Mobile Phones - new penalties

Introduction

All drivers should be aware of forthcoming changes to the law
contained in the Road Safety Act 2006 (the Act) which seeks to
introduce a wide range of measures aimed at helping to reduce the
number of road casualties. As from 27 February 2007 the Act will
impose tougher penalties on the use of mobile telephones whilst in
control of a vehicle.

The main provisions to be aware of are:

Hand Held Phones

Under the Act the use of a hand held phone whilst driving becomes an
endorseable offence with the £30 penalty introduced in 2003 replaced
by three points added to a driving licence coupled with a fine of £60.
If the matter is contested at trial, the judge has the power to
disqualify the motorist and impose a maximum fine of £1,000, or £2,500
in the case of the driver of a bus, coach or goods vehicle.

Hand Free Phones

The new offences include not having 'proper control' of a vehicle,
which means a driver can be prosecuted if he or she is distracted
while using a hands free mobile phone kit. The same penalties will
apply and this becomes an endorseable offence attracting three penalty
points. It should be remembered that the police now routinely obtain
phone records of drivers involved in serious or fatal accidents.

Employer's Liability

It is an offence to cause or permit either the use of a hand held
phone, or driving without control. Employers should ensure that their
employees are aware of the risks of using mobile phones while driving
and the potential criminal liability. They should ensure that they
have a policy for the use of mobile phones in cars and reconsider any
policies permitting the use of hands free phones by their employees.
The safest telephone usage policy would be to prohibit the use a phone
while driving, avoiding the risk of a health and safety prosecution.
Breach of company policy should be a disciplinary offence and
employers should ensure not only that company policy is being applied,
but also that their employees are aware of the consequences of failure
to do so.

So it would seem that the answer to your question is, "yes it is legal
so long as you are not distracted while using it".

Please note that I am not a lawyer, and am only passing on information
that was passed to me. I hope it is of use.

Regards

Pete Fotheringham

"Pete Fotheringham" <pete.fotheringham@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1172048847.753804.106000@t69g2000cwt.googlegr oups.com...

>It should be remembered that the police now routinely obtain
>phone records of drivers involved in serious or fatal accidents.

How would they do that?
They would need to know the number of the phone and if there is no phone in
the car they can't look it up.

Mind you, the police can practically take your licence off you for one minor
stop.

For example, if I got stopped for speeding today I could get three points
for speeding and three points for each illegal number plate (not displaying
the manufacturers post code) which is a total of nine points. I also have a
faulty rear number plate lamp (its a wiring fault not the bulb). I don't
know if thats worth another three points but you can see my point....

"Jon" <spam@jonparker.plus.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.2046079ce0ee0d8a98a783@text.usenet.plus.n et...
> jonno@nomail.com declared for all the world to hear...
>> QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
>> handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?
>
> Yes. And no touching the device to initiate a call.
>
>> Am assuming no voice-activated calls: I would have to press the buttons
>> on the handset to make a call.
>
> You'd be very hard done by to get caught doing that.
>
>> I remember a law was passed a few years ago about not driving while
>> holding a mobile. And then ISTR it was amended and I beleive it is
>> being changed again at the end of Feb.
>
> To introduce stiffer penalties.
>
>> In case there's any confusion on account of PHF, Bluetooth, car kits,
>> etc .... by "handsfree" I mean a wire from the phone to an earpiece and
>> which looks something like this: http://tinyurl.com/3x57k5
>
> My understanding is that as long as the phone is securely mounted and
> you dont have to touch it, you're OK.
> --
> Regards
> Jon

I think you have to hold the phone (see s.26), so if you have it in a cradle
and press buttons that should be OK.

Jonno wrote:

>QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
>handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?

I've told this in Another Place, but while at home over Christmas, I got
stopped when I was at home, for using a mobile phone while driving.

<c+p>
Copper: "I stopped you because it's illegal to use a phone while
driving:
Me: "Sorry, I forgot: it's not illegal where I live"
Cooper: "Where do you live?"
Me in white-lie mode: "Baghdad".
Copper: "ok. well, it's very dangerous to use a mobile phone while
driving..."
Me: "Umm... don't talk to me about danger, mate, given where I live"
</c+p>

I don't really live there, I just visit from time to time.


--
vulgarandmischevious

Gordon Hudson wrote:
>
> For example, if I got stopped for speeding today I could get three points
> for speeding and three points for each illegal number plate (not displaying
> the manufacturers post code) which is a total of nine points.

The (English or Welsh) manufacturer has to supply the plate with his
postcode on it, but I don't think you commit an offence by removing it.

