I know everybody spits on Skype, but I'm one of the clueless
masses and it works for me.... sort of.
I've been using one of these things http://tinyurl.com/3wbtuv
connected to a PC via USB and to my home phone system and POTS
via a couple of RJ11 ports.
We use it strictly for outgoing toll calls (Skype rate 2.3
cents/minute USD). Everything else is done on POTS.
You prefix a number with "**" and suffix it with "#" to invoke
Skype, otherwise everything is goes through POTS.
"Sort Of.." because there are a couple of gotchas:
- A PC has tb running 24-7 or whatever window you want
outgoing long distance service.
- It works via a little "Skype Helper" utility that mediates
between the phone system and the regular Skype PC application,
which gets flaky sometimes.
A standalone device with the same functionality that had it's own
Skype client in the firmware would seem tb a relatively
trouble-free and cheap alternative. Maybe an HTML interface for
setup....
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.invalid> wrote:
> I know everybody spits on Skype, but I'm one of the clueless
> masses and it works for me.... sort of.
>
> I've been using one of these things http://tinyurl.com/3wbtuv
> connected to a PC via USB and to my home phone system and POTS
> via a couple of RJ11 ports.
>
> We use it strictly for outgoing toll calls (Skype rate 2.3
> cents/minute USD). Everything else is done on POTS.
So always for SkypeOut, and never for Skype to Skype calls? Do you really
need to use Skype for this, or you just want a phone that makes internet
calls? I say this because you might want to consider a SIP ATA anyway:
they're usually cheaper to buy, and if you select the right VSP the calls
are usually cheaper too. If you buy a Skype box you're at the mercy of any
future Skype price rises, while with SIP you can jump ship to another SIP
provider.
Skype has merits if you're calling other people on Skype, or your network is
difficult (eg complex NAT problems) but it doesn't sound like either of
those apply.
> A standalone device with the same functionality that had it's own
> Skype client in the firmware would seem tb a relatively
> trouble-free and cheap alternative. Maybe an HTML interface for
> setup....
When I was looking for a Skype wifi phone I can to the conclusion that a
bottom-of-the-range smartphone running a Skype app was a better bet than a
dedicated unit, and the prices are comparable. The UI is much better on a
phone too, and it can also make (GSM) calls when you're out of wifi range.
And again you're aren't locked in to Skype for this - just install a SIP app
if you choose to use SIP instead.
Obviously that doesn't work if you want to wire all the home phones into it.
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.Invalid> wrote in message news:s6v3l6l8hr7h44d0s3b72gtub7lb80phd5@4ax.com...
>I know everybody spits on Skype, but I'm one of the clueless
> masses and it works for me.... sort of.
>
> I've been using one of these things http://tinyurl.com/3wbtuv
> connected to a PC via USB and to my home phone system and POTS
> via a couple of RJ11 ports.
>
> We use it strictly for outgoing toll calls (Skype rate 2.3
> cents/minute USD). Everything else is done on POTS.
>
> You prefix a number with "**" and suffix it with "#" to invoke
> Skype, otherwise everything is goes through POTS.
>
> "Sort Of.." because there are a couple of gotchas:
>
> - A PC has tb running 24-7 or whatever window you want
> outgoing long distance service.
>
> - It works via a little "Skype Helper" utility that mediates
> between the phone system and the regular Skype PC application,
> which gets flaky sometimes.
>
> A standalone device with the same functionality that had it's own
> Skype client in the firmware would seem tb a relatively
> trouble-free and cheap alternative. Maybe an HTML interface for
> setup....
>
> I've spent quite a bit of time looking, but nada.
>
> Anybody heard of such a thing?
> --
> PeteCresswell
Skype does have its uses, but making Skype out calls from a fixed location is not
one of them IMHO
The open, generic form of VoIP is called SIP, I think you would be better to ditch Skype
and buy a SIP device eg. one from the Grandstream or Sipura brands.
Basically you can go two ways with this, you can opt for a dedicated IP desk phone
that plugs into your router, or, you can get an ATA (analog telephone adaptor) which also
plugs into your network, and you also plug a regular POTS phone into it .
