Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
a particular phone has?
Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone that could do
everything including making the tea (and phoning your lawyer as the
police raided you for changing the imei) would the network know which
physical device had which functionality, and if so how would it know?
Would the network try forwarding a picture message to the first
generation phone and then receive a error flag back saying that the
data is incompatible or wouldn't it even bother sending it in the
first place, turning the message back to the sender or dumping it into
the bit bucket at the network level?
On 19 Nov, 13:09, Mike <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
> a particular phone has?
>
> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone that could do
> everything including making the tea (and phoning your lawyer as the
> police raided you for changing the imei) would the network know which
> physical device had which functionality, and if so how would it know?
>
> Would the network try forwarding a picture message to the first
> generation phone and then receive a error flag back saying that the
> data is incompatible or wouldn't it even bother sending it in the
> first place, turning the message back to the sender or dumping it into
> the bit bucket at the network level?
>
> --
I can't directly answer your question, but I will point out that it is
Illegial in the UK to change an IMEI.
If/when the network discover a change then they will IMMEDIATLY
disconnect you and report you to the authorities.
The IMEI does contain some information about the phone such as
Manafactor, but I'm not certain what else.
On Nov 19, 1:09 pm, Mike <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
> a particular phone has?
>
> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone that could do
> everything including making the tea (and phoning your lawyer as the
> police raided you for changing the imei) would the network know which
> physical device had which functionality, and if so how would it know?
>
> Would the network try forwarding a picture message to the first
> generation phone and then receive a error flag back saying that the
> data is incompatible or wouldn't it even bother sending it in the
> first place, turning the message back to the sender or dumping it into
> the bit bucket at the network level?
>
It's not a "standard" feature of a GSM/3G network, but various
networks have implemented the sort of thing that you're talking about
under the heading of "device management".
Essentially a database mapping phone number to IMEI is set up based on
whenever the IMEI Is authenticated with the network. When the IMEI
associated with a phone number changes, the network can then update
either the handset (in the case of e.g. GPRS settings), or the network
(e.g. the MMSC so it knows how to format MMSs to you - if at all).
The obvious question is whether this is then used to see if you are
e.g. using GPRS on a handset that doesn't support it, or two identical
IMEIs are in use with two different phone numbers in the network
simultaneously. Either could (obviously) be done, but whether a
network bothers is something I have no idea about.
Mike wrote:
> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
> a particular phone has?
>
> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone
Why would you want to swap the IMEI between phones?
> Mike wrote:
>> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
>> a particular phone has?
>>
>> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
>> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
>> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone
>
> Why would you want to swap the IMEI between phones?
Maybe if you had a stolen phone, that was blocked...?
--
Regards,
Chris.
(Remove Elvis's shoes to email me)
On Mon, 19 Nov 2007 06:35:30 -0800 (PST), Waldorf
<waldorf10@hotmail.com> wrote:
>On Nov 19, 1:09 pm, Mike <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
>> a particular phone has?
>>
>> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
>> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
>> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone that could do
>> everything including making the tea (and phoning your lawyer as the
>> police raided you for changing the imei) would the network know which
>> physical device had which functionality, and if so how would it know?
>>
>> Would the network try forwarding a picture message to the first
>> generation phone and then receive a error flag back saying that the
>> data is incompatible or wouldn't it even bother sending it in the
>> first place, turning the message back to the sender or dumping it into
>> the bit bucket at the network level?
>>
>It's not a "standard" feature of a GSM/3G network, but various
>networks have implemented the sort of thing that you're talking about
>under the heading of "device management".
>
>Essentially a database mapping phone number to IMEI is set up based on
>whenever the IMEI Is authenticated with the network. When the IMEI
>associated with a phone number changes, the network can then update
>either the handset (in the case of e.g. GPRS settings), or the network
>(e.g. the MMSC so it knows how to format MMSs to you - if at all).
>
>The obvious question is whether this is then used to see if you are
>e.g. using GPRS on a handset that doesn't support it, or two identical
>IMEIs are in use with two different phone numbers in the network
>simultaneously. Either could (obviously) be done, but whether a
>network bothers is something I have no idea about.
Thanks, I thought that it must be done in such a manner but why it's
not a standard feature of the GSM spec, or a later revision I can't
even begin to get my head around! I guess as long as the network
equipment suppliers implement it in a manner such that the network
operators and customers can use their phones in a transparent manner
then it's not a concern.
To the others that posted about the criminality of changing the imei,
I know that, hence why I said "phoning your lawyer as the police
raided you for changing the imei" in my original posting.
ChrisM wrote:
> In message 5qfpd8Fvrp0vU1@mid.individual.net,
> David Hearn <dave@NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> Proclaimed from the tallest tower:
>
>> Mike wrote:
>>> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function set
>>> a particular phone has?
>>>
>>> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
>>> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
>>> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone
>> Why would you want to swap the IMEI between phones?
>
> Maybe if you had a stolen phone, that was blocked...?
> ChrisM wrote:
>> In message 5qfpd8Fvrp0vU1@mid.individual.net,
>> David Hearn <dave@NOswampieSPAM.org.uk> Proclaimed from the tallest
>> tower:
>>> Mike wrote:
>>>> Does the GSM phone network know, maybe via the imei what function
>>>> set a particular phone has?
>>>>
>>>> Say for instance an ancient GSM Nokia 1100 which could only accept
>>>> standard length sms's and no picture messaging etc. If this phone's
>>>> imei was then directly swapped with a modern phone
>>> Why would you want to swap the IMEI between phones?
>>
>> Maybe if you had a stolen phone, that was blocked...?
>
> Why not just make one up then?
Don't know... are they just a series of random numbers, or is there some
meaning/pattern, or is there any sort of checksum included in the numbers?
If it's anything more than a random series of digits, it's probably easier
to copy an existing one than try and make up a valid new one...???
--
Regards,
Chris.
(Remove Elvis's shoes to email me)
chris_mayersblue@suedeyahoo.com declared for all the world to hear...
> Don't know... are they just a series of random numbers, or is there some
> meaning/pattern, or is there any sort of checksum included in the numbers?
They are not random, and they do have a checksum.
> If it's anything more than a random series of digits, it's probably easier
> to copy an existing one than try and make up a valid new one...???
The first 6 digits will identify the phone, so a professional thief will
want to get that right.
--
Regards
Jon
On Wed, 21 Nov 2007 15:27:49 -0000, Jon <spam@jonparker.plus.com>
wrote:
>chris_mayersblue@suedeyahoo.com declared for all the world to hear...
>> Don't know... are they just a series of random numbers, or is there some
>> meaning/pattern, or is there any sort of checksum included in the numbers?
>
>They are not random, and they do have a checksum.
>
>> If it's anything more than a random series of digits, it's probably easier
>> to copy an existing one than try and make up a valid new one...???
>
>The first 6 digits will identify the phone, so a professional thief will
>want to get that right.
After doing a bit of digging I found a site that claims to "decode"
the imei.
chris_mayersblue@suedeyahoo.com declared for all the world to hear...
> >
> > The first 6 digits will identify the phone, so a professional thief
> > will want to get that right.
>
> Identify as in make and model?
Yes.
From memory:
1st 6 digits = TAC - Type Approval Code
digits 7 and 8: factory code
digits 9 to 14: final assembly code
digit 15: checksum
--
Regards
Jon
Phone functionality / visibility to network 
Linear Mode