"Gordon Hudson" <hostroute@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:45dc200c$0$756$5a6aecb4@news.aaisp.net.uk...
>
> "Pete Fotheringham" <pete.fotheringham@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1172048847.753804.106000@t69g2000cwt.googlegr oups.com...
>
>>It should be remembered that the police now routinely obtain
>>phone records of drivers involved in serious or fatal accidents.
>
> How would they do that?
> They would need to know the number of the phone and if there is no phone
> in the car they can't look it up.
>
> Mind you, the police can practically take your licence off you for one
> minor stop.
>
> For example, if I got stopped for speeding today I could get three points
> for speeding

six points or even a ban with a bit of exageration - IME for a following
stop they exagerate about half the time sometimes by 10mph or more.

> and three points for each illegal number plate (not displaying the
> manufacturers post code) which is a total of nine points.

I have a legal number plate purchased (on a car) before this requirement
came in, which has been cherished transfered twice. This does not have its
maker's post code.

> I also have a faulty rear number plate lamp (its a wiring fault not the
> bulb). I don't know if thats worth another three points but you can see my
> point....
>

But in general you are right. If you are rude or they don't like the look
of you* or for some reason think that you are not whiter than white* then
they will turn the car over until they find something (low tyre pressure,
loose seat, dirty number plate, emissions (just blip the throttle) etc.
etc.)


* in the Met' this is often the same thing - "sootys" get a hard time...

In article <1172048847.753804.106000@t69g2000cwt.googlegroups .com>,
Pete Fotheringham <pete.fotheringham@gmail.com> wrote:

> ... the Act will impose tougher penalties on the use of mobile
> telephones whilst in control of a vehicle.


Later on you say "driving". WHat about if, say, you're in the driving
seat in a parked car in a car-park? Or parked at the edge of the road?
Does it matter if the engine is running?

What about in a car in a traffic queue, eg where there's an accident up
ahead and no-one is going anywhere?

What about if the car is parked and you're not in the driver's seat,
but you are still the person in charge of the vehicle? (As for example
people have, I think, been done for drunk in charge when eg asleep on a
back seat.)

What about if you get out of the car - you're still in charge of it?

--
Jeremy C B Nicoll, Edinburgh, Scotland - my opinions are my own.

On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:29:07 +0000, Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk>
wrote:

>Gordon Hudson wrote:
>>
>> For example, if I got stopped for speeding today I could get three points
>> for speeding and three points for each illegal number plate (not displaying
>> the manufacturers post code) which is a total of nine points.
>
> The (English or Welsh) manufacturer has to supply the plate with his
>postcode on it, but I don't think you commit an offence by removing it.

Is that the Manfr of the blank or the shop that puts the letters on .
Is it only in E+W ?

"Jeremy C B Nicoll" <Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4eb8bf00b2Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk...
> In article <1172048847.753804.106000@t69g2000cwt.googlegroups .com>,
> Pete Fotheringham <pete.fotheringham@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> ... the Act will impose tougher penalties on the use of mobile
>> telephones whilst in control of a vehicle.
>
>
> Later on you say "driving". WHat about if, say, you're in the driving
> seat in a parked car in a car-park?

No offence.

> Or parked at the edge of the road?

No offence but.

> Does it matter if the engine is running?

Yes offence if on road and engine running (being driven).

>
> What about in a car in a traffic queue, eg where there's an accident up
> ahead and no-one is going anywhere?

Made representations, but of course these were ignored, so still offence
even if the car is in standing traffic with the hand brake on. Common sense
and this government parted much earlier than all previous administrations.

>
> What about if the car is parked and you're not in the driver's seat,
> but you are still the person in charge of the vehicle? (As for example
> people have, I think, been done for drunk in charge when eg asleep on a
> back seat.)

These only apply to drink driving.

>
> What about if you get out of the car - you're still in charge of it?

No, but you are responsible if it is parked illegally or dangerously, rolls
down a hill, [your car] isn't taxed or insured (on public road) etc.

>
> --
> Jeremy C B Nicoll, Edinburgh, Scotland - my opinions are my own.

"R. Mark Clayton" <nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:J8ednYU3qfRe70HYnZ2dnUVZ8qminZ2d@bt.com...
> "Gordon Hudson" <hostroute@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:45dc200c$0$756$5a6aecb4@news.aaisp.net.uk...
>> "Pete Fotheringham" <pete.fotheringham@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1172048847.753804.106000@t69g2000cwt.googlegr oups.com...
<snip>
>> and three points for each illegal number plate (not displaying the
>> manufacturers post code) which is a total of nine points.
>
> I have a legal number plate purchased (on a car) before this requirement
> came in, which has been cherished transfered twice. This does not have
> its maker's post code.
>
What year did that come in??