The latter option is more suited to a domestic environment IMHO because you can
use your existing DECT phones and the better ATAs have an FXO port to connect
to your POTS line so you can use a common handset like you do now.
As for a SIP service provider, have a look at sipgate.com it's tailored for the US market
with an enhanced 911 service and lots of features, and I can vouch that their European
equivelent has been very reliable.
Per Theo Markettos:
>So always for SkypeOut, and never for Skype to Skype calls? Do you really
>need to use Skype for this, or you just want a phone that makes internet
>calls? I say this because you might want to consider a SIP ATA anyway:
>they're usually cheaper to buy, and if you select the right VSP the calls
>are usually cheaper too. If you buy a Skype box you're at the mercy of any
>future Skype price rises, while with SIP you can jump ship to another SIP
>provider.
>
>Skype has merits if you're calling other people on Skype, or your network is
>difficult (eg complex NAT problems) but it doesn't sound like either of
>those apply.
That sounds perfectly logical to me - especially the part about
jumping ship when things become unsatisfactory or a better
alternative emerges.
You nailed it about almost never calling anybody that is on
Skype. Mostly land line phones in Germany/UK and supposedly
"local" calls where the per-minute charges are high.
I have not investigated SIP ATA. In fact, all I know is that
there's "Skype" and "SIP" - different protocols - and Skype's
reputation for reliability is not the best.
Aside from acronym shock, what had kept me from investigating
further were threads alluding to SIP providers not being
world-wide enough compared to Skype. i.e. when calling a number
via one's SIP provider, the other end may or may not be
reachable.
Is that a valid point, or have I misunderstood?
From context, I can dope out that "SIP ATA" is a device that
adapts analog telephones to VOIP/SIP.
If that is the case, I guess I am looking for:
1) A SIP ATA adapter that:
* Allows a regular analog phone to dial out via POTS or VOIP
depending on something-or-another... maybe a wrapper around
the number tb dialed (e.g. 601-123-4567 would be dialed POTS
and **610-123-4567# would be dialed VOIP/SIP.
* Allows incoming calls over POTS transparently: i.e. the
phone just rings, the user answers...
2) A SIP provider that can place calls to the areas frequently
called - or, preferably, almost any place in the world.
--
PeteCresswell
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.Invalid> wrote in message
news:5kf5l6hgqfecoug0sulamuuh77ubpdlneh@4ax.com...
>
> If that is the case, I guess I am looking for:
>
> 1) A SIP ATA adapter that:
> * Allows a regular analog phone to dial out via POTS or VOIP
> depending on something-or-another... maybe a wrapper around
> the number tb dialed (e.g. 601-123-4567 would be dialed POTS
> and **610-123-4567# would be dialed VOIP/SIP.
>
> * Allows incoming calls over POTS transparently: i.e. the
> phone just rings, the user answers...
>
>
> 2) A SIP provider that can place calls to the areas frequently
> called - or, preferably, almost any place in the world.
In message <5kf5l6hgqfecoug0sulamuuh77ubpdlneh@4ax.com>,
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.Invalid> writes
>Per Theo Markettos:
>>So always for SkypeOut, and never for Skype to Skype calls? Do you really
>>need to use Skype for this, or you just want a phone that makes internet
>>calls? I say this because you might want to consider a SIP ATA anyway:
>>they're usually cheaper to buy, and if you select the right VSP the calls
>>are usually cheaper too. If you buy a Skype box you're at the mercy of any
>>future Skype price rises, while with SIP you can jump ship to another SIP
>>provider.
>>
>>Skype has merits if you're calling other people on Skype, or your network is
>>difficult (eg complex NAT problems) but it doesn't sound like either of
>>those apply.
>
>That sounds perfectly logical to me - especially the part about
>jumping ship when things become unsatisfactory or a better
>alternative emerges.
>
>You nailed it about almost never calling anybody that is on
>Skype. Mostly land line phones in Germany/UK and supposedly
>"local" calls where the per-minute charges are high.
>
With many SIP providers calls to Germany and France and Italy and the
USA etc. are free, as are UK geographic numbers. For example
justvoip.com give 120 days of free calls when you top up your account
with 10 euros, charges for the calls which aren't free (eg 0871, UK
mobiles etc) get deducted from the 10 euros until you need to top up
again.
>I have not investigated SIP ATA. In fact, all I know is that
>there's "Skype" and "SIP" - different protocols - and Skype's
>reputation for reliability is not the best.
>
>Aside from acronym shock, what had kept me from investigating
>further were threads alluding to SIP providers not being
>world-wide enough compared to Skype. i.e. when calling a number
>via one's SIP provider, the other end may or may not be
>reachable.
>
>Is that a valid point, or have I misunderstood?
A huge misunderstanding :-)
>From context, I can dope out that "SIP ATA" is a device that
>adapts analog telephones to VOIP/SIP.
>
>
>If that is the case, I guess I am looking for:
>
>1) A SIP ATA adapter that:
> * Allows a regular analog phone to dial out via POTS or VOIP
> depending on something-or-another... maybe a wrapper around
> the number tb dialed (e.g. 601-123-4567 would be dialed POTS
> and **610-123-4567# would be dialed VOIP/SIP.
>
> * Allows incoming calls over POTS transparently: i.e. the
> phone just rings, the user answers...
"The Fritz!Box Fon WLAN 7170 includes an integrated ADSL modem, a
full-featured router, 4 Lan ports, 1 ISDN port, 2 phone ports for VoIP
and a fully functional PSTN port (analogue/ISDN)."
"With the FRITZ!Box Fon 7170 calling over the Internet is finally very
easy, the way it should be: attach your existing phone, lift the
handset, call! You can call with Voice over IP through the Internet
without switching on your PC. Also you can use your existing phone with
the Fritz!box: calls are passed to and from the integrated telephones
ports."
I've plugged cordless phones into each of the 'phone points - I've got
two voip numbers plus the BT number so 3 calls can be in progress at any
one time! If you've kids you can give them their own line! Or put a fax
machine on the second VOIP port.
The other great thing about the Fritzbox! is the ability to set dialling
rules which determine which carrier the outgoing calls are made through
eg if I dial 1471 or 1571 the call is routed through BT, 01 or 02 and it
goes via a SIP provider, 0845 or 0870 uses the BT line but routes via
18185.
Our call costs for a very busy household are now negligible.
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.invalid> wrote:
> Aside from acronym shock, what had kept me from investigating
> further were threads alluding to SIP providers not being
> world-wide enough compared to Skype. i.e. when calling a number
> via one's SIP provider, the other end may or may not be
> reachable.
>
> Is that a valid point, or have I misunderstood?
There's a small degree of validity on that point... VOIP providers aren't
necessarily good at calling 'awkward' numbers (like premium rate numbers,
either in the UK or other countries). Some numbers, however, may be
callable but not listed on the published price lists (for example, I
discovered that 18185 via a landline doesn't list a price to UK 056 numbers,
but they're callable at the same price as a geo number)
However, you'll probably find many telcos of whatever persuasion struggle
with such numbers - I don't think Skype is any better in this respect. For
this group of numbers, making up (plucks figure from the air) 0.1% of the
total, only a BT line will do (and prepare yourself for the bill when it
comes).
But in general all destinations should be reachable, just look at the price
lists, from French Antarctic Territory to Guantanamo Bay. Some more
obscure places may advertise routes but have capacity/quality issues - for
the out-of-the-way African destinations I call, these used to be a problem
but aren't any more.
> 2) A SIP provider that can place calls to the areas frequently
> called - or, preferably, almost any place in the world.
There are roughly two sorts of VSP out there:
A package provider, like Sipgate, Vonage, Gradwell or various
voip[something].co.uk. They give you an incoming number, and are set up to
be a BT line replacement with all the usual services (voicemail, diverts,
fax2email, etc etc). If you want something easy to set up, this is the way
to go. With the exception of Sipgate, usually this involves paying a
monthly fee.
A calls provider, which are usually a brand of Betamax or Dellmont
(effectively the same company). The calls are the cheapest you'll find, but
they aren't really intended for incoming calls. The emphasis is on cost (ie
almost no customer service, some slightly faffy ways to do topups) but they
work (mostly). There are dozens of brands and they change the prices on
each regularly, so for the best deals be prepared to switch brand when your
next topup becomes due.