Steve Terry

"vulgarandmischevious" <vulgarandmischevious@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uheot2p574lgvvlf8qvhm2tce08rk488fi@4ax.com...
> Jonno wrote:
>
>>QUESTION: Is it legal to drive a car while using a mobile phone if the
>>handset is held in a cradle on the dashboard and I am using a handsfree?
>
> I've told this in Another Place, but while at home over Christmas, I got
> stopped when I was at home, for using a mobile phone while driving.
>
> <c+p>
> Copper: "I stopped you because it's illegal to use a phone while
> driving:
> Me: "Sorry, I forgot: it's not illegal where I live"
> Cooper: "Where do you live?"
> Me in white-lie mode: "Baghdad".
> Copper: "ok. well, it's very dangerous to use a mobile phone while
> driving..."
> Me: "Umm... don't talk to me about danger, mate, given where I live"
> </c+p>
>
> I don't really live there, I just visit from time to time.
>
You aint kidding
http://www.filecabi.net:80/video/hummer-time.html

Steve Terry

> Why wouldn't it be - it's no different to speaking to people in the car!

Actually - it is different - they've done research which suggests that when
you talk into a phone, your other senses tend to dim down and your hearing
sense increases as your brain concentrates on the call. That's why a lot of
people who are on the phone tend to want other people around to be quite
and/or they can't cope with being interupted whilst being on the phone
because their brains can't multitask with a bombardment on their other
senses as well as hearing.

In addition, when travelling and talking to somebody in a car, when there is
a stressful moment, it is common for all the occupants to become quite at
the same time. If you're talking on a mobile phone, the person on the other
end of the line won't understand that you're about to drive into the back of
the car in front and will continue yabbering on whilst the driver will
continue listening up to the point of either just hitting or actually
ramming into the back of the car in front (or whatever obstacale there is in
front of them).

> Operating the buttons on the phone meaning you have to take your eyes off
> the road - as you do for tuning some radios or selecting a cd track -
> might not be acceptable. Most people I know can use a radio or phone and
> drive.

The buttons on a radio are significantly less complex than a mobile phone.
And in the majority of cases, you only need to press one button - on a
mobile phone you could be pressing several to make a call.

> It's only the daft woman type that can't do too many things at once and
> use it as an excuse - people like that can't drive anyway.
>

Actually, woman are significantly better at multitasking than men. Fact.

On Feb 21, 10:56 pm, "Tom Bradbury" <tom.bradb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Why wouldn't it be - it's no different to speaking to people in the car!
>

.. If you're talking on a mobile phone, the person on the other
> end of the line won't understand that you're about to drive into the back of
> the car in front and will continue yabbering on whilst the driver will
> continue listening up to the point of either just hitting or actually
> ramming into the back of the car in front (or whatever obstacale there is in
> front of them).

Actually, it isn't at all difficult to say - hang on, I'm just coming
up to a roundabout, so I'm not really listening for a bit

Stuart B wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:29:07 +0000, Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>>Gordon Hudson wrote:
>>
>>>For example, if I got stopped for speeding today I could get three points
>>>for speeding and three points for each illegal number plate (not displaying
>>>the manufacturers post code) which is a total of nine points.
>>
>> The (English or Welsh) manufacturer has to supply the plate with his
>>postcode on it, but I don't think you commit an offence by removing it.
>
>
> Is that the Manfr of the blank or the shop that puts the letters on .
> Is it only in E+W ?

I couldn't find the regulations, and those details are largely beside
the point[s].It looks like it is being extended to Scotland and NI.

"andy" <andy.ggrps@googlemail.com> wrote in message
news:1172107908.602809.114280@v45g2000cwv.googlegr oups.com
> On Feb 21, 10:56 pm, "Tom Bradbury"
> <tom.bradb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Why wouldn't it be - it's no different to speaking to
> > > people in the car!
> >
>
> . If you're talking on a mobile phone, the person on the
> other
> > end of the line won't understand that you're about to
> > drive into the back of the car in front and will
> > continue yabbering on whilst the driver will continue
> > listening up to the point of either just hitting or
> > actually ramming into the back of the car in front (or
> > whatever obstacale there is in front of them).
>
> Actually, it isn't at all difficult to say - hang on, I'm
> just coming up to a roundabout, so I'm not really
> listening for a bit

I've used amateur radio with hand-held microphones for 25 years and I've
never had even a hint of a problem as a result. I do now actually have a
handsfree microphone on the radio now, but before I did I always used to
make it clear to the person I was talking to that I would drop the mike
without warning if I needed to do so urgently.

Ivor

"R. Mark Clayton" <nospamclayton@btinternet.com> wrote in
message news:r7OdnczaCojO90bYRVnyggA@bt.com

[snip]

> Of course the plods are allowed to use two way radios in
> the car (where you have to push to talk each time) even
> when it is not an emergency, so it is literally one rule
> for them and another for the rest of us.

Any licensed user of 2-way radio is allowed to do so, not just the police.
But you can still get done for driving without due care etc. Which was a
perfectly adequate law to cover phones IMHO but there you go.

Ivor