So it depends whether you're prepared to put in a (small) bit of work to get
the absolute cheapest calls. Even if you don't, they'll still be miles
cheaper than BT.
Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> > 2) A SIP provider that can place calls to the areas frequently
> > called - or, preferably, almost any place in the world.
One other thing to add... you don't need SIP hardware to make SIP calls. So
you can get yourself a SIP softphone (I like X-lite v2 on Windows, Twinkle
on Linux, but there are loads more), and then sign up with a SIP provider
(many allow free test calls). Once you're happy, then you can buy an ATA.
Allows you to try it without spending on hardware.
Per Graham.:
>Basically you can go two ways with this, you can opt for a dedicated IP desk phone
>that plugs into your router, or, you can get an ATA (analog telephone adaptor) which also
>plugs into your network, and you also plug a regular POTS phone into it .
>The latter option is more suited to a domestic environment IMHO because you can
>use your existing DECT phones and the better ATAs have an FXO port to connect
>to your POTS line so you can use a common handset like you do now.
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.invalid> wrote:
> Per (PeteCresswell):
> >I'm thinking one of these: http://tinyurl.com/4r373uu
> >or one of these: http://tinyurl.com/65wwp3
>
> Oops, scratch that second one (the LinkSys).... wrong model, no
> FX0 port.
If you go for an SPA-3102 it has one. The config interface is quite
complex, but very flexible. You can have up to 4 VSPs configured, plus the
PSTN line. And you can configure the dialplan, eg 0800 goes to BT, 01 goes
to VSP#1, 07 goes to VSP#2, 0033 goes to VSP#3, other 00 goes to VSP#4, etc.
Or #0 gives you a BT dialtone, #1<number> sends the call via VSP#1,
whatever you like.
There are some simple config guides around - I've posted links to them here
in the past.
Per Theo Markettos:
>If you go for an SPA-3102 it has one. The config interface is quite
>complex, but very flexible.
That's what is currently dawning on me.... Sounds like
"DialPlan" is the key concept.... I can define any prefix I want
and that will force the outgoing number to POTS.
e.g.
1610-676-3394 goes to POTS
610-676-3394 goes to VOIP.
>
>There are some simple config guides around - I've posted links to them here
>in the past.
I'm starting to stumble on them.
Will probably spring for the SPA-3102 if for no other reason that
it appeals to my inner wannabe-geek.
--
PeteCresswell
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.Invalid> wrote in message
news:mh46l696e6g32719teqistqphbngk2dnh6@4ax.com...
> Per Theo Markettos:
>>If you go for an SPA-3102 it has one. The config interface is
>>quite
>>complex, but very flexible.
>
> That's what is currently dawning on me.... Sounds like
> "DialPlan" is the key concept.... I can define any prefix I
> want
> and that will force the outgoing number to POTS.
>
> e.g.
>
> 1610-676-3394 goes to POTS
>
> 610-676-3394 goes to VOIP.
>
>>
>>There are some simple config guides around - I've posted links
>>to them here
>>in the past.
>
> I'm starting to stumble on them.
>
> Will probably spring for the SPA-3102 if for no other reason
> that
> it appeals to my inner wannabe-geek.
> --
> PeteCresswell
Look on the Sipgate site - they used to list basic configs for
many ATAs. The SPA3102 used to be branded Sipura before LinkSys
bought them and were subsequently bought themselves by Cisco.
Theo Markettos wrote:
> "(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.invalid> wrote:
<snip>
> When I was looking for a Skype wifi phone I can to the conclusion
> that a bottom-of-the-range smartphone running a Skype app was a
> better bet than a dedicated unit, and the prices are comparable. The
> UI is much better on a phone too, and it can also make (GSM) calls
> when you're out of wifi range. And again you're aren't locked in to
> Skype for this - just install a SIP app if you choose to use SIP
> instead.
> Obviously that doesn't work if you want to wire all the home phones
> into it.
> Theo
>
>
PAYG Three's Skype through their own free node is unbeatable.
No need to top up ever
Standalone Skype Adapter? 
Linear Mode
